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What exactly did she do that was wrong? I'm...
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You are currently reading a thread in /co/ - Comics & Cartoons

Thread replies: 247
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What exactly did she do that was wrong? I'm thoroughly unconvinced in her position as an antagonist.
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You know she's actually kind of a shitty villian....
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>>79103344
Initiating fusion with a Gem who isn't her sister.
The sentence is shattering.
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Nothing she is perfect and will become a CG before Lapis
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>>79103344
To Homeworld, I'm sure she would be considered a hero, that is, if she hadn't failed completely in her mission.
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>>79103366
She was there for two episodes and acted as a grunt. That's like saying Boba Fett wasn't fleshed out in the OT
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>>79103453
You completely fell for it...
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>>79103344
She found an old woman on a foreign planet and automatically assumed she could trust her 100%.

Beyond that she was just a random soldier assigned to protect Peridot.
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>>79103344
She hurt Steven's friends.
She hurt Steven's face.
She locked Lapis in a cell.
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>>79103344
Literally nothing
People think they should hate her somehow because she was under an antagonistic light for two episodes, but so was Lapis and Peridot.
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>>79103344
Nothing at all she was doing her job.
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Do you guys just not understand what antagonist means?
She was an antagonist because she stood opposed to the protagonists. That's it. That's all it take.
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>>79103344
she was an antagonist because she was up against the protagonists. not that hard.

more importantly she was planning to hand over steven to the diamonds because she mistook him for rose quartz, and was going to do the same to other crystal gems.
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>>79103388

>Based on Garnet's opinions, fusion is rather akin to sex for gems, but more emotion-based
>On the homeworld you aren't supposed to fuse with a different kind of gem

I'm not sure if that means the Homeworld is anti-miscegenation/cross-caste relationships or pro-incest.

Possibly both.
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>>79103344
she was too sexE
>>
Tried to destroy the earth
Appeared to easily kill the strongest member of a superhero team
beat a child unconscious
Essentially raped a character, using the predominate sexual metaphor of the fictional universe
imprisoned the cast, presumably to await their executions

Do you even watch the show?
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>>79103344
"SHE'S A BIG FAT MEANIE"

Just like every other antagonist in this "show"

See also:
Peridot
Yellow Diamond

Fucking joke villains
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>>79103857

To be fair to Jasper, Lapis also used the predominate sexual metaphor under false pretenses to entrap Jasper.

So it's kinda like Jasper raped Lapis, but this was all according to plan so Lapis would have justification to reverse-rape Jasper and pull her into a life of non-con BDSM.

...When you put it like that, it sounds more like a comedy hentai than a dramatic sacrificial act, though.
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>>79103836
Fusion is more like caste mixing and less about homosexuality since it is implied that the gems are gay because BD keeps her Pearl looking like a submissive fuck toy.
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>>79103388
Man, Blue diamond is kind of a dick
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>>79103344
She was against the protagonist.
You people don't even know what "antagonist" means.
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>>79103344
She's going to join the CG's before Lapis.
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>>79103954

Well, yeah, considering that Pearls are basically living purses for their Diamonds, there aren't a whole lot of other reasons to make them sentient and pretty.

Although most of the diamonds have a way bigger size difference than Rose and Pearl did, so yeesh, Blue Pearl must have a rough life.
>>
All Jasper tried to do was capture the CGs

Peridot has tried to kill them multiple times
Lapis tried to drown Steven and Connie
but they are both redeemable
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>>79103884
Because they are not actually villains
Just give a couple years and they will all be flying the banner of the Crystal Gems
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>>79103857
These "x did nothing wrong" threads are just edgy memes and OP just worded it differently to get responses.
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fresh yella dimen
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>>79104050
She did nothing wrong though since shes a gem designed to be a barbarian.
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>>79103344
>Beat a small child unconscious
>Didn't care about her mission until the promise of a good fight presented itself
>Insulted the CGs and demonstrated a fuckton of Homeworld prejudice in the process
>Completely misunderstood the concept of fusion
>Coerced a random bystander into fusing with her

Jasper has done a whole lot to indicate she's not a good person.
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>>79104100
>Beat a small child unconscious
Why is she supposed to be the significance in a human child? To her Steven is just a lifeform thats in the way similar to how we see insects.
>Didn't care about her mission until the promise of a good fight presented itself
She was being very rational and told Peridot just to blast the shit out of them because the mission was to stop vandals who were destroying her stuff, to Jasper that seems like a really stupid reason to send her to do something.
>Insulted the CGs and demonstrated a fuckton of Homeworld prejudice in the process
So what?
>Completely misunderstood the concept of fusion
She understood the rational military use for fusion.
>Coerced a random bystander into fusing with her
It was a last resort
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>>79104015
Jasper ordered them to be executed by the ship's laser cannon. did you conveniantly forget that?

Only after she found out that Steven had Rose's power did she capture them.
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>>79104100
>beat a small child unconscious

Part of her mission was neutralize the CGs because Peridot asked for help. She could've killed all of them but she didn't
>Didn't care about her mission until the promise of a good fight presented itself

I thought it was plenty clear that Quartzes are made for fighting and are always eager to fight and be violent. Amethyst shows signs of this as well

>prejudice
>misunderstood the concept of fusion

I'm not even comment these since they're based on your viewpoint. Jasper's been with Homeworld all her life so why would she think fusion's used for something else other than to fight?

Like I'm not even a Jasper apologist but the things you've said except for coercing Lapis to fuse are plenty justified in the show.
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>>79104194
Just accept it m8, you're waifu a shit
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>Jasperfags
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>>79104247
Jasper is not my waifu, Im just explaining why she did nothing wrong.
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>>79104076
What happens if you give a Yellow Pearl a cookie?
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>>79104247
I thought this thread was about Jasper?
Don't bring Pearl into this
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>>79103344
Here is last weeks thread on the subject.
>>78955000
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>>79104283
k man whatever you say
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>>79104282
>Garnetfags
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>>79104325
>Waifufags
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>>79103769
Came here to fucking say this.
Just cause Butch makes your wee wee hard and your nasty flaps floodgates, doesn't meant she doesn't oppose the protagonist.
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>>79104349
>gregdykes
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>>79104296
I never said anything about perl
I'm more a Peridot person
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>>79104325
Implying Garnet is not best mom
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>>79104392
>Greg
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>>79103344
She was a radish.
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>>79104349
>fags
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>>79104194
>Why is she supposed to be the significance in a human child? To her Steven is just a lifeform thats in the way similar to how we see insects.
He presented absolutely no threat to her, and she could have easily captured him without hurting him. She did not.
>So what?
It's not a bad action, per se, but it doesn't say much for her character. It's pretty clear that Jasper buys wholeheartedly into all the stuff that the CGs fought against.
>She understood the rational military use for fusion.
If that were the case, she would have brought another Jasper to fuse with.

The entire point of Malachite, as I've said before, is to contrast Garnet's views on fusion with Jasper's. To Garnet, fusion is a way of life, the ultimate symbol of one person's bond with another. To Jasper, fusion is a convenient powerup. This is meant to show an aspect of Jasper's character - she does not understand love as a concept. She only sees it as a way to use others to get what you want. This is why Malachite failed, because Jasper looks at the ultimate connection between Gems and saw only "how do I use this to beat up people I don't like?"

>>79104225
>She could've killed all of them but she didn't
That's not exactly a fine reflection of her character. She wanted them alive because she thought her superiors would find them interesting. Unless you consider "did not execute unconscious and helpless prisoners" to be a positive trait.

>Jasper's been with Homeworld all her life so why would she think fusion's used for something else other than to fight?
When somebody sings an entire musical number in front of you about how they're strong and able to beat you because they're the product of a true, loving fusion. Steven Universe is not a subtle series, and it really doesn't say much for Jasper's character that her takeaway from "I am made of love, and it's stronger than you" was "aw, shit, better find someone else to be my powerup."
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>>79104480
>He presented absolutely no threat to her, and she could have easily captured him without hurting him. She did not.
Idk what part of why is she supposed to see the significance in a human child cant you understand? What does it matter if he wasnt much a threat hitting Steven is the same as hitting a rock in her point of view. She just doesnt see anything wrong or right about hitting Steven at all, Peridot even shows this by constantly calling Steven a "steven" or a "thing" to show that the gems have no idea of human life significance and why would they they are alien rocks they should see organic life as abominations to be honest.
>It's not a bad action, per se, but it doesn't say much for her character. It's pretty clear that Jasper buys wholeheartedly into all the stuff that the CGs fought against.
So what?
>If that were the case, she would have brought another Jasper to fuse with.
She didnt need another Jasper, Peridot could have just spammed the shit out of the lasers and the job would be done, plot stupidity is the only reason Jasper even got out the damn ship.
>. This is why Malachite failed, because Jasper looks at the ultimate connection between Gems and saw only "how do I use this to beat up people I don't like?"
Malachite failed because Lapis and Jasper werent coordinate in their motives for fusing thats all, its the same as Opal.
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>>79104480
Because for Homeworld, fusion is nothing but a powerup, you idiot. I thought the show had made this pretty clear. When she's cornered and sees no other option, why wouldn't she turn to Lapis for help? Garnet is an anomaly and not the norm.
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>>79104671
Garnet is a lunatic by homeworld standards, fusing for selfish pleasure is not seen well in HW but fusing for combat however is.
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>>79104623
>Malachite failed because Lapis and Jasper werent coordinate in their motives for fusing thats all, its the same as Opal.
it's not really the same as opal. pearl and amethyst couldn't even properly fuse as her until steven's life was in danger. malachite fused perfectly, but unlike most fusions between two different types of gems it doesn't have its own personality. it's just jasper and lapis fighting for control of the steering wheel. lapis is using all her strength to keep the fusion together, while jasper is trying to break them apart.
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>>79104723
> malachite fused perfectly, but unlike most fusions between two different types of gems it doesn't have its own personality. it's just jasper and lapis fighting for control of the steering wheel. lapis is using all her strength to keep the fusion together, while jasper is trying to break them apart.
Yes because THEIR MOTIVES FOR FUSING WERENT COORDINATED, its shown in the first few seconds that they were coordatinated but then Lapis went ILL SAVE YOU STEVEN HURR DURR and then this clusterfuck of a plot drag happened.
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Ruby explains that when fusing with other Rubies she feels like herself, only bigger. There's no effort to sync up.

Fusing with a different type of gem can be unpredictable and they could split apart by accident. They could also go nutty like Sugilite and not want to un-fuse, which I'll bet isn't a problem for the triple Ruby fusions.
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>>79104325
why cant jasper and garnetfags get along? theyre both sexy hipmonsters
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>>79104671
>Because for Homeworld, fusion is nothing but a powerup, you idiot. I thought the show had made this pretty clear. When she's cornered and sees no other option, why wouldn't she turn to Lapis for help? Garnet is an anomaly and not the norm.
Garnet is an anomaly, but that doesn't make Jasper right. And for a last resort option, she sure seemed awfully pleased about it.

The point is, Garnet literally said it to Jasper's face, in song, that fusion isn't just a cheap combat strategy, and Jasper's immediate response was that it was, followed by trying to abuse it.

Jasper's ideals are typical of Homeworld, but that doesn't make them good. She's a bullying, arrogant, sadistic, violent musclehead, and we've never seen any evidence to the contrary.
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>>79104887
But Garnet is shit.
You don't want to mix shit with perfect.
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>>79104915
beneath your hateboner is a boner
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>>79104914
>Garnet is an anomaly, but that doesn't make Jasper right
Yes in HW Jasper is right.
Jasper's ideals are typical of Homeworld, but that doesn't make them good. She's a bullying, arrogant, sadistic, violent musclehead, and we've never seen any evidence to the contrary.
Gems are not human, morality is not objective moron.

Also Garnet is a sick fuck.
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So when will EVERYONE get combined into a perfect being?
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>>79104914
She seemed pleased because she thought she was going to quick their asses. Which, for all intents and purposes is what would've happened if Lapis had wanted to. Why would anybody inmediatly change their mind about a WHOLE concept after hearing an enemy sing about love? Don't be retarded, anon. You're obviously biased because you can't seem to accept that there's this whole planet with ideas opposite of what the CGs think and that they're obviously going to clash. I'm not defending Jasper's actual personality; but a whole viewpoint that has been yours for millenia can't be changed just by hearing a song.
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>>79104703

I do think it'd be interesting if we saw something like that when we start seeing more of Blue Diamond's enforcers. Sapphire was somebody in the court, but Ruby was not...

From the homeworld's perspective, they might view that as Sapphire having turned from a frail seer into a lunatic power junkie constantly using a lesser gem to make herself stronger; from HW's perspective, why else would a sapphire stay fused with a ruby?
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>>79105018
I don't expect Jasper to change her mind. I fully accept that she's a product of her environment and more the result of Homeworld being terrible than anything to do with her personal choices (well, as many personal choices as you can make in a society like Homeworld). But that doesn't mean that Jasper's a good person or that she did nothing wrong. My point is that when the show features those two events together, the clear intent is that Garnet is right and Jasper is wrong and kind of a bad person on top of that.
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>>79104948
I don't hate Jasper though
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>>79105189
In any case, we've seen too little of Jasper to know how she's like in normal circumstances. She could have some redeeming qualities we don't know about yet. She's definitely not going to like fusion when she gets out of the ocean, though.
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>>79105355
Women detected.
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>>79105051
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>>79105441
>Women

whut
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>>79105355
Aw did I trigger you sweetheart? Tumblrs that a way.
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>>79105441
I'll take "things anon never says at home" for $500, Alex.
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>>79105545
/pol/ is not here, this is /co/ my skinhead friend.
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>>79103344
she is the most attractive character after they fucked up Garnet with the fusion shit.
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>>79105562
JUST
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>>79105562
Fuck anon.
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Looked like an ugly dumblr version of a Jem character...
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>>79105562
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>>79105562
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>>79105545
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>>79105562
I asked for my anon to be medium rare, not roasted to a crisp
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>>79105562
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>>79105562
beuno
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>>79105723
why are you so triggered at the sight of femanons
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>>79105562
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>>79105320
you shouldnt hate either
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>>79105760
Typical woman always resorting to emotional attack when they get called out, I just stated that the anon that anon was replying to is a woman which is why she has a hard time seeing the world through Jasper's alien point of view but sticks with her human feelings demonizing Jasper due to her human point of view.
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>>79103344
She was a punchcard villain up until the fight with Garnet

Then she started to actively hate the CGs
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>>79105797
I just find her extremely repulsive and disgusting, but I don't hate Garnet
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>>79105828
J A S P E R F A G D A M A G E C O N T R O L
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>>79105828
ayylmao, pls. you should spend more time probing and less time shitposting
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>>79105867
I already stated Jasper aint my waifu.
>>79105873
Whatever

Jasper did nothing wrong at all shes an alien why should she even show emotional concern to Steven in the first place?
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>>79105859
you know you want both of them at once
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>yfw gems come from parallel universes
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>>79105828
Your salt is palpable
>>
She participated in a violent process that would have resulted in the destruction of the world.

"Just following orders" wasn't a good excuse for the Nazis, either.
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>>79105906
that's like saying we should stop expecting psychopaths to know that murder is wrong
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>>79105906
wtf subjective sociopathy doesnt alleviate you from objective wrongdoing
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>>79105929
>violent process that would have resulted in the destruction of the world

So just escorting Peridot?
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>>79103344
She just needs the murdercock and everything be hunky dory.
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>>79105949
Murder is only wrong to a human being but it is not wrong objectively anon, your protective tribal instincts are the only reason you give a crap whenever someone kills another person.
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>>79105909
What is this meme i keep seeing?
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>>79105949
Actually it's nothing like that.
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>>79105908
Jasper is enough for me, the rest can have Garnet
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>>79105980
Oh yeah she "just escorted" Peridot in beating up the gems and Steven and jailing them so the giant monster inside the Earth can burst out of it unimpeded.

And the Nazis just "escorted" Hitler in shoving a bunch of babies in a pit.
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>>79103736
What her job required of her was wrong and if she had a moral compass then she wouldn't have followed orders. But either she doesn't care about anything but following orders or she believes in manifest destiny. Either way she's at best neutral.
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>>79106048
>What her job required of her was wrong and if she had a moral compass then she wouldn't have followed orders
Jasper was literally created to kill stuff.
>And the Nazis just "escorted" Hitler in shoving a bunch of babies in a pit.
Stop bringing human morality into this anon.
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I like Jasper but I'd happily see her go out in a blaze of glory Ramba ral style

the main group is getting a bit full especially if Lapis sticks around
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>>79106040
>>79105929
>resorting to reductio ad hitlerum
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I don't care if Jasper joins the CGs or stays with the homeworld, I just want her to stay as a ball of fucking rage.
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>>79106103
MODS
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>>79106048
Can you stop? Gems don't have the same moral compass humans do so the only thing you're proving is your lack of critical thinking and empathy.
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>>79105996
wtf if we're gonna go there then all human perspective is subjective. you have no greater perspective to judge what life is worth than anyone else
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>>79106086
You know who else resorted to reductio ad hitlerum?

Stalin.
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Why don't the crystal gems just use guns?
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>>79106111
well I'd be pretty pissed if I had to spend ~a year getting mind raped underwater
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>>79106150
Life isnt worth anything objectively, your emotions and instincts are the only reason you think so that is why though.
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Why are you remaking this thread? What purpose could this serve?
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these threads are awful
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>>79106080
The CGs were all created to do their diamond's bidding and they they, through freewill and critical thinking, decided to reject home world philosophy.
How does human morality not apply? Killing innocent sapient beings is wrong no matter where you are from.
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>>79106165
MY MOM!
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>>79106172
Why don't the humans just nuke them?
>>
It seemed that Peridot was trying hard to avoid mentioning the Crystal Gems to Yellow Diamond. She herself didn't even bring them up.
But surely she knows? Surely she heard the snitching Lapis did?
Did she just include them with her sentiments toward the planet?
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>>79103344

From the good guys' perspective, being a jerk in general, being on Homeworld's side, and not acknowledging R&S' super duper special love, separating them in different cells after pulling them apart

From an objective standpoint though, she really was just doing her job and exhibiting contextually-reasonable reactions to things.

She was sent to be backup for Peridot and get the Earth's destruction rolling after endless delays, which she was doing a fine job of until the CGs kicked her ass, even managing to capture them all.

Her reaction to Garnet's fusion was akin to that of a white person in America stumbling upon a mixed-race couple before civil rights got sorted out, confusion tinged with disgust due to the social norms of the time and place saying it's wrong and gross.

Her knockout headbutt to Steven's squishy little face made perfect sense, considering he's still the rebellion leader and thus enemy #1, even if he's too cowardly and inexperienced to know it. Plus, she naturally never got that memo that Rose species-mixed and was essentially reborn with all of her memories wiped, so she had zero way of knowing that Steven wasn't just Rose playing dumb with a stupid-looking disguise.

The fusion with Lapis was a last-ditch tactical decision to try and get the job of killing the CGs off for good done at any cost. As seen in Message Received with how badly Peridot got chewed out for failure without the CGs even factoring in, Jasper would be in far deeper shit if she just failed to stop them normally and somehow got into contact with YD to inform her of it, at least compared to any flak for fusing out of necessity. And even if she'd be fucked in any case with her boss, losing to the CGs means getting your core locked away for millenia in a containment bubble where no one will come to save you, a fate that even the most brave warrior wouldn't want to accept if they could keep fighting to the death instead.
>>
>>79106217
>How does human morality not apply? Killing innocent sapient beings is wrong no matter where you are from.
Why is it wrong? Oh right your feelings thats why meaning its all subjective. Why would aliens give a damn about innocence or even see value in anything that has intellgence when they can mass produce their own species.
>>
>>79106193
and your emotions and instincts are the only reason you think it isn't. there's no logic to it, death is uncertain
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>>79106217
Yeah, because rebelling against everything your planets and superiors stand for is so easy. Even if killing sapient beings is wrong the gems are being indoctrinated and forced to do so for most of their lives. Breaking free of a system that big is not fucking easy. Do you understand?
>>
>>79106283
You are being retarded, a completely logical being doesnt care about dying because they are incapable of fear dumbass. Most invertebrates are completely fearless and simply run from predators due to instinctive motor commands in their DNA not because they are scared or anything.
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>>79106217

Killing noncombatants is only 'wrong' if the society deems it wrong. Homeworld doesn't seem to care very much for leaving enemies alive, what with the Cluster about to kill at least millions of people (would the population of the Earth be much smaller?)

A lot of times in history, people were praised for murdering civilians.

>>79106172

>using guns on a race that, by and large, most of humanity probably doesn't know about any more
>>
>>79106138
Gems are raised to serve their master without question. However, It is possible for gems to see the value in protecting a life because it is someone they care about. While it is unfair to expect Jasper to immediately empathize with humanity and the crystal gems, she is still doing wrong.
>>
>>79106320
that is what fear is

why are you so sure about what a completely logical being is? not fearing death doesn't mean bringing it upon others anyway
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>>79106346
She did nothing wrong stop placing human morals as the absolute in the universe already.
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>>79106368
your immorality isn't any more absolute jasper
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Was she autistic?
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>>79106368
Call the FBI, we have an alien over there.
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>>79106365
Fear is an emotional state that makes you paranoid and unstable making you more likely to flee from danger, the "Fear" that invertebrates have is the same kind of "fear" that makes bacterium move away the moment they touch a microbe that will consume them retard. The mere fact you said instints make me see life is worthless shows you have no idea what you saying.
>>79106382
Immorality is all subjective, for the last times ITS AN ALIEN RETARD.
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>>79106346
She's doing "wrong" because she's following orders. However since YD has abandoned them she might have a chance to learn more about Earth. Just saying that it's not 100% on paper that she's an unredeemable gem just because her introduction made her look like that.
>>
All you moralfags must not realize that Rose caused many of her own kind to die for her selfish idea of protecting one fucking rock in the solar system, yet you claim Rose is good no Rose is a nutjob.
>>
>>79106406
I guess I can kill you and be morally just if I am from a society that condones murder
>>
>>79106278
becase the past shows that homogonity leads to mass extinction because everyone shares the same weaknesses and vulnerabilities. Any self respecting species would understand that you never know when the singing coral on ChuppaChuppa-9 might be the key to curing the latest super virus or defeating a more powerful enemy.
Furthermore, any self-respecting society would understand the benefits of outside perspectives when it comes to problem solving.
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>>79106273
The thing is, none of Jasper's actions have the feel of "I did what I had to do." She seems very eager and pleased to do what she does, even down to the "last resort" (where her objection to it seemed to solely be that she thought it was cheap).

And the question isn't "human morality" or "the morality of the universe." The question is, what is the show trying to convey? Is the show looking at Jasper and saying "what this person is doing and how they're acting is wrong?" Indisputably, yes.
>>
>>79103344
She's single. That makes her a laughing stock who deserves to die.
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>>79106489
Gem lives and human lives are equally valuable.
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>>79106328
and those people were wrong
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Why is there a taboo against fusion in the first place?
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>>79106273
So she did do wrong, but only because she was following social norms.
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>>79106499
From your perspective? yeah, it's morally just. From mine? Fuck no. Which is the point of this stupid discussion. Open up your mind and try not to see things only from a human perspective when we're talking about alien invaders.
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>>79106499
Pretty much
>>79106500
Why cant you stop projecting human morals? What the fuck is wrong with you? The gems can already mass produce their own species, they have no reason to give a shit about the lives of their own kind anymore or any other alien life.
>>79106522
In your view, but killiing civillians is a decent strategy since it weakens the economy of the country you are invading to begin with.
>>79106521
Yes they all are worth nothing, but Rose played favorites with humans for some reason.
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>>79106540
cause it is disgusting
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>>79106540
Because it's unnatural and gross to look at for them.
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>>79106522

I don't support it, myself, but my culture lacks a truly hated enemy.
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>>79106499
Yep.
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>>79106540
It ruins the social system that diamonds made when it was used for anything other than combat.
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>>79106540
Either the Diamonds are stingy grandpas that need to get with the times, or they fuse all the time with each other for some super secret reason that has yet to be revealed.
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>>79104407

Daily reminder to kiss your Pearl.
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>>79103836
I think it's purely a caste thing. Incest would be irrelevant to them. There isn't inbreeding, just homogeneity.

Their castes are (likely) based on perceived traits of the default varieties of gems, and non-homogenous fusion is the most overt way of overcoming the limits of your class, and it would also challenge the legitimacy of the ruling class, a complex fusion would be more capable than a diamond.

So you make cross caste fusion a social taboo to keep the proletariat in line.
>>
>>79106540
There isn't
Fusion is just seen as a battle tactic
It'd be like walking into a restaurant with a giant sword on your back and then using the giant sword to cut all of your steak

When Ruby fused with Sapphire it was out of line because Ruby was just a lowly warrior and Sapphire was in Blue Diamond's court

don't blow things out of proportion
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>>79106540
When two gems of the same type fuse they become a bigger stronger version of themself as all gems of the same type are basically the same.

When two gems of a different type fuse they become some kind of abomination with an entirely new personality and a bevy of physical deformities.

Imagine if the first time you saw two gems that weren't the same type fuse they turned into Malachite and ask yourself if you would think that was okay.
>>
>>79106583
While societies have different morals, and the people who follow those morals, whatever they may be, cannot be blamed, the teachings of the society can be wrong.
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>>79106540
Because it's only a combac tactic and should remain as such
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>>79106693
How can they be wrong? Because YOUR HUMAN MORALS SAY SO?

Get it in your head that human morals are completely subjective for the last time.

This is like saying the arabs are wrong for fucking children even though it our western morality that makes us think that, however to the muslims fucking kids is everyday thing so its understandable why they get confused as to why we object to not getting their kids fucked.
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>>79103344

Killing people for no goddamn good reason is evil no matter what planet you're from.

Feel free to respond cynically to this, it will relieve me from the responsibility of acknowledging you as a moral agent.
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>>79103344

She was just a nazi footsoldier/stormtrooper that liked her job, but so does everyone else
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>>79106693
>refusing to develop critical thought is the right thing to do.
>wanting to be an intelligent creature who only chooses to think what they're trained to think, and to obey
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>>79106734
Anon confirmed for pedophile
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>Jasper threads always turn into deep as shit morality debates

This sucks. I wish she appeared more so we could talk about something else.
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>>79106652

>Imagine if the first time you saw two gems that weren't the same type fuse they turned into Malachite and ask yourself if you would think that was okay.

This. For that matter, just look at fusions like fucking Alexandrite or Sugilite.
>>
>>79106742
An alien culture could have killing randoms as a sign of honor or a great thing. You never know
>>79106778
Nope, but the fact you basically just went WELL WELL YOU ARE EVIL proves you cant think outside of your reinforced socially conditioned morals.
>>
>>79106742
What was even the point of your post if you're gonna dismiss anybody who disagrees with you?
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>>79106734
>Because YOUR HUMAN MORALS SAY SO?
So you're saying that I can't judge other cultures because it is impossible to see beyond my own?
See
>>79106742
Jasper may have had a good reason, and cannot really be blamed, but that doesn't mean gem morals are fucked up.
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>>79106788

Given that my society exists for 'conquest', I think it's only stupidity and inability to break away from their caste system that stops them from realizing how powerful fusion between different gem types is.

Triruby doesn't even slow down barehanded Rose.
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>>79106540
Really, it's a lot of things.

The first thing is that Fusion is a powerful tool for offense. This means that it's seen as a weapon, and staying fused for long periods is considered aggressive.

The second thing is that the Crystal Gems consider Fusion to be a symbol of love and affection. Homeworld is very sterile and finds displays of this to be disgusting - furthered by the fact that strong relationships lead to strong Fusions.

The third is that Fusion creates a new being. In the harsh caste society of the Homeworld, who you are born as dictates your place in society, your abilities, your personality, and many other things. It doesn't matter how many Rubies you get together, they're still just Rubies and therefore just grunts. But a Ruby and a Sapphire? Where does Garnet fit in? What is Garnet? What position should she serve? Just Ruby and Sapphire together created a warrior capable of going toe-to-toe with an elite. The caste system and categories of Gems would completely break down because they no longer have anywhere to put the Fusions.
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>>79106734
>Because YOUR HUMAN MORALS SAY SO?
So you're saying that I can't judge other cultures because it is impossible to see beyond my own?
See
>>79106742
Jasper may have had a good reason, and cannot really be blamed, but that doesn't mean gem morals aren't fucked up.
>>
>>79106821
Evil is subjective you stupid bitch, sentient fire would think water is evil just to get an idea of how dumb you sound.
>>
Society under diamonds
>everyone is dressed nice
>everyone has a job in an ever expanding industry
>good health care, no need for insurance as they already know what is going to happen to you so don't worry
>functional
>No fatties allowed
>moral

Society under the degenerate Rose Quarts
>everyone dresses like whores
>everyone just lazes about the house all day
>dysfunctional on multiple levels, she gave them anxiety and shit
>if you get get poofed some fat kid with cheeto dust hands is going to ruin your gem
>morbidly obese
>has fusions walking around in public
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>>79106837

It could also be that cross-caste fusion and the combining of multiple wildly different perspectives causes the Diamond's strict social conditioning to break down more easily.
>>
>>79106855
Do you see arsenic and cyanide as evil?
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>This thread in the last 10 minutes
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>>79106847
They're fucked up from a human perspective so if Jasper is to join the team she needs to adapt to that perspective. There. Let's put that conversation to rest.
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>>79106913
It is generally assume that burning up person is evil because fire makes on feel pain, to a sentient fire based being water would make them feel pain so they associate water with evil and consider people putting out fires as evil horrible people. Stop replying you are just fucking stupid and cant critically think at all.
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>>79106870
Thanks for the redpill on Homeworld
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>>79106953
Sentient fire wouldn't think that people putting out regular non-sentient fire is evil, you simpleton.
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>>79106903

True.

But such is the failure of a brittle gemstone.

It cannot dare risk disobedience for a second, lest every upstart who can fuse get ideas...
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>>79106855
sentient water that activeley tried to douse sentient fire WOULD be evil
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>>79106953
It's funny how you accuse me of not being able to think critically while you make excuses for Jasper not thinking critically.
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>>79107009
>bacteria:OMG STOP USING CHEMICALS ON US!
>insects:STOP USING PESTICIDES YOU EVIL UGLY SMELLY GIANTS!
>plants:STOP CUTTING US DOWN YOU EVIL MOVING THINGS!

Evil is all subjective.
>>79107083
Morals are infantile logic you stupid bitch.
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>>79106804
Unless you live on a non-occidental society, you're a pedophile because the simple reason you have to be exposed to others moral values, even if you don't share them. They override you.
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>>79107111
>Morals are infantile logic

come on anon get serious
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>>79107128
Yh yh you are convinced I must be an evil pedophile to not agree with you whatever believe what you want.

Morality is all subjective that is the entire point of the muslim pedophile post, they are think fucking kids is A ok while we think its gross who is the right one here? Nobody
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>>79103344
what a horrible art style
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>>79107111
Bacteria, insects and plants aren't sapient. Also, how do you determine what's right and wrong, you ethical cultural relativist?
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>>79107171
Morals are basically IT MAKES ME GOOD/IT MAKES ME FEEL BAD

This is baby tier logic in reasoning for something.
>>79107183
It was an example
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We need a new thread, this has devolved into nothing but a philosophical debate.
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>>79107083
Jasper is a fictional character. Why are you comparing yourself to a fictional character that has little chance of free critical thinking?
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>>79107171

Morals are actually pretty complicated, and it's surprising what counts as infantile and adult, and for what reasons they do.
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>>79107215
Its only because of the cunts in here who think an advanced alien species would still follow human morals.
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>>79107215
Better derail it. Quick, post gem feet.
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>>79107203
You're confusing morals with ethic and just embarassing yourself in general.
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>>79107219
Because if a real person in her situation behaved identically, then you'd have no issue with her actions.
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>>79107174
I don't care if you are a pedophile or not, or if you don't want to talk inside those terms. I'm only telling you'll have to submit to the morals of where you live for the simple goal of survival.
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>>79106499
yes.same rule as all the rapings in euroland going on right now
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>>79107254
Morals are ethics
>>79107237
Yh complex ways to describe IT MAKES ME FEEL GOOD/IT MAKES FEEL BAD.

Honestly ask a human if a situation that made them feel confident is evil?

The root of the concept of evil is our ability to feel misery and empathize with others in their misery, if we couldnt do that we would only have an idea of good but not evil.
>>79107277
Ok
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This thread
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>>79107315
>Morals are ethics

and this is why everything you say is wrong
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>>79107264
A person that hasn't seen outside her planet's moral code in all her life? I would understand why she's doing what she's doing. But you're using the Internet, so I'm assuming you come from a country where you can actually know about other people, have the power to get to know more outside your culture and open your mind. Jasper doesn't yet.
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>>79107318

Stupid frogposter.
>>
She went against the protagonists. So far any one that goes against the protagonists or seeks to harm the earth has shown to be 'wrong'.
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What if Bismuth was the one who killed Pink Diamond and Rose Quartz decided to poof him (not shater him because Rose care about everyone) and hide him in a safe place, in case she was able to fix him?

Provided you are willing to take the premise that Rose was an underling of PD and she was the one who began the rebellion.
>>
>>79107361
In your opinion.
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>>79107429
Likewise
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>>79106870
I don't know how anyone can defend that Earth trash
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>>79107369
I agree. However, once exposed to Earth's way of thinking, I would be hard pressed to sympathize with her I'd she still chose to try to ensure the cluster and was OK with earth's destruction. Would I blame her. No, she has been indoctrinated into believing that nothing but what her superiors say matters. Also, you accept that Jasper's philosophy may be flawed?
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>>79107318
>>
Realistically, why would jasper ever defect?

She's high ranking within the caste.
She personally never cared for earth even prior to Rose's rebellion.
And her being stuck as Malachite is only going to increase her ire for earth and everyone on it.
>>
>>79107478
From my perspective? Yeah, Homeworld's philosophy is pretty rough for us and other gems. But the Homeworld gems still have a chance to learn about the Earth and change sides. Just look at Peridot. Despite her prejudices she's tried very hard to understand the CG's point of view, which is why she tried to negotiate with YD. And she only changed because Steven and the gems gave her a chance.

We can't know what will happen to Jasper in the future, so only time will tell.
>>
The idea that Blue Diamond is a fusion makes so little sense but there are a few hints that just bug the shit out of me and make me question what we've been told

The big one is the depiction of a statue of a four-armed gem resembling blue diamond in the sea spire and the smaller one is lapis's outfit which has the diamond split into two halfs
>>
>>79107589
Peridot is a stupid person, she went against the orders and chose her silly feelings instead. The diamonds arent psychopaths they can understand human morality very easily but just dont care.
>>
>>79103344
An antagonist doesn't have to be wrong, an antagonist merely needs to oppose the interests and goals of the protagonist. You don't know the basic words we learn in 4th grade, you're an idiot.
>>
>>79107564
the 2 current ideas is malachite trauma, or homeworld dumping her so she has nowhere to go
>>79106788
I imagine sugilite is how homeworld sees garnet, some war machine that refuses to defuse
>>
>>79107564

Her understanding of fusion is definitely never going to be Garnet's understanding of it. To Garnet fusion is a loving relationship, to Jasper it is a continuous submarine back-and-forth rape session.
>>
>>79107664
I suppose that if HW saw her as Malachite and exiled her, that could work.
It'd be a funny twist if the most loyal gem is excommunicated rather than defecting on her own.
>>
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>>79107635
She went against orders because she realized that her idol isn't actually acting based on logic but out of pure spite. I agree though that she blurted it out and probably regretted it deeply afterwards.
>>
>>79107720
>no logic
What? The earth already had the superweapon they spent millenia making ready to be made and you expect YD just to drop it because of muh humans are special?
>>
>>79107760
The Cluster was put there after Homeworld lost the war because they couldn't create a colony. It sure looks like a move only a sore loser would pull.
>>
>>79107809
Yh it was absolute insurance that Rose and her crew would be dead, Idk why they just didnt blow up the fucking planet instead of wasting all this time.
>>
>>79107564

Betcha Jasper going to come around thanks to the reoccurring theme of love and friendship.

The fact that Malachite has been made a big deal out of mean it's not going to be an one time sort of thing.
>>
>>79106172
They do.
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>>79106870

This is a clear example of the problem with making an orderly, stable, functional and prosperous empire the enemy of your main characters, especially if said main characters are a collection of unstable, oftentimes unlikable misfits.

Unless the people watching are crazy people with 30 different pronouns to their name and a desperate need to feel special since their lives are boring, they'll typically side with the orderly and prosperous villains with solid plans and credentials, instead of the chaotic, random rebels who keep fucking up.

Happens with everything following the "good chaos rebels vs. evil order empire" plot structure these days, from classics like Star Wars to new stuff like SU. People take a good look at both sides, and they choose the strong horse out of the two in most cases.

Taking a stroll into /pol/ territory for a moment, it's probably indicative of how modern, semi-chaotic democracy and diplomacy have led to lots of instability, confusion and issues, whereas orderly violence-expanded empires of old like Rome prospered quite a bit longer than the relatively-young and already-crumbling diplomatic nations of today. We've tried new shit, it's not working out, and now people are fascinated by old working solutions and even new untried ones. Plus, modern culture generally makes its heroes blander and cleaner-cut than its villains, which makes villains more interesting.
>>
>>79107930
Indeed the entire plot for the series is retarded its just rebellious retards justifying defying an orderly civilization.
>>
>>79107930

That's the point. We are meant to question if the villains are truly wrong for their actions and view point.

If we didn't then things would be much more boring and the story would feel much more artificial. How many people wake up in the morning and just do 'evil' acts for the sake of it? Even Hitler had his reasons.
>>
>>79108014

Justification is pointless.

Actions are determined by who has the will to do what, and the consequences follow.

There is no other form of morality than 'make something happen' or 'remain idle and accept what others make happen'.

>>79108070

We still don't know why Homeworld conquers other worlds. Aside from more minerals to breed, it's not really clear why they expand their empire.
>>
>the crystal gems
I just realized how lame this sounds
>>
So just to clarify

Am I the only one on /co/ who's okay with both being extremely attracted by Jasper AND accepting that she's a villain?

Like, I fully expect that she'll either be the one person who Steven CAN'T convert, thus teaching him a valuable life lesson, or that she'll aid the Crystal Gems but only in the heat of the moment and still hate them and all they represent.

You can admire someone and accept that they want to murder you, too.
>>
>>79108221

No. Attractiveness can have very little to do with someone's character.
>>
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>What exactly did she do that was wrong?

She doesn't like singing.
>>
>>79108146
>Aside from more minerals to breed, it's not really clear why they expand their empire.
Isn't reproduction of an entire species more than reason enough? I mean, at least from the Gempire's POV. I'm also assuming that mineral-based life forms evolved long before organic life, and so they have a presumption that the universe is their's.
>>
>>79108221
Not at all.
>>
>>79108221
Nigga, masochistic fantasies and /co/ go hand in hand
>>
>>79108338

Unless they have a natural lifespan limitation, however, their only attrition would be from invading other planets and internal strife.
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>>79108014

Now see, I think the plot makes plenty of sense, in that it's two biased factions acting out their biases violently in the hopes of coming out as dominant and getting their way, A.K.A. every war ever seen by mankind.

CGs want to protect Earth and humanity, hate Homeworld for both holding opposing viewpoints and taking a stance against personal shit like fusion. Homeworld wants Earth gone since it's not only useless, but an active threat/base for threats, and the CGs took out many soldiers in the past during their massive treasonous act.

If you want to talk about shit that makes no sense, how about we talk about the hard-on for humans the CGs have, despite all proof to the contrary regarding their worth? I mean, all of this shit that's happened so far, including many giant monsters, a huge number of mystic sites that should be accessible or at least visible to curious humans, and even an actual full-on invasion of a resort town facilitated by a massive ship, which should have been so visible that every world government would be watching while sweating profusely. And yet, no human response to any of the insane shit going on, none whatsoever?

Humans just plain don't have any strength, intelligence or even simple self-preservation instinct in SU. No one ever tries to fight things, no one ever freaks out about aliens, no one even raises a goddamn eyebrow about anything unless the plot demands tension. In any sane universe, humans would go nuts over an alien invasion, and some sort of armed force would attempt to acquire their tech/fight them off. And yet, humans just don't care, no effort to fight back, no effort to understand or look into anything, not even a basic inkling of fear for their lives or shock regarding the events happening around them. They're practically walking goddamn shrubs with no conscious thought.

Why in the fuck did Rose want them protected again? An alien boner for an individual specimen?
>>
>>79108214
sounds better than "The homeworld gems"
>>
>>79108146

We know that their method of breeding is harmful to life, specifically life on earth.

Many people resort to violence or harm to spread their influence, doesn't matter the reason why they do this...it still doesn't make it necessarily 'right'.
>>
>>79108469

I still want to know the answer.

I wish we knew the answer.
>>
>>79108214
blame pearl and rose
>>
File: Buena_Girl.jpg (85 KB, 540x720) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
Buena_Girl.jpg
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>same va

what went wrong?
>>
>>79108214
It's just because Earth is apparently in the Crystal System. Rose is not very creative.
>>
>>79105002
thirdimpact.jpg
>>
File: match.jpg (42 KB, 499x499) Image search: [iqdb] [SauceNao] [Google]
match.jpg
42 KB, 499x499
Come on guys, someone start a 5th Peridot thread
Thread replies: 247
Thread images: 67
Thread DB ID: 452293



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