I'm going to start taking gear, but I've no idea where to start.
Some background info -
I struggle to put on weight. I do a heavy compound lifting routine (Ice Cream Fitness) three times a week. My squat is at 70kg, deadlift at 110lg, bench at 45kg (skinny arms fuck me up).
I eat OK, but my appetite is shit. I always feel sick.
UK fag, so no issue with legality. Illegal to buy, but not posses. I don't give a fuck anyway.
My issue is knowing what to start with, and where to get them from.
I've been doing a lot of reading, but it's just a minefield.
So I'm looking for help and suggestions.
I am hoping this is a joke. You are no where near dedicated enough to even begin to think about taking steroids. Steroids are not going to help you if you can not even eat or lift properly.
It doesn't sound like you're serious about lifting or diet, so I doubt roids are going to do much more than fuck your body up and shrink your balls.
I've decided that this must be b8 do I'm not going to continue scolding you. Either way you are stupid fuck off
On and off, about a year. Properly, about 3 months.
If this isn't something I should do now, it's something I plan to do at some point.
BTW - I'm not thinking of going on some mental stack to start with. Just something basic and simple for a cycle, just to see how it goes.
Not bait, and yes, when it comes to gear, I am stupid, like I say, I don't know much about this at all.
I've Googled the basics of beginner cycles, and I understand what is being said.
My issue is trusting what is said on a site that might just be full of shit, given this is isn't exactly legal in a lot of the world, and is seen as taboo.
I'm just asking for some advice, I'm not asking you to supply me.
If you say I'm stupid and it won't do me any good, fine. If that's the general consensus. so be it.
Steroids can increase your diet.
You should probably wait a little but not for the reasons others are giving.
If you wait, you'll find out what works for YOU and this is really big. The reason why you haven't had significant progress if because you haven't found the training style/method of periodization that is optimal for your needs.
Once you find something where you are consistently getting stronger, leaner, or what have you, then you can entertain the idea of using an exogenous performance enhancing substance.
Even if you're DEAD set on using steroids, the other alternative I'd suggest to you would be a SARM (a selective androgen receptor modulator).
I'm also aware, that (particularly among Americans) there is an attitude that taking gear is "cheating" and people resent someone just trying to take the easy option.
So I'm trying to filter out that too.
OK, now this makes sense.
So you're saying I need to have at least made some significant progress before I even consider it.
Fair enough, I accept that.
I'm not exactly being lazy here - I do a proper program at the recommended frequency, add weight every time when possible, and try to eat as much and as cleanly as I can.
I'm not some kid who's never even lifted a bar who wants to jump straight on gear.
>My issue is trusting what is said on a site that might just be full of shit
>I'm just asking for some advice
why would 4 chan (anime forum) seem more real than other sites?
why even ask for advise if u won't believe anything?
stop being a lazy fuck and do ur research
Because this is a general site where actual people post stuff. /fit/ is much better than /b/ in that respect. Yes I know there are trolls, but this board is full of people giving good advice on all sorts of fitness shit.
I am using other sites too.
What I mean by sites that might be full of shit, is sites that are just adverts for selling knock-off gear, and there are plenty about.
At least on here I know a person interested in fitness is most likely responding to my specific question, not some Nigerian trying to sell me counterfeit gear.
So you've been doing retarded shit on and off for a year and actually following a routine for 3 months. You do realize that a year in the gym is nothing, right? And you want to take gear now? Please do, I hope you die of a cardiac arrest before you can breed because you're a lazy faggot and a moron.
Lol are you retarded?
Most hormonal analogues of testosterone work by stimulating the adrenal cortex in the kidney. This,, as a result, stimulates various corticosteriod which, after a series of events, make you hungry.
Steroids absolutely can affect your appetite.
The people who get the most mad at younger people wanting to get on steroids are the same individuals who'll never have the balls to do so.
Or... have considered it, but never have had the courage to take that step.
In all reality, if he goes on steroids this early and did it correctly, there shouldn't be any significant concerns regarding his health in the near future. However if he did so INCORRECTLY (which should be the concern of the forum posters here, but is not), he still would not caused any significant non-reversible damage to his hormonal/endocrine system.
Sounds like you're a typical Yank who can't stand the thought of someone taking the easy route.
Steroids must fucking work, or why the fuck would people use them?
Yes, I know a year in the gym is nothing, but a year from now, I'm bound to have made a hell of a lot more progress taking gear than doing in naturally.
It seems so many young guys nowadays are taking steroids. Most of these kids don't get buff naturally.
I'm not saying I expect to change overnight. I know there's a lot of hard work involved.
Plus, the effects of steroids on your heart can be easily mitigated, and are very fucking rare anyway. Jesus dude, I'm meant to be the moron who hasn't done his research here, but it seems I know more than you.
>wants to do roids
i hope this is bait
This is exactly what I've been reading. So thank you.
My issue is the line between "correctly" and "incorrectly" is blurred because aside from knowledge about cycling, PCT, etc. the illegal nature of steroid sales means I don't know what the fuck I'm getting.
It really seems like something a doctor should be administering, but because of the law, it makes you feel like a junkie.
Lol. Except I know far more about the endocrine system than you'll ever know.
So instead of giving advice on the prescription of various wive's tales about how bad steroids are, I actually understand how they affect one's body.
There's so much information and misinformation out there. If you're serious about usage, I advise you to get into close contact with a GP and ask them to monitor your bloodwork/lipid panels while you're on.
OK. Will do. I'm happy to take this advice if this is the general consensus.
So answer me this -
1. How much should I be squatting/benching/deadlifting before I'm "worthy" of using gear?
2. How long should I have been lifting properly?
3. How can increase my appetite and stimulate muscle growth in the same way (or as close to) steroids do if I'm not yet worthy enough to take them?
Yeah, I have a good GP and plan on getting regular liver function tests to make sure I'm not doing any damage.
Hey, seems I know more than I thought. No wonder so many people on here are butthurt.
Don't listen to these braniacs.
The best advice I can give you is to
1) Get to a level where progression is hard. Meaning it's difficult to add weight to the bar on a week to week basis. Get to a psychological level where you know that lifting weights is a commitment that you'll maintain for the next 10, 20, or even 30 years.
As far as the last question, you can't lol.
2bh f a m.
you need to perfect your form and AT LEAST reach the 1/2/3/4 benchmark before even considering roids. depending on the person this takes anywhere from 1-2 yrs.
if you start roiding now, your muscular strength will explode. sounds good right? but your tendons/ligaments wont be strong enough to handle the weight and you will snap some shit up. and once you do that you will immediately deflate and probably look worse than you do now.
so pls anon, this is not a race. get strong/aesthetic natty first then consider gear.
btw, if you didnt know 1/2/3/4 refers to 1 plate ohp, 2 plate bench, 3 plate squat, 4 plate deadlift. and even that is nothing special, i would say 1.5+/2.5+/4/5 is an even better strength base for roids and in general
>personally, I'd say at least 2plate bench/3plate squat/4plate deadlift
>again personally, 2 years
>eat more - seriously, until you're feeling sick, wait until you feel slightly better and go at it again, all day
The point I'm trying to make is that you should be sure the whole gym thing isn't some sort of phase that'll maybe last another year, after which you may or may not quit. Build dedication. So that, if you eventually do go ahead with your cycle, you've had plenty of time to read up, be prepared, you'll continue lifting afterwards, and it won't go to waste. Make it count.
Thank you both. That doesn't seem unachievable.
ICF is largely a strength building routine anyway, that's why I do it. Did do Stronglifts but wanted something with a bit more accessory work. The squat/bench/DL/OHP/BOR are my main focus though. ICF includes stuff like bicep curls, but I don't go mad on them.
So I hope you guys realise, I am taking this seriously.
There are PLENTY of kids out there who just go on gear without having a fucking clue. At least I'm asking questions first.
Question, and this is off-topic - but this a US thing right?
You guys have sports hammered into your skulls from a very young age, so you're conditioned to think using gear is "wrong" and "cheating".
Well you know what, life isn't like that. Most of the most successful and happy people in life took shortcuts.
Using gear doesn't harm anyone. So fuck you.
Well you've certainly helped me, so thanks for stopping by.
What I've learned today -
Taking gear works, as expected, but until I can lift a lot more weight, I'll just fuck myself up. So I need to get myself to some respectable figures, which might take a year or two of solid gym work, then see where I'm at.
Now I just need to know what to start taking, and where the fuck to buy it from. I know I've got some time here, but I'd rather know now.
Two cars are in first gear.
One has normal fuel, the other has a NOS kit.
The one with NOS will reach a higher speed, and go through the gears more quickly, than the one which just uses normal fuel.
Get the fucking picture?
>Sounds like you're a typical Yank who can't stand the thought of someone taking the easy route.
Yes that's it. I'm a hater. Decry me because I don't agree with your stupid ideas. I just don't understand, right? I'm just jealous of those easy gains you're gonna make.
Back in reality, there are long term repercussions of steroids abuse. You sound like a child not ready to think long and hard about those. You reek of insecure baby wanting to get big. I've seriously considered taking gear and might in the future, but I'm also in my late 20's. Do what the fuck you want faggot, just get ready for all the fun you're going to have as an actual adult male because your stupid ass is going to cut corner, follow advice from other idiots on 4chan, and buy shady pharmaceuticals from some retarded chav in a stringer.
Oh this is gonna be good. Hey, I took some Bio classes in college too. I gave myself a name on an anonymous image board to reflect my self proclaimed expertise.
>Nos car is a Honda Civic 1.5L of displacement with paper thin stock internals that blows a rod out of the fucking block and fish tails into a barrier before it reaches 1/8 of a mile
>properly built engine blows straight past it
More proper analogy for you
Of course steroids will help. Just because you don't eat well or train well they still have an effect on your body.
Just because it's not optimized doesn't mean it doesn't do anything.
I don't think you should take steroids. You seem to immature for it. BUT, if you're hell bent on taking steroids and if you want to maximize your appetite then I recommend the following as a first cycle:
250mg of testosterone enanthate or cyponiate per week
250mg Equipoise (Boldenone) per week
Take it for three to four months and then do a proper post cycle treatment.
You can mix them in the same syringe.
Read up on injection techniques and PCT. And read up on the sides (I'm guessing the only ones you would get from my suggested cycle is acne and mild bloating).
And naturally, make sure you're training and diet is sufficient. It doesn't need to be perfect. Just make sure it's good.
>using NOS as an reason why it's better to use steroids
hahahaha oh god I wish more people from /o/ where here to laugh at you. Enjoy your manifold danger.
Yeah bruh, everyone knows steroids don't work unless you can bench 2pl8
How the fuck is me considering taking gear any fucking different from you considering it.
1. I'm doing a proper lifting routine.
2. I'm making decent progress for someone so skinny.
3. I'm eating as properly and cleanly as I can.
Just because I'm skinny and have only lifting properly for 3 months, doesn't make me any different from you.
I *am* thinking about the long term repercussions and trying to make sure I *don't* buy from a "retarded chav" because I know there are plenty about.
So it seems you're the fucking idiot for not properly reading what I've written.
I could be like some retarded 19 year old who just buys dodgy gear of his mate, but I'm trying to do this as legitimately and safely as possible.
Fair point. But why do I seem too immature for it?
I'm not just jacking up on any old shit like plenty of fucking morons do. I'm trying to seek proper advice from a wide range of sources.
If you're so fucking stupid and lazy that you need to ask complete strangers on a Mongolian basket weaving website where and how to take steroids after half-assedly lifting for two months you shouldn't be taking steroids.
>my issue is knowing what to start with and where to get them
No OP, your issue is being a manchild who wants easy, immediate results from a pursuit meant to take dedication, discipline, and time. Eat shit.
>Just because I'm skinny and have only lifting properly for 3 months, doesn't make me any different from you.
People who roid think it's really cool so they act like it's a way bigger deal than it is.
The truth is that you don't have to lift x lbs in x compound exercise. You don't have to have x inch arms.
What you really need is maturity, and you have to be honest with your self. Do you really have the maturity to inject oil into your muscles with the full knowledge that it will fuck with your own hormone system? If yes? Go for it.
I would advice you wait until you're 22 but I'm guessing you don't want to wait.
Do the following >>35580892
I do not want easy, immediate results.
If you'd read the fucking thread you moron you'd know I'm willing to put in serious work at the gym, and I'm not exactly fucking around even now.
Thousands of people take steroids and see their strength, endurance, power, appetite, etc, all increase. That's why they fucking take them.
Like I keep saying, I'm not going to become one of the many idiots who abuse them. I'm trying to find out everything I can about them first.
If you've only been lifting for 3 months, you're not even lifting properly. Your CNS hasn't adjusted to the types of movements. You need to learn how to do this shit properly before you start doing shit like riods.
More than that, you're not mentally ready. You're impatient and undisciplined. You don't have the discipline to stick to a working diet, so you want to use roids to compensate for your inability to eat right? This shit's on a level you're not mature enough for. Everything you've said in this thread is proof of that.
I like how you've assumed I'm a kid. Yes, I'm new to this whole thing so I get why it seems that way.
I'm 25, with a good income. I eat well, I look after myself. I'm merely looking into the world of taking gear to put some mass on.
Like I *keep* saying, if I was a dumb kid, I'd just get any old shit online and fuck myself up. Why would I bother engage with you guys?
>But why do I seem too immature for it?
Read your response above this one retard. 3 fucking months of lifting and you start crying about how it's not working and you want to take gear. You're a fucking baby and you're crying because I don't give a fuck enough to read you're shitty reasoning as to why you need gear. Take it faggot, and come tell us about your heart and liver problems after you fuck it up. Triple dose some DNP while you're at it.
Well, once again, if you'd read the thread, you'd know I've already accepted the advice of those who said I should hit real numbers on my basic lifts (350lbs squat, 450 DL, 275 bench, etc) and accept this may take a year or two.
To do this, I'm doing a proper heavy lifting routine.
What part of that is impatient or undisciplined?
And I know my diet isn't perfect, but it's better than a lot of guys who lift. I cook decent shit for myself, watch my calories, use the basic supplements, drink plenty of water, get proper sleep, etc.
I'm not looking to compensate for not eating right, I'm looking to compensate for not eating *enough*.
Probably one of the best laughs I'd had in a while. I can literally picture some skinny DYEL faggot getting ass mad that we aren't encouraging his faggotry.
>I'm 25, with a good income.
Well then. I just figured you were younger. Then your age isn't a problem. And you're income isn't an issue. 250mg test and 250 mg EQ per week doesn't cost much.
Only problem I see here is your attitude. Steroids have a tendency to enforce your mental attributes, which is why some people are totally unfit for steroids. Me, I'm very stoic and meticulous and steroids have made me even more so. Had people confess to me while they are drunk that they are afraid to speak to me because I seem so closed of.
If you're arrogant you'll become more so, if your social you'll become more so. If you're impatient or impulsive you'll become more so. And so forth.
From you're writing I'm guessing you'll become very obnoxious when you jump on the roid train. You're overtly defensive and seem very insecure about your self.
You have very little experience training and seem to act like you cant understand why people criticize you for wanting to do steroids. The best trait one could have before gearing is humility, and you seem to have none.
No, I've taken plenty of advice from people on here. Read the fucking thread faggot.
I got annoyed because people expected I was some faggot 17 year old kid, fucking around on a bro-science routine and living on fast-food and shit my mum makes, whereas actually I'm doing everything I need to do and should be doing to gain mass.
Tell me, if your mind can cope with this - what exactly am I doing wrong?
I'm doing a proper heavy compound lifting routine, 3-4 times a week, working on getting to "proper" figures eating well, resting well and planning on doing gear at some point, properly, and trying to mitigate all the risks.
What is wrong with that?
I've taken and listened to plenty of advice in this thread, I've changed my mind on plenty of things, I've thanked those who helped.
I've also argued with some butthurt faggots who grew up having their head dragged across a handegg field while some pedo "teacher" looked them up and down in the showers and told them they'd never achieve the American Dream if they take a shortcut in life. Well fuck you. I'm not bothered. This is 4chan, we're meant to be faggots to each other.
Well this is good advice, so thank you.
See >>35581312 cause this answers some of the questions you asked.
I'm acting like a total asshole on here because, well, it's 4chan.
I've been fully open to the fact I'm a fucking moron who doesn't know what he's talking about. I'm learning about something new here, that's the point.
I have enough humility to know I'm just one of thousands of guys who thinks about taking gear. I'm no more important, special, or different than anyone else. I'm just trying to educate myself, and have fun winding up some of 4chan's finest at the same time. Job done on both accounts.
One of the best sources on Steroids.
Good luck on your endeavours. Taking steroids has been a blessing to me and I hope it will be a blessing to you too.
Go with Zyzz, child.
Those numbers are way too fucking high, most people won't ever achieve those natty. I'd say just be a dedicated lifter for 2+ years, have an extremely good diet and understanding of it, and be absolutely sure you know everything you need to know about your roid of choice.
Not some arbitrary number that you just decided.
Ok OP i started roiding when I was had a 60kg total bench and had been in the gym all of six months. Best thing I ever did. It makes no difference what you look like when you start. They arent going to be better for you just because you're already jacked. Cancer patients fed oxymetholone dont suffer worse from the drug just because theyre not jacked. The body cant tell the difference and new mass is gonna come in faster no matter what you look like.
250mg test. Thats gonna be your baseline. Never come off. Cycling has no medical basis except for those who want children.
Run test at 500mg a couple months.
10mg exemestane every day to protect against gyno.
Finasteride if you start to go bald. You probably wont though.
Feel free to experiment with what additional steroids you want. Tren is good, but has unpleasant sides.
Anadrol is great for mass, but you should run TUDCA with orals. Orals can be ran longer than the internet tells you - they are all spooked for no reason. Just avoid alcohol.
Dianabol is a good starter oral - I recommend that before anadrol.
Google EVERYTHING and place scientific studies before bodybuilding forums when considering credibility.
Honestly dont be afraid. The gym culture and bodybuilding scene has created this big stigma of anabolics.. they really arent worse for a dyel than a muscle man. Who needs faster muscle more than a skinny kid anyway? Make your dad proud anon.
kek you can literally take roids from day 1 and in a few weeks blow most of these fags out of the water, why do you think they don't want you to use. Seriously it's because they have been doing ss for 2 years and look like shit and can't stand the thought of some lazy fuck lifting for 12-16weeks eating shit and absolutely destroying them.
but go ahead man do "the right thing" steroids are for cheaters anyways right?
Thanks for the viewpoints.
I'd say taking 250mg of test and not cycling seems like a bad idea.
Something I forgot to ask EVERYONE posting,is what their experience is.
Are the guys saying "you're a fucking idiot for considering this", speaking from experience? Have they or their friends been in a similar situation, taken gear, and it's fucked them up?
Or are they just repeating what their teachers at high school told them?
The deadlift and squat are EASILY achievable, what the fuck are you talking about?
I've got a 157.5kg squat and 180kg deadlift at 70kg 5'10. If that's unattainable for other people they need to sort their shit out.
Bench isn't anything special either. I'm at 105kg now so only need to add 15kg.
"I'd say taking 250mg of test and not cycling seems like a bad idea."
>Look at me I know nothing about steroids. In my professional opinion I'd say cruising is a bad idea, because some really knowledgeable posters fit said steroids were bad and you should only cycle once you were able to bench 315lbs otherwise your heart will explode and you'll die when your 30!
"That's not really up for debate."
Oh look another guy who's been lifting for 6 months and has watched some jason blaha videos
You do realise that large (or even moderate) amounts of gear extend the post workout growth phase much longer than the typical 36-48hr window that natties have right?
there is a guy called rich piana. he is on youtube and instagram and has posted his cycle. his lifting routine is on youtube too. just make sure to copy everything he does exactly.
you get roids from the biggest guy in your gym. or just some pretty big guy.
>implying OP will run anything normal and make educated fitness decisions
after a year of fucking around and 3 months of proper lifting he benches 45 (!!!)kg. this means he is either the tinyest manlet imagineable or he fucked up. maybe both. actually. based on his replies ITT, probably both.
he will fuck up, blame it on the roids and do more roids.
I think you're a fucking retard
>hurr durr his going to struggle to put on weight with ANABOLIC FUCKING STEROIDS
jesus christ did you cunts just hop off the short bus after a hard day at the special school?
Well, once again, correct me if I'm wrong.
You're all saying I'm a novice, which I accept, and heavy compound lifting is the best way to start off.
Not just Jason Blaha who says that, most advice suggests the same thing. I thought it was why most beginner routines are full body routines that initially act more like strength building rather than body building routines.
This thread is full of people saying "you're an idiot", but not offering any corrections.
What then, should I be doing?
You gain nothing and lose everything becoming a methhead or an alcoholic.
So far, no one has posted any evidence that steroid use is harmful.
Plenty of older body builders who used heavily with no health problems. Arnie is a prime example.
Can we leave the fucking manlet shit out of this.
Plenty of successful bodybuilders are short as fuck. Yeah, maybe they're compensating for something, but given height is pretty much the only thing you can't do something about, arguing about it is mental.
please don't do roids. At your level there is basically no point anyway. Please lift seriously on a good program for a couple years before considering it because you don't know anything about lifting, diet or steroids yet.
kek who do you think is going to be stronger an 80kg guy who's 5'4'' or 6'4''. The guy who's 80kg at 5'4'' has much more muscle mass and will have a higher wilks but the guy at my height 6'4'' can put on much more muscle and end up much bigger and stronger. Everyone would much rather be a huge strong as fuck guy than a small manlet with a high wilks lol
>incredibly fast gains
'Learn lifting and diet for 5 years before roids' is the biggest meme. Lifting and diet is piss easy. Write a plan and stick to it.
Don't give a fuck m80, nobody has these standards irl apart from retard sloots
You clearly have no idea how the wilks coefficient works...
Yes you're right about the 5'4 6'4 comparison but you're just comparing total against bodyweight. Wilks takes this into account, so as to not be bias to lighter lifters. That's why superheavyweight powerlifters have some of the highest wilks scores in the world but they're not fucking squatting 3x bodyweight you retard.
>Well, once again, correct me if I'm wrong.
>You're all saying I'm a novice, which I accept, and heavy compound lifting is the best way to start off.
unless you're on gear then don't do full body 3xweek you're better off doing something like p/p/l 2x a week with high volume to take better advantage of the longer post workout growth phase from using anabolics. But still do it with heavy compounds nobody's saying otherwise.
>Not just Jason Blaha who says that, most advice suggests the same thing.
FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE NATURAL
>This thread is full of people saying "you're an idiot", but not offering any corrections.
If you had two braincells to rub together you would come to the conclusion that you'd be better off with high volume workouts less often to take better advantage of the longer post workout growth phase using drugs if you understood what I was saying
>Don't give a fuck m80, nobody has these standards irl apart from retard sloots
I'm not saying it's a bad thing I'm gay and I love topping small guys. I'm just saying that under 6' puts you on the small side, fella
Well thanks, you've actually offered some advice, so I'll follow it.
I've got braincells (a few anyway), but they're not fucking psychic. If people say "don't do that, you're a moron", but don't tell me what I should be doing instead, I can't magically work it out for myself.
if you put the "requirements" for evidence high enough, there is no evidence that meth is unhealthy. I mean, there have been no studies where people have been administered meth or a placebo (at least I would assume that there are not). therefore, nobody can truly say that meth is unhealthy, all those "meth,not even once" pics are basically anecdotal evidence.
seriously now, there have been so many dead bodybuilders with enlarged hearts, tumors in liver etc. of course, that does not equal scientific proof, but cmon. common sense.
find out first about how the steroids work and how you have to do test, serm/ai and pct
usually it's recommended for beginners to start off with only test-e 500mg/week for 8-12 weeks, you could kickstart it with dbol but then you'd have to use a lot more ai during the cycle to prevent gyno as dbol shoots your estrogen levels to the sky but you'll start seeing much bigger gains within a week instead of waiting for the test-e kick in within 3 to 4 weeks
i dunno really why people even here on /fit/ call it stupid to start roiding if you're not already natty huge, tons of people have gotten huge starting off skinny with roids and stayed that way, it's just that you really have to know what you're doing or otherwise it's really fucking stupid
health effects for doing one or even a few test-e cycles are negligible on healthy people compared to being a weekly drug consumer and drinker
zyzz taught us a lot, roids will get you far but if you abuse them while doing drugs and you have a heart condition you'll be royally fucked
>You clearly have no idea how the wilks coefficient works...
>Yes you're right about the 5'4 6'4 comparison but you're just comparing total against bodyweight. Wilks takes this into account, so as to not be bias to lighter lifters. That's why superheavyweight powerlifters have some of the highest wilks scores in the world but they're not fucking squatting 3x bodyweight you retard.
You call me a retard but you lack basic comprehension. We're talking about people in the same weight class because it's easier to get a higher wilks faster if you're a manlet. Your cns will adapt the same speed if you're 6'4'' or 5'4''. So if you get two untrained guys on average after 1 year the bigger guy will be a bit stronger but the smaller guy will have a higher wilks. You understand the point I was trying to make? I have bad grammer so apologies for that
Holy shit majority in this thread is fucking retarded. This dude just wants some general info on how to SAFELY take steroids without killing himself and all you faggots think you have the high ground while showing your double digits IQ.
OP don't worry this is just standard 4chan, most of these people are just insecure themselves and do not have the knowledge or ability to help you.
I suggest you ask your questions in small batches in the /fraud/ thread, more people would be supportive.
Yeah, this is along the lines of what I've been reading elsewhere.
I have actually been tested for heart problems after a few episodes of syncope, but I'm perfectly find in that department as it turns out.
I don't do recreational drugs either, and if I did, I wouldn't do them while on gear and training heavily.
You're the one who brought wilks into it. And as I've pointed out, being a manlet is irrelevant when it comes to wilks.
Shorter people have the ability to carry more muscle at the same weight, HOWEVER, a taller lifter would naturally weigh more anyway. You're assuming height has no effect on peoples competitive weight class. You're not going to get 6' powerlifters competing in the 75kg weight class, they go to at least 100kg or 110kg. Same as you won't get 5'2 manlets competing in 125+kg.
Also your comparison doesn't work, it's all dependent on WEIGHT not HEIGHT. Christ.
>120+kg elite wilks = 522
>75kg elite wilks = 493
Plus, wilks doesn't scale like you think it does, you're still assuming it favours lighter lifters, which it doesn't.
This guy gets it.
And like I've said, I'm not bothered. I've been an occasional /b/tard for years, so I'm more than used to it. I knew I'd get loads of abuse for posting this, but I can roll with the punches.
Yeah, I get what you're saying, but I'm not on fucking gear yet am I.
Everyone is saying to get my lifts up to a reasonable level before I even consider it, which is what I am doing. Then when I start, I'll take your advice.
For now, what I am doing is optimal, so I keep getting told anyway.
In the short term it favors lifters who are shorter in stature.
>Also your comparison doesn't work, it's all dependent on WEIGHT not HEIGHT. Christ.
what are you even arguing that's my point did you even read all of what I wrote?
>Yeah, I get what you're saying, but I'm not on fucking gear yet am I.
NO DUMBSHIT BUT I'M POINTING OUT HOW YOUR INITIAL POINT WAS COMPLETELY INCORRECT
Heavy compound lifting 3-4 times a week is optimum for a "novice" to gain muscle, gear or not.
That's not really up for debate.
How the fuck is that incorrect?
Plenty of professional powerlifters and bodybuilders advise exactly that type of routine at that frequency.
You're arguing the difference between full body 3 times a week, and p/p/l 2 times a week.
Have I got that wrong? That's what you're saying I should do right - ppl twice a week rather than full-body 3 times a week?
Well, there are endless fucking debates on this online, and the general consensus seems to be it makes little fucking difference, but the former is probably the better option for a beginner.
Sorry if that upsets you, and if you post enough convincing arguments for your way of doing it, maybe I'll agree. But I asked about how to safely take gear, not what workout I should be doing.
>Heavy compound lifting 3-4 times a week is optimum for a "novice" to gain muscle, gear or not.
>That's not really up for debate.
>How the fuck is that incorrect?
I'm positive you're trolling me now so I won't get angry. I've explained why you are incorrect >>35585373 >>35586319 >>35586478
>Plenty of professional powerlifters and bodybuilders advise exactly that type of routine at that frequency.
yes. for naturals. as i said in >>35586319
>You're arguing the difference between full body 3 times a week, and p/p/l 2 times a week.
>Have I got that wrong? That's what you're saying I should do right - ppl twice a week rather than full-body 3 times a week?
no. as I've said multiple times. do that if you are using gear even as a novice. you are not using gear and you are a novice so do the 3x a week with less volume.
>Well, there are endless fucking debates on this online, and the general consensus seems to be it makes little fucking difference, but the former is probably the better option for a beginner.
for a natural novice yes for a novice on steroids no. been said multiple times
>Sorry if that upsets you, and if you post enough convincing arguments for your way of doing it, maybe I'll agree. But I asked about how to safely take gear, not what workout I should be doing
no you didnt ask about what workout you should be doing you made an inaccurate statement about working out as a novice on steroids and I corrected you.
> if you post enough convincing arguments for your way of doing it, maybe I'll agree.
I've already made the most convincing argument which you cannot refute and you have revealed yourself to be either a. a troll or b. genuinely mentally retarded
either way I don't care what you do. You making inefficient use of your gear if you choose to use it has no impact on my life.
goodnight and well done for baiting me for so long lol
Yeah, but I'm not on fucking gear yet am I you stupid fuck. If I was, then yes, I've corrected my original statement and I agree with you.
Everyone has said I need to get to some proper weight first, so that's what I'm doing.
Well done for making yourself look like a total fucking mongaloid.
>Yeah, but I'm not on fucking gear yet am I you stupid fuck. If I was, then yes, I've corrected my original statement and I agree with you.
Whether you are using gear or not is irrelevent to whether the statement is correct or not as you specifically stated "gear or not."
>Everyone has said I need to get to some proper weight first, so that's what I'm doing.
Not everyone said that, multiple people including myself said you can juice straight away (but now i take it back as i see you are not intelligent enough to use anabolics)
>Well done for making yourself look like a total fucking mongaloid.
kek no that's you
fyi I know you're trollin I just like arguing
goodnight bby xoxo
>posts image literally saved from reddit
>realizes and reposts without image telling me to go to reddit
hahahaa pure autism
Just be safe and don't load on more weight than you would off roids, keep progressing normally even if it is easy. Do more reps instead at a good pace instead of putting on weight if it is way too easy. I don't know why every idiot on here is saying your arms are gonna fall off if you're doing a small test e cycle it would be like saying you're gonna get lung cancer from smoking one cigar. Do 250mg test e every 4 days.
>durr you gotta OHP da 2pl8 b4 you can juice
You people are faggots
I made a quick post without even thinking and you went mental over it. I made a mistake, no big deal. Calm the fuck down dude.
I'd still argue, from reading various sources, that the difference between full body 3x a week and ppl twice a week isn't exactly earth shattering even if you are on gear, but I certainly wouldn't go mental over it.
See this makes sense. Obviously I am a bit slow because this is obvious.
Someone said you'll suddenly explode in strength if you start on gear, but because I can't lift "proper" weight I'll just cause damage.
Loading at the same rate as I do now (5lbs per workout) will still see gains without overloading and causing myself damage.