If not him, then who?
He'd be less boring if they focused on his being OPERATOR AS FUCK like in that image.
Hal should be OG Lantern, Guy should be Comedy Lantern, Kyle should be Artist's Wet Dream Lantern and John should be Operator Lantern.
Kyle Rayner hasn't been interesting since Rebirth.
Guy Gardner was terrible as Warrior
Hal was interesting as Spectre and under Johns. Otherwise, he's awful.
Is John boring, or is he just the only lantern to still never really get the spotlight? Mosaic was great!
he is supposed to be kind of unimaginative, yeah. that's what makes him interesting. all these powers that rightfully belong with a creative like kyle rayner, found in the hands of a no-nonsense marine. He doesn't make big springy hands, he makes a brick that smashes you. It's boring, but it's variation that isn't stale.
You know...I was looking into John stewart origin.
He was suppose to be a black version of guy gardner. You know being a jerk and stubborn at times except he make black jokes and become smarter than guy gardner.
Hal has an origin story, a motivation, a supporting cast, and villains who give a shit.
Does anyone know who John Stewart even is as a person? "He's an architect", "he's a Marine sniper", what the fuck does that tell me about why this motherfucker is one of the five most willful men on Earth or who and what he cares about?
wasn't his thing, at least during the Geoff era, that he made needless little details in his constructs like individual bolts in light bridges and making guns with full moving parts?
Don't let the European politicians hear you say that, they will claim that you are a racist.
That's what happens when you make a character specifically for people to self-insert on.
The self-inserters grow up and start jacking the character up to mary sue OC faggot levels.
It happened to Kyle Rayner, it happened to Peter Parker and it'll probably happen to Kamala Khan.
Your implication that OP has a problem with race and not an individual implies that you think there's nothing wrong with John Stewart.
I'm curious to see SOMEONE in this thread defend his personality or even explain what the fuck it is, since it has yet to happen. Care to give it a go?
>re-reading Kyle run
why did Johns pulled a reverse Gohan on us
Isn't that Hal? He is the "leader" of the Green Lanterns. He is usually always right. He is said to be the greatest Green Lantern. He is the one that overwrited/overpower the restriction placed on a Green Lantern power ring and killed an Oan with it.
>I don't like this particular character but I can't explain why because I haven't read jackshit about the character, so I'll just call him boring to make up for my lack of actual criticism!
Personally, If i was writing the characters. I going to make up some bullshit like...these four lanterns human shows 4 type of a willful mind.
John Stewart = Patience.
Guy Gardner = stubborn
Hal Jordan = Focusing
Kyle Rayner = being creative
What does "focusing" mean?
Hal's basically the same character as Guy in that his version of being willful is "do what I want on a whim, anyone who gives me orders can fuck off", the only difference is that Hal's chill and suave while Guy has the angry "always second best" chip on his shoulder and no social graces.
>John never had a thing.
sure he did, he used to have a temper and be the "rookie" lantern but those roles passed onto Guy and Kyle and then the DCAU zapped most of his personality and now the only things anybody can think of regarding him are Xanshi, buildings, and OORAH
>He is said to be the greatest Green Lantern
That's not an informed trait though like a fanfiction character would have upon introduction, it's because he's been around for fifty years realtime so he has the most feats and accomplishments in sheer numbers.
Remember that time when John stewert was destiny to cuckold the hawk-guy?
That is the most worst message in the show.
Everyone's a rookie in their origin story, that's not a character trait. I'll give you "angry" though, his original motivation was basically "the man is holdin' me down and I'm sassy about it", which IS a lot more than he's had in every story post-O'Neil/Adams
I'm curious though, because I can sort of answer this question for Hal, Guy, and Kyle, but I can't answer it for John: what about him makes him more willful or "able to overcome great fear" than an ordinary person? There are tons of angry black guys in the world, why's he special? How did he get to be that way?
Or is he, as I suspect, the only GL who doesn't have a proper origin beyond "Guardians told Hal to pick another backup guy at random"?
>Or is he, as I suspect, the only GL who doesn't have a proper origin beyond "Guardians told Hal to pick another backup guy at random"?
The Guardians picked him out themselves but I'm not sure they ever elaborated on why
Maybe they added another reason in the mid 80s when John got a bigger part in the book but I haven't read that stuff yet
I also don't know if John ever really got a proper origin story update, I know he had one in the recent Secret Origins book but that didn't clarify it much either, it just removed him being Hal's backup
>I know he had one in the recent Secret Origins book but that didn't clarify it much either, it just removed him being Hal's backup
I think it established his mother's name for the first time and that she was a politician who got assassinated or something? I can't really remember.
Why was he the main GL in JLU anyway? Hal and Kyle possess far more impressive resumes and histories with the League. Was there something going on in the comics at that time that I'm unaware of?
>Was there something going on in the comics at that time that I'm unaware of?
When STAS started Hal was Parallax/dead so they used Kyle for synergy I guess? Kyle got a lot of exposure in the mid 90s
For JL/JLU Hal was still dead/The Spectre so he was off the table but they went with John over Kyle for diversity
So he was picked to get a ring not because he's got a super amount of willpower like the others, but because they predicted he'd develop Guardian powers?
Okay...but WHY does he develop Guardian powers?
No, what happened was Sinestro and Kyle fought across an airfield and one of the planes there said Jordan.
Hal's only appearance in the DCAU is as a Lantern from an alternate timeline in one episode of JLU.
He's a living man half in death.
Yeah, the thing about Bruce Timm is his approach to legacy characters was always to combine them.
Tim Drake had Jason Todd's origin, Kyle looked like Hal and got his ring from Abin, Wally was a CSI with no Barry.
When they were introducing the league in Superman they decided to use Kyle and Wally because at the time they were the ones in the costumes and they wanted to promote the new blood in this eventual Justice League cartoon.
However when they started assembling the final team years later they went for John because they realized they didn't have a black character and he was basically a blankslate they could do whatever they wanted with.
The show's occasional hints at Wally's backstory tended towards being weird and a little contradictory. What we actually SAW suggest Wally was the grown man working in the lab getting struck by lightning, but then they'd sneak easter eggs in like that costume, or Wally's boss being a guy who looks like Barry, I think Wally mentioned his uncle offhandedly once, and then JLU and TT shared VAs for Flash/Kid Flash and Speedy.
He has gone beyond the green and found the red.
Something something the Red was Sinestro and him awakening his Guardian powers. I can't remember it's been a while since I've read Mosaic.
Why is it so important to have a black founder? Where is the asian founder, or the hispanic one? The whole idea of protecting and policing the world is a pretty white one to begin with.
A lot of what Mister Terrific is capable of can also be found in Batman and Iron Man. Not the easiest thing to market, especially when you already have Batman on the team as the token unpowered gadget user.
I would have used
The only way John Stewart the comic character in the early 2000s and John Stewart the cartoon character in the early 2000s resembled each other is that they were black guys with Lantern rings
DCAU John was basically just Mcduffie's original character do not steal. It's a fact. Whether it's good or bad is up to interpretation
>why did Johns pulled a reverse Gohan on us
What do you mean? Gohan ended up as a lame jobber after the Cell arc despite being hyped up as Goku's successor. I'd say Kyle is a pretty standard Gohan type character.
>a marine architect
what kind of stupid fucking job is that?
I don't know much about Hal but from what I have seen in /co/, and how anons talk about him, he is a fearless cocky smug retard who ends up being someone's sex slave at some point.
He appeared in a lot of stuff during that time too. His solo, YJ, Green Arrow, Batgirl, other Batbooks, etc, so thankfully there's a lot of good Tim stuff.
Unfortunately has the years drag on, the numbers of good Tim and bad Tim are getting closer and closer, if bad Tim hasn't already been in more already.
Not anymore, he's a Star Sapphire now
Yeah right, and now you got newfags who actually like Jason more than Tim too which I find quite repulsive.
It would be one thing if Red Hood was starring in quality story lines like Grayson but he's not. He's simply not.
He was, but then Simon Baz came out. Simon Baz is literally the exact same shit as John Stewart, except the racism he's dealing with is justified, since he's a terrorist van thief with a ski mask and Qran writings on his arm carrying a gun. Also he's less interesting in general.
Tim/Wally/Kyle are my favorite DC heroes and Peter Parker/Dick Rider are my favorite Marvel heroes
I've been reading a lot more graphic novels and manga recently because the big 2 seems to have a personal dilemma against me
JOhn was actually sweet back in Mosaic, but making him a soldier is pretty much THE worst thing you could have done to him. He's much more interesting as the eloquent architect. 'Cause Guy's dumb, Hal's dumb, and Kyle isn't particularly educated, so make John a counterpoint to that. Bring back him quoting old novels and playing jazz on his piano and shit. It's a lot more interesting than Serious Marine #2325
I think you may be asking for a bit too much from writers, anon. When uncultured people attempt to create cultured characters it results in situations where a so-called fantastic artist is just painting photo-realistic portraits and similar things.
The problem with John is that his personality started out as, basically, jive-talking black stereotype. Kinda like Luke Cage, except he even had an afro. But as fun as it is, we can't really have that after the 70s so they took it out, and never really filled the void with anything else.
This is a typical post in the John Stewart circlejerk on CBR.
Darkseid War: Green Lantern made them angry.
I'm a Kylefag, Guy is my second favorite.
I would never try to claim that Hal isn't the main GL unless it's a JSA book and then it's Alan Scott.
Do they even read the books?
John was Hal's understudy, he literally got work when Hal couldn't be fucked to do GL shit.
honestly I'd like to see a Baz book just so we can fget some information on the fucker. Everyone Knows the main GLs, Baz is a mystery who healed his brother once, that's all we know.
He started out as a fucking understudy "marginalized" is his natural state.
What is the reasoning behind making a complicated mechanical device with the ring? Is John Stewart's Lantern gun better than just firing a bullet or shooting with the ring? Is his vice better than just a normal ring construct?
I'm kind of tempted to post an image of that issue's Comic Book Roundup score just to rile them up, except that website is retarded and listed Jeff King as the writer
Atleast Kyle gets to kind of exist, unlike his best friend and his best friend's entire family.
I don't get what they were thinking. It's JL story, Hal is GL in JL, why would King write story about someone else?
Hal's not doesn't draw off focus or obstinance, which is Guy's source of willpower, but just by being completely fearless.
He isn't capable of considering the repercussions so naturally his own desire is the only voice in his head that matters, he's unburdened by doubt.
That's also why he's generally kind of a shit head and prone to impulsiveness.
Yeah. I mean, it's good to have favorite character, but sheesh, tone it down and spread your love to many.
Of old Guy stories, I only read JLI and I loved his over the top FUCK YOU COMMIES! AMERICA, YEAH!
some of the best stories Iron Man had were commie busting. I'd kill for a book where he teams up with his old Soviet Armor foes for the good of the world but that'd require him to get someone who actually understands politics, scifi or something like that.
>Mary Sue editorial baby like Kyle.
Kyle was never a mary sue. One of the biggest character arcs with Kyle was the fact that he always felt inadequate and too inexperienced due to always being compared to Hal who was heralded as the greatest lantern ever, you know, before going evil. Plus Kyle seemingly being chosen to be the last GL at random by Ganthet was another thing he felt shitty for, because he thought it meant he wasn't worthy of the ring.
John's problem is that his gimmick is inherently that he's the black green lantern. Everything else is just stuff they tried to stick into him over the years, and none of it has been that iconic beyond failing to save a planet from exploding, which is great as a moment of failure from which he learns to be better, but not something you can really use to promote as a definite character trait. They've tried to push the marine angle but it's pretty boring when it's his sole driving characteristic.
Ditto. I was happy to see them appear in Thunderbolts.
And, unless I am mistaken, Infinity: The Heist had some of Iron Man's old villains, right?
I don't think you know what a mary sue is outside of fanfiction. Kyle was a typical shonen manga protagonist, odds were always against him and he was shown to not be good enough, but by the end of it he did it his way and his way was superior. His entire run reads like a shonen manga too where everyone else gets shat on so he can look the bestest.
>His entire run reads like a shonen manga too where everyone else gets shat on so he can look the bestest.
God forbid for the title hero to have his moment to shine. And his run never shits on anyone. IF anything, the entire Kyle run makes is painfully obvious how much he respects and looks up to Hal and how much he appreciates and seeks guidance from the people who came before him, like John Stewart. It's incredibly how much the books genuflects while trying to appease the butthurt Hal fans.
You're right; but recently Kyle has been, maybe not a Mary Sue, but certainly something near that level. It started with New Guardians, and then when Justin Jordan took over it became really awful. Though it looks like Tom King is fixing that.
fuck johns massive boner for older characters.
I think you mean Tim. Jason has a niche where he's comfortable in now that he's been reformed plus it suits him well. Nobody has any clue what Tim is good for beyond being in Titans.
To be fair Batman has been successful at the box office prior to the disaster that was Batman & Robin compared to Green Lantern who only had the one movie who bombed.
With that said, I'm still Hal all the way for the next attempt at Green Lantern on the big screen although most likely they will go for a Green Lantern Corps film with Hal and John which I'm totally still down for.
I still wanna see someone new take a shot now. Like, if Becky Cloonan's good on Punisher, I wouldn't mind seeing what she could do with Red Hood for example.
Shit, I'm not really good at picking creative teams, I'm just using her as an example here.
>That time when Stewart goes Indigo and Kills Mogo with a fucking sniper
should we give every series to King
can he redeem everybody?
He was like in the cia and shit
he's smarter than anyone writing for the big 2
thats why Omega Men, Grayson, Vision and Sheriff of Babylon like some of the best comics of last year
what's his ceiling /co/?
he might become the goat for my generatin who grew up with the same characters he did
i dont read what bunn write,i tried with aquaman and wont try again but then again i dont hate John. he made aquaman and GL popular again and brought new things to the table
i love orange and indigo lanternsbut i just dont like Hal beside his friendship with Sinestro.hes not boring, more like an asshole and Guy is better a being that.
Give Ennis to write him, and retcon him into a former special forces. Make it like Judd Winnick's run and show Jason's stint in the military after he was brought back from the dead.
>Effigy a shit
I extremely disagree with your opinion
You're entitled to that, I just didn't find anything particularly compelling about his powers or origin, and he never had any defining stories like Nero and Force. (I did like his team-up with Killer Frost though, that could have been a good dynamic.)
I like him because he's what Kyle would be if he didn't have someone like Alex to push him in the right direction and because things involving the Controllers gets my dick hard. All of Kyle's villains are just facets of himself except Force maybe.
They'll stop loving it.
>That goes right along with everything I've seen and heard. I might skip this one. I'm not interested in seeing John get sidelines for Guy Gardner, nor be a buddy with Guy Gardner. I think it's pretty clear that John is not THE star of this book, but rather it's a book that he's in. I'm kinda' thinking (at least from the perspective of a John Stewart fan) it may be a good idea to get John out of the Corps title, because it's too easy for some writer to bury him under a bazillion characters or focus on someone else. When you read Superman, you know who it is about, and that typically doesn't change. With John Stewart's books, we never really know anymore going into them, and it's always liable to change on us.
Oh, and Tom Taylor said that he's Guyfag, but he also loves many alien Lanterns, Two-Six included.
They got spoiled when GLC became John centric, now nothing else will do
I like Guy more so I'm glad EOO will have more of him, god forbid John has to be a co-star
>nor be a buddy with Guy Gardner
Oh yeah, I remember that they don't like it when John and Hal are shown as friends either.
>Oh yeah, I remember that they don't like it when John and Hal are shown as friends either.
Because he's token best black friend.
I'm glad, anyway. More Guy and Two-Six, better. I'd love them to both go Red, but that's only because I'm Redfag.
He also has an interesting backstory: He thought his brother had been stolen by one of the dragon creatures that live on his planet, so he went and killed it with his hammer, but realized he was wrong, and adopted its three children. THen he found his brother and they became a duo nomad team, because their nomadic tribe had moved on without them, until his brother died and he got the ring. So yeah, he also has a sweet-ass hammer.
>When you read Superman, you know who it is about, and that typically doesn't change.
>With John Stewart's books, we never really know anymore going into them
These people are fucking delusional. Corps isn't just the adventures of one Lantern. That's why it's called Corps, as in TEAM
I won't deny that there aren't crazy Halfags or Kylefags but the die-hard John fans always seem a little delusional
Guy fags are pretty chill, maybe because they've accepted that he doesn't need to be the main lantern
>Guy fags are pretty chill, maybe because they've accepted that he doesn't need to be the main lantern
This. Other three have fanbases who bicker with other camps, Guyfags are always in "if he's there, good, if he's not, well what can you do".
With Hal I wouldn't mind if he wasn't in the spotlight all the time, I just worry that they'd fuck him over then write him off like they did the first time they wanted to get rid of him
John fans aren't wrong for worrying either, he got fucked over a lot in the 90s and then there were the rumors he was getting killed in the New 52
Kyle fans are babies, nothing that bad has happened to him