Every video I've seen about sawstop shows the finger/sausage sloooowly approaching the blade to demonstrate the brake, and then it shows the intact test subject. I've been wondering: what would happen if you straight up slapped the blade or hit it with your hand at a higher velocity?
Sawstop Official Website:
Can I get a serious injury using a SawStop saw?
In the vast majority of cases, coming in contact with the spinning blade will result in a minor cut. However, if your hand moves into the blade at very high speed, it is possible for you to receive a serious injury.
They never say it is 100% effective. That would be retarded and mean you wouldn't even get a scratch.
However, you'll find that 99% of tablesaw accidents involving the blades are from people feeding material into it. Not someone slamming their hand into it as fast as they can.
They advertise it perfectly.
>They never say it is 100% effective.
No they don't, but they show videos of people moving their hands into the blade and not getting a single scratch.
> 99% of tablesaw accidents involving the blades are from people feeding material into it.
No, most of the tablesaw accidents involves kickback, and that's something that happens really fast causing your hands to also move really fast.
>No, most of the tablesaw accidents involves kickback,
Kickback is the result of someone being an idiot who is feeding stock into the saw too fast at an angle. Sawstops also come standard with a rivving knife which is remove 99% of kickback as the material cannot meet the back end of the blade.
Put it this way. Would you rater have your hand come in contact with a blade at high speed for milliseconds or seconds?
They don't test with their fingers while feeding the wood. The one finger test I saw was really slow and the guy only touched the blade with the very tip of his finger. And anyway, It would also be retarded to feed the wood with your finger close to the blade's path. Most of the accidents happen due to kickback.
A riving knife still does not fully prevent kickback or idiots. And I'm not against sawstop, I think it's really safe and worth the money but I was just wondering what would happen in a more "violent" accident than the ones demonstrated in the videos.
>A riving knife still does not fully prevent kickback
No, but it does reduce it to the point of a rare occurrence. You can minimize this risk even more with a blade guard.
Send me $69 USD for a replacement cartrage and I will go throw a pork roast into one for you.
last I heard was that at the speed the saw moves, the fastest you can generally move your hand (eg you lose your footing and slide forward somehow) will end up with, at most, about a 1/8-1/4 inch deep cut.
There you go, at about 4:15, high speed test worst case scenario on sawstop.
watching that slowmo video, looks like from activation to blade stop, it's about 12 teeth of a 60 tooth blade. Sooo, 1/5 of a revolution.
I would trust it not to go through the bone, pretty much.
A bigger issue is I've commonly heard people say they regularly disable it, especially when cutting pressure treated or green wood, and forget to cut it back on. It can go off with wood that has higher moisture content.
I think they've made it harder to disable.
TLDR I've cut myself worse on a tablesaw that was off that I probably would on sawstop if I messed up. But I'm poor, so just going to keep using push sticks, staying away from blade, and not standing behind things with my second hand bench top saw that I had to build a new frame for it was so busted.
Out of curiosity why don't you guys have like, CNC push sticks?
I think a machine would be infinitely more effective at feeding stock at a specified rate.
Worst case scenario, it kicks back anyways and nobody's around to get impaled.
At a former job we have a massive beam saw. Unfortunately I can't afford that (or fit it) in my garage.
CNC isn't the answer to everything, anon. It is often times overkill.
100% of table saw accidents are the results of bad practice and corner cutting.
If you went to the time and trouble to stop between every cut and set up everything so your hands came no where near the blade at any point, used all preventative measure such as sleds and push sticks, zero clearance shrouds and a riving knife, you will see how saw stop is the best manufactured gimmick going.
>in b4 how can it be a gimmick if it works
Familiarity breeds contempt. The moment you stop thinking about what you're doing is when you will have an accident. If you're keeping your mind on what you're doing, providing you do know what you're doing, you have very little to worry about.
After that the only factors would be external. Such as other people or faulty machinery.
>Familiarity breeds contempt.
You...I don't...I'm pretty sure that word does not mean what I think you think it means.
Such things exist.
But they're very expensive and don't do all that much over just pushing it yourself.
Not much point in one unless you're running a high-production professional woodshop.
>contempt: the feeling that a person or a thing is beneath consideration, worthless, or deserving scorn
I can only assume you're looking for "complacency" (http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/complacency) or you are actually trying to make a transition in subjects there and your ability to segue from one point to another is atrocious.
Funny enough at my makerspace, people are worried about using the sawstop because if triggered they owe $100 for new cartridge and blade.
It has only been triggered by a finger once. Every other time has been by metal and once by charred wood from the laser cutter.
The cartridges are $69 to replace. Plus a new non-shit blade.
Only false positive ever was the charred wood and I half think the guy really hit a staple.
We have another table saw to use if you don't know the wood is metal free.
legit. I think things like this give people too much confidence.. you got your everyday kitchen bitch and your everyday side bitch, and your everyday work bitch, thinking they can now use a table saw.
99.99999999% of the time, when people use a tablesaw even with a guard still attached or as seen people who use these sawstop saws on youtube [not naming any names, but theres some big ones..] Standing right behind the fucking piece they are feeding into the saw... Kay yeah it stops when something meaty touches it.. sure as hell wont stop from slinging 2x4s across the damn room or even better, into your gut.
fun fact, the gut is very hard to fix, and you get some leaky shit juice into your nice clean pumpy pumpy blue juice, and its GG for you.
Maybe this is my was defending my; no guard, no riving knife, all cast iron/steel 1940's delta table saw, that's run off a two stroke [yes TWO STROKE BRAP BRRRAP] engine. only because attaching a gasoline power plant was cheaper then buying a new fucking electric motor [amazing huh?] HF pred engines cost less then replacing the motor with x2 the HP...
LEMME TELL YOU WHAT. A good solid blade and feeding a 3x9 for resizing, that two stroke can really launch shit across the yard [I don't work inside either.] #thuglife
TL:DR1 Saw stop not gonna stop flingbacks
TL:DR2 I own a stupid deadly table saw
DR:TL took a crane to get it out.
>100% of table saw accidents are the results of bad practice and corner cutting.
Wrong. Though a riving knife is the most important thing you can have to prevent this, particularly bad lumber can have such high internal stresses that relieving this with a table saw cut can result in it wrapping around the rear of the blade like a boa constrictor and throwing that wood right at your face nonetheless.
Yep, pretty much it seems that this goes for all woodworking related injuries.
I am by far no craftsman, and took like a short little shop class that involved building a few shelves. And we got to talk with the teacher for a bit, he pretty much said that most of missing limbs were never really because of blades. Almost always someone did not properly secure the wood, or did something stupid that caused the piece of wood to tear off or cut off limbs.
Except the fingers my brothers grandad is missing. He did cut them off with a bandsaw.
Its actually called "case hardening" not twisting it's a different defect they are describing, so it's not a visible defect until you start to see it pinching on the blade, that's when you need a friend with wedges to keep the kerf open.
You seem to be missing the point. Well. If you can't see that one I'm surprised you're not missing several from the ends of your fingers.
Why would you use a table saw to rip rough timber?
There are better suited tools and methods.
>I think things like this give people too much confidence
No not in the slightest. The people who hurt themselves of their of fault will always hurt themselves no matter how dangerous or how safe you make something. It is in their nature.
They are always overconfident in themselves, that is the main problem.
I've been woodworking for over 30 years and haven't once had a blade/power tool related accident. This is because I check myself before I wreck myself. Literally, I think for a moment every hour or so to make sure I'm thinking straight and I'm not mentally/physically tired. I take frequent breaks and I make sure to eat properly. I don't rely on other people to keep me safe, but they are there keeping an eye on me as I am on them making sure everything is thought out before doing it.
Something as simple as a dry-run can save a finger or more. That's where you mimic exactly what you'll be doing before you do it, without the power tool being plugged in or before you start using the handtool. Something as simple as not properly taking care of the power cord while you cut using a hand power tool can cause tripping, snags, and all manner of errors. These things can be quickly realized on a dry-run.