Let's have a polite discussion about the ethics of garment

bump, not OP

>>9424434

On a whole, it's extremely unethical.

/thread

I dont care
cucks and femiscum are complaining
but at least those people get jobs
and people get clothes

>>9424434
cant afford to care, this is a cause only taken up by rich people

the worst thing is uneducated consumers that settle for shit tier quality for better prices

as long as people honor contracts, everything's good

don't be desperate and sign away your freedom

and don't protect companies that dishonor their contracts

>>9424434
minimum wage killed "Made in USA"

obamacare didn't help either

sociology 101, now on slash effay slash!

>>9424603

>his retarded father tells him

what is free thinking

>>9424612
you don't want 100% employment?

a contract based society is a polite society

>>9424594
>the worst thing is uneducated consumers that settle for shit tier quality for better prices

typical walmart customer

>>9424434
As long as it looks right and is cheaper for being made in china, i couldn't care less how it was made.

>>9424612
He's right though. Companies just decided that it was better to get comparable labor at much cheaper prices in other countries.

>>9424742
how does cost of living scale with wages? is it naturally conforming?

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>asking materialist teenagers to discuss ethics
Game over, man. Game over.

>>9424603
socialism is a joke. this kind of shit wouldn't happen if we'd go full communism and abolish wage labour

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>>9424434
>I'm a hard-libertarian

There is no absolute truth, no final solutions to the question of the human condition, and you have adopted an ideology that claims there is.

Though the people who make clothes do so willingly, they really have no other realistic choice, thus it is immoral. No matter what the libertarians spout about "well they CHOSE to work for us!" When your options are shit, more shit, and even more shit, you choose the elast amount of shit.

>>9424793
>There is no absolute truth, no final solutions to the question of the human condition
deep

i'm so glad you joined this conversation on clothes-making

>>9424793
they can work in gray markets and subvert the government/companies

they can migrate. i rather be a non-state person. i'd get to have no political obligations, like taxes and military service. i'd have to take care of myself, though.

i know there are less choices, but there are choices.

i also believe in a higher-power. and the faith to walk away from immoral choices and hope to be rewarded for that in some way.

but yeah, it's not perfect but i rather move towards freedom and peace than control and violence.

>>9424816
>they can migrate
All 7 billion people do not have the option to migrate to the US and EU.
>I also believe in a high power, thus they will be rewarded
If you have no proof of its existence, you are simply making an excuse for immoral actions with no attempt to help. If you do have proof of both its existence AND its justice system, then you are still allowing immoral behaviors to continue on the planet that he created.

>>9424434
It is ethical. The choice is between poor working conditions or no working conditions. People in these countries chose to work. This helps them in the long run, as income flows into the country which will help develop it.

>>9424848
>"hey guys let's talk about sewing"
>okay seems like a cool thread
>LOL GOD'S NOT REAL!!
somebody delete this thread already

>>9424848
minimum critical mass

people want to work

just as long as they can quit and leave, i see no problem

i also think violence is justified if they are made to stay by force … which is kidnapping and slavery

in the old testament there is a thing called jubilee. it legalizes slavery by contract but everyone is freed after 7 years and all debts are forgiven. why cant the jews abide by their own laws?

>>9424887
>7 years
try 50 years

also:
>In Judaism the Jubilee Year is currently not observed in modern times because it only applies when representatives of all twelve tribes have returned to Israel and a majority of the world's Jews live in the Land.

>>9424903
>try 50 years
Deuteronomy 15:1
"At the end of every seven years you must cancel debts."

>>9424816
this is why people think /fa/ is the least intelligent board.

On the one hand, bringing industries into developing countries can raise the standard of living in those countries, but on the other hand, this shift in production reduces domestic job opportunities. Plus, if regulations are lax in the developing nations, things such as the 2013 Savar building collapse can occur (among a host of other, smaller tragedies). I think that as consumers we should be knowledgeable about the industry so that we can make informed choices about the products we buy. That said, since I'm not particularly libertarian, I also think that the government is an ideal tool to enforce standards so that garment workers in developing countries aren't subjugated in the worst conditions.

Also (and slightly off topic), I think the fast fashion industry is a serious burden to the environment. A pair of jeans costs an average of 10,850 liters of water to produce from cotton farm to final product. This is true whether the jeans last a month or ten years. There needs to be cheap clothing options, but I think that we need to break the "trend of the week" cycle in fashion, and that we need to learn how to repair things.

>>9424939
>A pair of jeans costs an average of 10,850 liters of water to produce from cotton farm to final product.
how do other materials like hemp compare?

>>9424958
I wouldn't know without doing more research (which, I guess I'll do now). That said, cotton is a thirsty crop, more so than some other textile options.

>>9424958
>10,850 liters of water
implying water isn't renewable

>>9424985

implying water isn't a commodity

>>9424958
This makes no sense to me. $50 dollars will not buy you 10,850 litres of water anywhere in the world.

>>9425040
if you say it enough times, you'll believe it

>>9425040
Capitalism obfuscates the true costs of goods and services.

>>9425040
Like I said, that's from the seed to your legs. It includes all the water used in the production, from growing and pesticide dispersal to dying, finishing, and (if you had a few more gallons) shrinking for the raw denim types.

>>9425074
This is also true.

>>9425082
that still doesn't make sense. water doesn't work like that.

Something I haven't seen mentioned yet is that people in these factories work not only for shit money, but also under shit conditions. Thousands of people died not too long ago when a factory building in Bangladesh collapsed. They also get sick because those factories aren't built for that kind of manufacture. Those rooms are fucking overheated and the working conditions are often unbearable.
I've done a voluntary year in a small NGO that deals with stuff like this, and I have learned that there are options you have as a consumer. FairTrade products are getting bigger, at least in Germany, and you can always buy from second hand clothing stores.
Anyway, this shit is as unethical as many other production/manufacturing processes, it just seems to be the most relevant one.

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>buy ultra lux everything
>never worry about the ethics of what you're wearing

feels gud m90

>>9424773
Yeah, but the economy which gets food from point A to point B would also not happen. Communism will be great once the economy is run by slave robots instead of slave humans.

>>9425147
Well, I'm citing a study and you're not citing anything, so there we go.

>>9425419
That looks hideous, I hope you don't dress like this anon.

>>9425419
elysiumcore?

>>9425943

thats like the opposite of what was happening in elysium though

I don't oppose it, because if all textile manufacturing were done in the West not only would the prices be higher, but it would be depriving the 3rd world of chances to develop.

The only advantage the developing world has over the West is cheap labor. Yes the jobs garment workers have suck, but its only through those jobs that a middle class will rise, other industries will spawn, and wages will eventually rise.

In about 100 years things will be better, whats going on in Asia right now is exactly the same as the industrial revolution in Europe.

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>>9424434

It's called globalization, look it up.

Try to comprehend living as a Chinese peasant farmer with a life expectancy of 40 years, that was only half a century ago. Bless these 1st world gender study ethical privileged faggots that criticize countries still in the midst of industrialization.

>>9425750
>I'm citing a study

No you're not, you made a claim(which may or may not be true, i've no issue with the claim) and someone said it didn't make sense. Then you claim to be citing a study, without providing the study itself or any reference to it at all.

If you want your claim to be backed up by any study, provide a source for said study.

>>9424742
And why wouldn't they, when the average consumer pretty much just buys wherever it's cheapest? If the mindset of the vast majority of consumers is to buy as cheap as possible they're going to get it, ethics goes out the window at that point.