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Otome-kei thread
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Old thread >>8724093

What is otome-kei?
>Japanese for 'maiden'
>Focuses on a feminine and quirky look
>No set rules
>Outfits often use colour popping, interesting print combinations, and contrasting materials
>Generally has a kitsch or twee vibe
>Sometimes overlaps with casual lolita but is still a separate style

Main otome brands:
>Emily Temple Cute/Shirley Temple Cute
>Jane Marple
>Leur Getter
>MILK

Other Suitable Brands*:

>Amavel
>Ank Rogue
>Axes Femme
>Bortsprungt
>Candy Stripper
>Excentrique
>Fint
>Franche Lippee
>Grimoire
>Lois Crayon
>Lolita brands (accessories, legwear, bags, mini skirts, cardigans/boleros)
>Melantrick Hemlighet
>Merlot Camp
>Q-pot
>Wonder Rocket


Suitable Non-Japanese Brands*:
>Alannah Hill
>Cath Kidston
>Dangerfield
>Hello Bones Jones (Indie)
>Miss Patina
>Modcloth
>Mulberry Chronicles (Indie)
>Peppermint Fox (Indie)


Non-japanese Socks/Shoes*:
>Sock Dreams, Teja Jamilla
>Melissa Shoes, Bait Footwear, Dkode Shoes, Neosen, Fleuvog

*NB: these brands are not all specifically otome, but sometimes produce suitable items
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Appreciation Blogs:

>http://axesfemme.tumblr.com/
>http://emikyuforever.tumblr.com/
>http://emilytemplecute.tumblr.com/
>http://fuckyeahotomekei.tumblr.com/
>http://otomeclub.tumblr.com/
>http://otomecoords.tumblr.com/
>http://otomestyle.tumblr.com/


Individual Blogs**:
http://altered-imagery.tumblr.com
http://angiiichan.tumblr.com
http://aralunanim.tumblr.com
http://classicaltyrianjubilee.tumblr.com
http://cling123.tumblr.com
http://endless8.tumblr.com
http://fannyrosie.tumblr.com
http://grandma-kei.tumblr.com
http://herajika.tumblr.com
http://infiniteneeya.tumblr.com/
http://kairii.tumblr.com
http://kaya-kueh.tumblr.com
http://lilythdark.tumblr.com
http://mademoiselle-iona.tumblr.com
http://onlyeasy.tumblr.com
http://pinkstrawberrytea.tumblr.com
http://rm-marionette.tumblr.com
http://sakuraimayura.tumblr.com
http://sapphira-doll.tumblr.com
http://sinneddonuts.tumblr.com
http://strawberrymelody.tumblr.com
http://vysanthe.tumblr.com
http://whimsicalmori.tumblr.com
http://xylia-x.tumblr.com

**NB: Many of these blogs dabble in both lolita and otome or exist in the grey area between the two. There's also varying experience levels.
>>
How rare is it for Peppermint Fox/Mulberry Chronicles collections to come up for resale or rerelease? I am smitten with a few that are long gone.
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>>8784825
I found this couple who dress really nicely. This sort of makes me think of the male equivalent for the typical otome style or could easily be worn by a woman too!
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>>8784830
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>>8784835
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>>8784841
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>>8784843
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>>8784844
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>>8784846
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>>8784830
Link to blog?
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>>8784717
I was actually kind of wondering this myself. Most of the second hand and resale places/pages I'm looking at are for lolita, and you almost never see any indie brand. Are there any good places to shop that I've missed? Add to the list/remove useless ones/etc. So far I have:

SECONDHAND WEBSITES:
wunderwelt
closet-child
lacemarket
takoyakico
mbok
yahoo auctions japan

SECONDHAND FACEBOOK GROUPS:
Lolita Sales UK
Lolita Sales EU
Lolita Sales in English
Lolita Sales - Worldwide
Angelic Pretty Sales Worldwide
Plus Size Lolita Sales (English Only)
Otome Sales Worldwide
Otome Kei Sales Brazil
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>>8781396
>>8781394
Bless you, anon
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>>8786017
Girly cute
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Could we post some pictures of otome/casual lolita) outfits using lolita pieces? I want to transition to otome, but buying from otome brands us much harder.
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>>8787589
>Chocolate Rosette
My heart. I thought I was ready to see it again after not getting a ticket.

But yeah, I'll help dig for some. The line between casual lolita and otome can get a little thin, though, and I'm no expert.
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>>8787602
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>>8787605
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>>8787613
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>>8787616
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>>8787602
Thanks anon! I'll dump a few things I think might fit.
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>>8787618
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>>8787627
(obsessed with these color combos)
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>>8787631
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>>8787634
I want this cardigan.. and the boots.. and the whole outfit.
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>>8787634
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>>8787644

>>8787641
I can't be certain, but the cardigan looks like Jane Marple!
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>>8787652
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>>8787653
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>>8787658
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>>8787663
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>>8787666
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>>8787669
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Are Jane Marple lucky packs any good?
Does someone also have experience with ETC and Leur Getter packs?
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>>8791532
Last year's LG pack was really disappointing, pathetic, really. ETC has also been bad the past couple of years- basically very few prints or statement pieces, not even many nice basics. All cheap trashy looking things.
It seems like last year's ETC was better than the two years before it because people at least got the deer dress and some nice cardigans.
I don't know anything about JM.
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>>8791553
Thanks for the quick answer anon! I now know what to avoid.
Hopefully someone else can enlighten us about Jane Marple.
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>>8791848
There was another anon a few threads ago who I think said the JM one wasn't worth it. It's archived - or she might be here.
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Can anyone report on Lois Crayon's quality and fit? Is it on par with the pricetag? I'm kind of intrigued by their whole concept.
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I'm fairly new to otome, and still trying to figure out how to put together good outfits. And I just received IW's Crown Jewels Collection jsk in bordeaux but it's too short on me to use as a lolita dress, but it would look really cute as an otome dress I think?

BUT I have no clue how to work with it, do you guys have any advice?

I thought I posted this question earlier but I guess I just dreamed it.
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Does anyone know if I can find these socks somewhere besides Chiffon Rose?
I don't really want to pay $15 shipping for just socks when I could make a bigger order if they're on Taobao or something.
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>>8793043
You might find some people getting rid of some from lps? Not sure if they'd been included though.

I'm not sure if you can get it from Taobao, but even if you can, it's probably not the real deal (if that bothers you).
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>>8793060
I'm so dumb, I never even considered they were from a known brand (or at least well-known enough to have lps). What brand are they from?
It's not a huge deal to me to find replicas on Taobao, they're only socks.
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>>8793069
Grimoire

>>8792814
Pic related? Everything is Jane Marple except the beret and necklace.
I'm worried the dress will look good if it's too short though. I hope the bodice isn't too short?
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>>8793069
They're from Grimoire. I don't think replicas of any of their socks like this exist, only their tights, really.

Anyone know what happened to this girl? I used to like her posts.
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>>8793069
They're actually in stock still.
http://www.grimoire-onlineshop.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=11169
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>>8793078
>>8793082
>>8793084
Thank you so much!
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>>8793069
They're Grimoire, it's even listed by brand on Chiffon Rose. The good news is a few different online shops have started stocking them and they may pop up secondhand on Lacemarket or even Y!J and Mbok if you get your clothes from auctions. So there miiiight be a few different ways to get cheaper or at least justifiably combined shipping.
>>
how easily blurred is the line between otome and casual lolita? They seem to borrow elements of eachother could you simultaneously be both otome and lolita?
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Did anybody here order Hello Bones Jones's rain bunny dress? Has anybody gotten it? I didn't have the money for it but I'm interested in reviews or pictures if anyone's got them.
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>>8793306
By casual lolita, I guess you mean toned down lolita. Because when I think casual, I think not so frilly cut sews. But anyways I think you could be both at the same time. You'd have to bring out the strong otome elements like popping colors/clashing patterns. You'll also need to drop the poof or have a little poof only.

See >>8787605
>>8787618
>>8787625
>>8787666

I think Lief has a lot of dresses that can go both ways since they rely heavily on prints for their dresses and not other details as much.
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Small dump
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>>8794505
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>>8794510
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>>8794512
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>>8794513
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>>8794514
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>>8794517
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>>8794514
I really like how muted this is despite chocolate. And the dusty pink is so nice. I'm really tired of how ott chocolate coords can be.
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Anyone know any nice places to buy colourful cardigans or boleros?
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>>8787641
Not the same cardigan as OP but Miss Patina has a very smiliar one
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>>8800270
>found it
>out of stock
ffffff
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Would things like this be considered otome?
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>>8800519
I think it lacks some of the structure you tend to see with otome, but that's probably up for debate. I would totally wear it though.
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>>8802753
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>>8802755
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>>8802758
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>>8802760
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>>8802762
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>>8802764
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>>8802766
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Can I get some coord help?
I have the dress in the middle and I am in love. I am dying trying to coord it though. Any ideas? The coral color looks odd when I use a red cardigan, maybe a mustard yellow?
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>>8802959
Dropped my photo...
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>>8802966
Maybe try an ivory or cream colored cardigan to match the labels?
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>>8802971
I haven't been able to fine a cardigan or even a shirt in that color yet, sadly. I think that would look good though.
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>>8802966
I would go with a cream or lighter yellow bolero, if you want to go that route. The color doesn't need to be exactly the same.
A light or royal blue cardigan might also look nice!
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>>8802966
Spring green? Might look cute with lace stitch or tiny white polka dot embroidery.

>>8802979
I like the idea of blue too.
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>>8802979
>>8802988
I think I will try those three. I can order three colors and see what looks best.

As for the embroidery, that sounds fun. Maybe I will get a cheap cardigan and practice that. I have never done it on clothes cause I am too afraid. Sadly, I am much too tall for a lot of brand blouses and cardigans.
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>>8803006
It's a handy skill to have - especially if you've got a really specific motif in mind that nobody's manufacturing. I guess I was thinking of those sweaters you can get that have the tiny polka dots on them like this one from Uniqlo
http://www.uniqlo.com/us/product/women-extra-fine-merino-crewneck-cardigan-155776.html#69~/women/sweaters/cardigan/extra-fine-merino/~
I've got one in grey and tend to find it's easier to mix with stripes and plaids than cardigans that have the dots actually printed on. Maybe it's something to do with the extra texture?
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>>8803020
Oh, I love those. I feel like all the colors are too dark for this dress though. I have a skirt I might buy one to go with though!
I long for the pokadot cardigans like ETC makes with the bigger dots. Might be hard to embroider those though.
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>>8787653
what is the name of that dress?
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I'm curious, what do you think are the rarest or most sought after dresses in otome kei?
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>>8803199
The JM book prints seem to be the most sought after. Also, their recent chocolate print going by prices.
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>>8803199
I'd say maybe ETC gentleman rabbit ptint and Jane Marple royal stamps
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>>8803214
Both of them are quite recent so I think when the next nice print comes out they will drop in price.
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>>8803252
I mean all the book prints. The older ones tend to get decent returns on the secondhand market even after age is factored in. Probably the most consistently popular theme.
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>>8803199
JM would be their British Library OP, their 3-strap shoes, regimental stripe pieces are always popular.

ETC - hard to tell because it changes ove time but it at least used to always be Gentleman Rabbit

Leur Getter would probably be their cat dress.
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>>8803030
It's called Chocolatier Print Sleeveless OP
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I'm a Lolita just getting into Otome, are there any staples I'd need to get first, or should I just get dresses I like and go for it? I have a lot of plain accessories, footwear, and bags that would match so I can build on those easily enough, if need be.
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>>8803354
Cardigans, a good coat and a proper hat.
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>>8803447
Thanks anon! I'm pretty short in the cardigan department so I'll start picking up some cute ones.
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>>8803451
It's one of those things where you don't need cardigans for a coord to be otome, but it really helps to have a few colors around if you're struggling to find a way to wear a new dress.

Then a hat (or beret) and coat because they can really help pull everything together. You can get fantastic gobelin coats from JM.
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>>8803354
You want blouses that are simpler in shape than lolita (so less frilly/lacy/ruffly, but with unique or interesting details like a cute collar or embroidery), cardigans, legwear (tights and socks in various colours, patterns, textures, etc), quirky accessories, plus some berets, hair accessories or hats in general.
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>>8802966
I'd go with blue and red
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>>8808225
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>>8808229
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Damn the lucky bastard that bought these. Been wanting these for years, but had no hope of ever getting them.
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>>8811013
JM website is almost empty. Here's hoping that they're prepping stock for Grand Bazaar...
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I lost the picture of one of my favorite coords and I was hoping someone here had it saved. It's a collage of two photos of an asian girl with long hair and glasses(?) wearing something like a blue vest/blazer and matching shorts. Does anyone know what I'm talking about?
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this came up on my dash as otome
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>>8813818
Is this it?
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>>8814225
Normally her coords are on point. This outfit is just missing a cardi or blouse under the dress.
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>>8814491
Not the same anon but was pretty sure she did have something else in her co-ord so went back to check. There was a cardigan in some photos.

Funny I'm actually not normally too much of a fan, but I think she has very......interesting I guess? combinations so I follow her in hopes of learning a little and adding a bit more variety to my own coords
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>>8814464
Yes, thank you so much!
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>>8814225
>>8814658
>>8814491
It would probably look better without the belt and shirt on top of the jsk. the cardi looks fine
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This girl tags these as otome, are they?
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>>8814976
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So I guess the better ETC prints are continuing.
I feel like there is something off about it still though. I personally prefer the colors to be more muted.
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>>8814978
This one honestly looks a little too taobao-y for me, if that makes any sense. I think it's the blouse and the shoes.
>>8814976
Here, too, the shoes bother me, but whatever. I don't take my outfits like this "otome" because I feel like they're super fucking basic. Not saying it needs to be OTT or anything, but without any accessorizing or anything, it's hardly an outfit, really.
So basically, it's up to individual preference, but I wouldn't necessarily call them otome due to the styling. She also called the skirt coord lolita, so there's that as well.

>>8815655
I like navy and mint JSKs a lot. The straps are placed weirdly, but the print is cute. I love bagels.
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Does anyone else feel like there is a lack of Japanese info on what otome kei is (nowadays)? Sometimes it seems like people have made up a Western version of what we think it is, especially on tumblr, and people posting stuff that is labeled as lolita in Japanese. When I look at the early egl posts about it it seems a bit different.
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>>8815755
What's bad about the coord in the pic you posted? It's more mature than all the ETC cutesy coords, but I'd still call it otome.
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>>8817599
Huh? Anon was only talking about the pictures in the linked posts.

Btw, I really like the way the coord is displayed in that pic.
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>>8817613
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>>8817615
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>>8817617
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>>8817619
I really like how she coorded these plain dresses.
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>>8817621
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>>8817624
Friend goals ;_;
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Does anyone have good offbrand accessory store recommendations for otome?
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>>8817626
Friend goals x 2
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>>8817475
I think it got taken over by ETC styling since that was closer to lolita taste. To me, JM and other J-British brands are quintessential otome, though ETC and Leur Getter are still lovely.

I also have the feeling people wearing lolita dresses as otome has diluted the style?
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>>8817475
>>8817631

Here's the link to the Jane Marple keywords on a couple of lookbook-type sites:


http://wear.jp/coordinate/?type_id=2&brand_id=7930
https://coordisnap.com/mode/list/index/%EF%BD%BC%EF%BE%9E%EF%BD%AA%EF%BD%B0%EF%BE%9D%EF%BE%8F%EF%BD%B0%EF%BE%8C%EF%BE%9F%EF%BE%99

Or you could search google images for ジェーン マープル コーデ, it should give you some Japanese results.
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How often does JM restock their Regular line?
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>>8817475
japanese don't really have otome as a thing, it's more of a brand loyalty to ETC, MILK, or JM. The closest thing of otome you will find in magazines like zipper are all categorized into the broad "harajuku style", some people also tag it as "soft lolita" after aoki misako, but it's a relatively new term and I've only seen it a handful times on twitter or ig. Most girls just tag the brand or call it lolita.
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>>8817626
It really weird me out to see groups of people dressed so similarly.
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>>8818033
Online or in store?
Depends if the release is popular or not.
Online - I've never seen it happen.
In store - Occasionally, but usually it is the less popular cuts.
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I don't think there's helping this girl..
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>>8818164
But there was a style called otome
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>>8818033
Jane Marple never restocks. They restock their shoes sometimes, that happened with their 4-strap shoes 2 or 3 times but now they are mostly sold out for good. Sometimes they restock from cancelled orders if the buyer wasn't able to pay. But that rarely happens. And if they take an item from their site, it never returns.
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>>8819825
Damn, she sounds combative right off the starting block.

Did someone at least tell her the dusty tone of the sweater doesn't match the saturated tone of the jsk?
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>>8819843
Honestly, I've never seen anything about "otome" as a style in itself used/written in Japanese, save for maybe the "Otome no Sewing" books. Even there, it covers different area than what the west considers otome or brands that are typically considered otome.
Can anyone link to some old egl stuff regarding it or? I always kind of assumed it was a miscommunication/translation.

Did anyone end up buying pic related?
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>>8819825
She's not actually into jfashion. She just has no friends so turns to a random internet subculture
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>>8820014
In saying that, 'Otome no Sewing' can be taken more as a direct phrase than a reference to a style or a proper noun. 'Sewing Maiden' seems like a pretty standard name for a sewing magazine.
>>
>>8820054
It would be "Maiden's Sewing," if anything. "Sewing Maiden" would be "Sewing no otome."
But yeah, true.
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>>8819825
she looks special
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>>8818461
>>8819905
Thank you both. I guess I just got under the impression they restocked the Regular line since it had a lot of clothing staples and I did also saw them restock the 4-strap shoes like you mentioned.
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>>8820157
phone pls stop
*also see
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>>8819825
why does she keep ruining dresses i love someone stop her
>>
>>8819825
How did I know this would be that south american ita extraordinaire...
I fucking hate her. The otome group is awful, t b h
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>>8820014
If you look up otome on egl and go to the earliest post about it, there are some old magazine scans
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>>8819843
pretty sure that came from a mistranslation. calling something otome for japanese is like calling something girly, which is a general statement of aesthetic rather than referencing to a style. Now days you see the word "otome" a lot less in magazines or just general description of anything, simply because it's much more popular to call this thing "girly”, as written in katakana.
to be honest, most japanese i've met just call them "oyoufuku" as in "western style clothing" i.e. basically anything that isn't japanese style "wafuku"
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>>8820706
this is the most misinformation i've ever seen in one post.
>>
Has anyone ever seen a ruffle turtle neck from a western brand?
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>>8820706

Here you go:

http://yaplog.jp/jun-xxx-6/category_1/5

- This doesn't look like much, but check her tags, which says very clearly, otome system.

Someone else can google for more, I'm sure
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>>8820769
Otome system? Tbh this is not enough to convince me this is a style in Japan, currently. I almost feel like it's made up by the west, especially because half the coords posted here would be considered lolita. Other than a few mentions in magazines many years ago, there are no magazines or brands that talk about otome kei. If Japanese girls MOSTLY call it casual/soft/toned down lolita or jane marple style, why give a different label to it here?
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>>8820695
From the looks of this, it still seems to me like they're using otome like you would "girly." It seems "ojousama" (same basic meaning as otome) was used around then, too.
>>8820769
One person using it doesn't really convince me. I have tried googling it quite a bit with little success.

Also, I don't want anyone to get me wrong; I am not arguing that otome isn't a style distinct from lolita or whatever. Just saying that it doesn't seem to have ever really been a concrete, set thing with one name and a super specific look (like lolita or mori), and it still isn't that. So, the style isn't dying out or anything and whatever.
I think it helps us to give it a name, so I don't have any issue with "otome" as is. I just wish this whole argument/discussion would stop coming up in every thread.
Also, please continue posting pictures, people.
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>>8821440
It only bothers me a bit because the West is very strict about lolita rules and people on here are constantly saying otome is all different from lolita and completely it's own style etc. So when they see Japanese girls wearing lolita in a way that's different from what they're used to, they put them in the otome box instead of considering that maybe lolita has evolved or expanded since we made the rules on egl. I think it's still an interesting discussion.
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>>8821462
Also the "but jane marple/emikyu/leur getter is an otome brand! Not lolita!" reactions whenever someone posts lolita coords with said brands
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>>8819825
Aaaawww. I feel bad for this girl. She's in my comm n she was actually fairly sound when I was last chatting to her.

Good to see the concrit anons are here though as I came in search of you guys. I'm the wardrobe anon from before. I've picked up a few new cardigans, a new dress, and some more otome shoes like suggested. I put together some lay-flats, but I feel something is still missing.....like brooches maybe? Or hair stuff? Or maybe better bags? I know I need more patterned tights (too cold for socks here right now) but I'm having trouble choosing what kind. I'm not afraid of learning from my mistakes so any and all concrit welcome please

Also, anyone else noticed this new print from Miss Point? Reminds me of the puppy rosette print, but with cats and custom sizing http://world.taobao.com/item/526343600039.htm?fromSite=main&spm=a312a.7700824.w4002-3588716775.70.WVaxqs My wants are mighty
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>>8821931
Very cute, anon!

As for additions, more brooches and unusual necklaces are always good for getting even more looks out of a wardrobe and a fitted blazer might be handy if you want to change things up from cardigans. I usually say a structured hat too - and you can add a brooch for more coordination power!

I think tights with a vertical stripe would look nice with the polka dot dresses. There've been a few sites posted with unusual print/color/pattern tights too over the last few threads. I need to collect them together at some point. A recent site had a pair of gray tights with rabbits at the ankle that would look super cute.

If you're in the market for bags and don't necessarily want to get J-brand, something like a school satchel in an unusual color - Cambridge Satchel Co. or Zatchels from what I remember of their designs - would suit your aesthetic well.
>>
Anyone have recommendations on a good place to get reasonably inexpensive cardigans? I have an embroidery machine and would love to get a bunch in different colors and DIY some embellishment, but plain crew cardigans of the right length are kind of hard to find. (US retailer or Chinese.)
>>
>>8821379
>>8821440

Most of the issues related to googling 乙女 is that it simply means "maiden", so it brings up a lot of different things. The other problem is with googling 乙女系 (otome system, aka otome style. The word "kei" here is the same "kei" in visual kei, hence the "system" from the previous blog post), 乙女系 tend to bring up otoge (乙女系ゲーム), which is games targeted directly at "maidens". Usually it's some (reverse) harem game love story game. You get a lot more relevant entries if you google 乙女系 plus a brandname (emikyu, jane marple, olive. I haven't tried Leur Getter).

And a few more entries referring to otome-kei:

http://yamaguchiyuuko.cocolog-nifty.com/blog/2012/07/post-1afe.html

http://ameblo.jp/hourouotome/entry-10034906612.html <-- This one clearly says "lolita and otome kei", I want to make an argument that this indicates two different styles, not one.

http://rakuma.rakuten.co.jp/item/f0145435192513940653 <-- Seller trying to sell an "otome kei wall clock". Note the keyword spam of otome brand names at the end of the description.

https://www.mercari.com/jp/u/427341517/ <-- This is a mercari seller who says she has "cute and otome kei" (かわいい、乙女系) items for sale.

http://otomestyle.shop-pro.jp/?pid=86172632 <-- do you count "otome style" shop or is this still too coincidental
>>
>>8822463 (cont'd)


About Olive, this magazine was a heavy supporter of the style, but it went out of publication some years ago. That is why, even though it's not a dress brand, if you google otomekei and olive together you may be able to find more relevant entries.

Meantime, here's some other pages talking about Olive:

http://mixi.jp/view_bbs.pl?comm_id=2573&id=1077725 <-- A discussion of vintage Olive magazine. A comment in there says something about otome kei in the magazine while the reader was a stuednt in the 80s.

http://blog.livedoor.jp/gigayuko/archives/50595127.html <-- still an entry about Olive, this one has a throwaway remark "People who were of the so-called otome system, now more than 30 years of age"

I don't think you're going to be able to find a manifesto about otome style, if that's what you're looking for. It's
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>>8821462
>>8821473

The reason girls are quick to warn about otome brands, some of the dresses are not built for petticoats. You can quickly catch out someone who doesn't know what they're doing when they tell you they want to put a petticoat under some specific dresses. It's like buying an F21 dress and then trying to stuff a petticoat under it.

As for those who were wearing lolita in a different way, I want to clarify since I saw this happening right here on cgl. A couple of things happened together:
1. anons posted girls in otome to the ita thread crying "no petti! itaaa!" only to be corrected that the dress was in fact from an otome brand and didn't fit a petticoat.
2. Anons who were posted to the ita thread in turn sometimes claim "it was an otome outfit! Of course I wasn't wearing a petticoat! It's not even lolita!"

I did kind of feel like there was some kind of dumping going on there, people were using otome as an excuse for dodgy outfits. At the same time newbies were being idiots and posting obviously otome outfits as ita because there was maybe a bag from Angelic Pretty being used in the outfit or something.

Anyway. If you truly want to see the breadth and depth of otome, specifically how it's different from lolita, stop looking only at the dresses, or at lolitas wearing otome. There will be always a bias when you look only at dresses or lolitas, because you already cut out half of what the otome brands actually release. Collect all of the images, brand ads and everything you can find, make it a rule that it cannot have a lolita or a print dress in it. That is where the most obvious differences will show up.
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>>8822506

Guess I'll add a link so anons can see what I'm talking about.

MILK puts its lookbooks on the web, here's the link:
http://www.milk-web.net/lookbook/

I really suggest taking a stroll through it. You will be able to see how many items don't fit into lolita or how some of the print dresses won't fit a petticoat, yet on the other hand, a lot of them have some quirkiness in the detailing or the coord that also puts it outside of the mainstream stuff that you can find in F21 or Jusco brands.
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>>8822506
>If you truly want to see the breadth and depth of otome, specifically how it's different from lolita, stop looking only at the dresses, or at lolitas wearing otome.

This. It makes me so sad seeing otome considered as a style people "graduate" to after lolita when they want to start dressing "mature". It's not a direct transition, so you end up with people not quite getting the air and aesthetic of otome which leads to more misconceptions. We really need something like a reading list to help get new otome up to speed with what the fashion's trying to do.
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>>8822481
Thanks so much, this is really helpful, especially for someone who can't read Japanese, it's hard to find resources. The english info I've found on otome kei was all written by lolita's I think.

I know some dresses and skirts don't fit petticoats, it's just annoying when someone is wearing a lolita coord and people label it as otome because "it's an otome brand". For example emikyu's fork&spoon JSK was really popular with lolita's and obviously looks good with a petti. I also sometimes wear emikyu dresses or skirts without petti on days I feel too lazy for "full lolita" but that still doesn't make it an otome coord.
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>>8822963
Yes please, there really needs to be more accurate information. I don't remember which guide it was but I remember reading somewhere that one of the main ways you can see the difference between an otome dress and a lolita dress is to see if it's a border print or a busy print
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>>8784852
Love that dress, anyone know what brand (if it is one)?
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>>8823331
Pretty sure it's JM
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>>8823204

And here I think you've hit upon exactly why Misako ended up inventing the term "soft lolita" -- lolita so casual, she skips the petticoat, so it may no longer qualify as lolita despite using a lolita dress/skirt. On the other hand, if she uses an otome dress, she may put a petticoat underneath it, so it looks more like lolita than otome. It's kind of a bridge between otome and lolita, too much for one and too little for the other.

Before the haters jump on me, I'd like to also point out, Misako didn't say she invented the style soft lolita. What she actually said was she noticed a trend to dress down lolita in a really casual way, so she called this in-between style soft lolita.
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>>8823211
Border print otome or monotone must confuse people then.
>>
Hey there, I don't often browse cgl and I just found this thread. Just wanted to thank you gals for the explainations otome vs Lolita.As a Lolita interested inOtome Iwas very scared of making my first steps in something I would call Otome but that would actually just be casual loli. It's much more clear now, thanks for to explainations here. ~
>>
Fanny Rosie just got an Instagram!!
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Does anybody know when pep fox is going to ship out this series?

It's almost February.
>>
Does anyone know of any aliexpress/taobao shops for otome
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How much would I expect to pay for Jane Marple's "British Chocolate Bar" JSK if it ended up on Lacemarket?

Navy version being my dream dress

>>8831127
The Taobao thread has a great spreadsheet, the link under "New Store Spreadsheet"
then go to the "Other J-Fashions" tab
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>>8830977
They started shipping out items from this series on the 16th. I think they're just busy, but you can email them if you're worried.
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>>8829729
>Fanny Rosie


Whoa she's moving to Japan?
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>>8819905
>>8818033
Not true. There has been times where they'd restock a few pieces from a recent series on their webshop. It's very rare and would probably be 1 piece for a particular colorway/cut
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>>8832833

Did they send out tracking codes when they did ship?

I'm just worried because my asshole post office doesn't have a number I can call for my packages. Between that and a job that doesn't end at 5 and having to work weekends, I couldn't get myself to the post office and I'm losing packages left and right.
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>>8832828
I paid $380 for mine
and really am not sure if I over or under paid...
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>>8814658
You can learn a lot from this girl. She's daring and playful with her jfashion, not just otome or lolita. 95% it works.
>>
Does anybody have experience with this "ELF SACK" brand? They have shops on AliExpress, YesStyle, and Amazon. Lots of otome-friendly items (in larger sizes too!), but for the price I'd rather hear an endorsement before handing over my debit card.
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>>8839146
They also have some of the most grorious Engrish I've ever seen.
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>>8808231
Dangerfield has an almost-replica of this dress right now, for everyone's information.

http://shop.dangerfield.com.au/girls/just-landed/all/parisian-dress.html
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>>8839160
Jesus, it looks like they have directly copied the croissant and ribbon print exactly, although done poorly. Not sure what print they ripped the jar from.
>>
Which otome brand has the most generous shirring?
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>>8839477
Probably Leur Getter's shirred items. The dresses are made with proportions more similar to Western clothing than typical Japanese sizing which tends to be boxier.
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>>8839160
What sort of search terms can I use to find more dresses in this cut? Especially that sort of neckline. I want to find dresses that can suit a blouse or turtleneck underneath it
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>>8840432
It's a ballet neckline. You might also see people calling it a scoop neckline, though those tend to be lower. For a big skirt, you could try searching for full skirts, circle skirts, or fit and flare, or just sundresses.
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So I've noticed JM does re-release their prints sometimes, how often do they do it? Is it likely they would re-release Stained Glass or an Angel at my Table in the future? I've been hunting for the maxi skirt for ages
>>
Could I have some coord help?
I'm trying to stay away from a my matchyatchy lolita thoughts. I just want to pair this with navy and white but I know there has to be another way!
Red is normally my go to for blue but I don't think that would look any good. I'm just lost on colors other than white :(
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>>8840638
If red is too bright, try bordeaux instead (either dark red or a more plum-like bordeaux would work, I think). A bow (in velvet?) or a beret would look cute, and maybe brown boots like in pic related?
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Hey, could I get some pricing help? Someone is selling the Grimoire Zodiac Sign OP for £120, is that a fair price? I don't want to overpay.
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>>8840620
It's really unpredictable. Some pieces get re-released after a decade, others after 2 years, others never. They never re-release the most iconic stuff though. In the past they re-released prints like musical instruments, miss colette and the violin embroidery series. These were all semi-popular prints. The strawberry, cherry and floral prints get recycled a ton. But iconic prints like Angel at my Table or even British library? A part of JM's appeal is their exclusivity. I doubt that they would want to destroy their image by re-printing too many of their popular prints.
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>>8840638
Soft yellow, like with a knit beret, and white fur accents. Either that or layer on the grays, going from charcoal to dove.
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>>8840655
I think those foresty looking boots are a bad idea. Maybe in a more Feminine/elegant cut (with a slight heel?) and a colder, darker brown to not clash with the plum/Bordeaux.
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>>8840655
hmmm i think i like the idea of bordeaux and more purple-toned colors in general thanks!
>>8840744
a knit beret and fur accents sound adorable.
I was thinking of going with with grey as well but it sounded kinda boring.
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>>8840956
I think you could made gray interesting by varying the textures up. Tonal dressing has been really popular in normal fashion the past couple of years, so you might find some inspiration there.

You could always go Pantone and combine it with soft pink too.
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>>8841037
I was thinking about pink or a greyish lavender too.
But I have 0 anything in pink so I don't know.
>>
Does anyone know the measurements of Jane Marpl'es Mini-OPs? Specifically talking abut strawberr Label mini op.
>>
>>8815755
Sauce on the shoes ? Maybe Jane Marple ?
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>>8842949
Nope, the logo on the ankle makes me think Camper.
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>>8840514
Thank you so much!!!
>>
From my understanding an outfit can still be considered otome even if there's no printed dress or recognizable brand items from first glance right? >>8784825

As long as the general feeling of the outfit is similar it's good to go? By that I mean, normie brands but done in a tasteful way like the post I quoted
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>>8845571

I dearly want to say yes, and technically the answer should be yes, but I feel like I owe you a warning.

I've seen all kinds of jfashion using mainly normie mainstream clothes posted in both the selfpost and drawthreads of yore, from (casual) gyaru to otome to larme to "casual jfash". Thread tends to dissolve into arguments over whether the outfit is jfash or not and whether OP is a noob or a snowflake.

Not gonna tell you not to do it, but be prepared for some nitpick and some arguing, I guess. Which is normal for cgl anyway.
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>>8845571
100% non brand otome is one of those things you need a lot of experience to pull off as well as a good eye for fashion and what makes things otome. It's easier to start with mixing brand and non brand.
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>>8839146
That looks like a JM replica?
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>>8845600
>>8846425
Thank you both for the great advice!
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>>8839146
I bought this cardigan and the violin one from them during the 11.11 sale, I should be getting it in the next few days so I'll update on the quality as soon as possible.
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>>8849039

>>8847967
Goodness, did it really take 3 months to reach you? Aliexpress usually takes 2-4 weeks for me, even around christmas.
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>>8849045
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>>8832828
Anon Im thinking of selling mine.
It's navy jsk cut.

Shoot me an email if you want to offer.
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>>8839160
Wow. On one hand I don't support replicas and I want to call them out, on anothe hand that means I can just go buy this dress right now...
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>>8849148
I already own the original op but i kind of want it anyway even though the quality won't be as good. Maybe when it goes on sale.
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Would this ever work in an Otome-inspired outfit? It looks great on its own with blue shoes, but I'd like to be able to do something else with it.
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Ank Rouge poncho <3
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>>8847967
Thank you anon-friend!

>>8846983
They're definitely cribbing the style, but it's so far removed from the original I'd say it's more "knockoff" than "replica."
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>>8849451
Yes if you style it right. Look at cutsew OP coordinates to get ideas.
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>>8839146
Yup, that's a replica of JM's Coronation Ceremony, but this one looks as though its been printed and stuck on.
>>
>>8849451
Nope.
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>>8849873
>>
>>8849873
JM's is also done with applique. You can't get that level of small scale detail with intarsia knit.
>>
>>8849901
>>8849926
Still lush compared to the fake. Slave to JM.
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>>8849976
Well sure, JM's is nicer. It's also a lot more expensive, and more expensive than it should be. I like JM and buy a fair bit of it, but it's stupidly overpriced for the quality.
>>
>>8849107
Just emailed you anon!
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I love otome so much. I like lolita, though I hold otome closer because it looks more practical... but I always look like a frumpy old hobo or like grandma ready to Sunday's mass.
What can I do?.
BTW, my birthday's coming up so if you have some "starting" wardrobe tips I'd REALLY appreciate.
>tried to otome with normalfag clothes

>>8793078
this looks really nice but I live in a very hot place. How much skin showing is acceptable?
I was told skirts could be a couple inches shorter than lolita.
>>
>>8851465
This is sweet-kei/himekaji
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>>8851465
Why did you post that image? It's neither otome nor you/a selfpost. Tips for otome basics have been covered in previous threads. Check the archives.
>>
>>8851478
>>8851482
Sorry. I thought it matched the "rules" in OP. I posted it because it has the cutesy look I'm aiming for.
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>>8851492
Did you even bother looking at the other images in the thread? That's not otome at all.
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>>8787607
what shoes are these?
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>>8851465
Like everyone's saying, it's a great Himekaji coord, but it lacks the kookiness for otome.
>>
>>8851520
Jane Marple. You must be new. Welcome to the thread.
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>>8851832
So otome has a more playful feel to it. I see.
>>
>>8852114
Hmm not really
Prim, preppy, frumpy, arty, quirky, retro cute maybe. Just lurk more, ingest as many otome images as you can and you'll understand. It's hard to put your finger on.
>>
>>8852114
>>8852127
Looking at Vivienne Westwood might be helpful too. JM's older collections were heavily inspired by (sometimes straight up ripped off) her designs. She exemplifies the artistic and sometimes subversive twist on traditional British clothing that you see on the JM side. I always think it's helpful with J-fashion to have an interest in fashion in general instead of doing the geek thing and getting tunnel vision for all things Japanese. It helps expand your visual vocabulary and improves your eye for nuance.
>>
Since I've seen some people saying that JM is not such good quality for the price, do you think it's worth buying from them directly or better to wait until it's on the secondhand market? I'm on a budget but I'd regret it forever if I couldn't get this print
>>
>>8852203
If you want it and you can afford it, that's your call to make. I buy my JM on the secondary market because there's rarely something I feel like I MUST have (and if there is, odds are low I'll get it because everyone else will want it, too), but my calculus is not yours. JM isn't bad quality, it's generally well made with pretty good quality fabrics, but the cut and construction are very, very simple and repeated over and over every season and only come in one size. Their 42000Y JSKs and 53000Y OPs are absolutely not worth the price, but as with all brands you're also paying for the brand image and look.
>>
>>8852228
It's a shame they've gone down in quality so much. Must be from the weak yen.
>>
>>8852235
They haven't gone down in quality, unless you mean they make fewer complex pieces now, which may be true. I think they used to make more structured and tailored jackets than they do now, and tailoring and more complex pieces is where price starts to make more of a noticeable difference. No very simple cut JSK in cotton fabric with no embellishments is worth 40000Y. There's just not enough to it and no tailoring to do properly. It's not a quality drop issue, it's just an overpricing issue.
>>
>>8852288
To be honest, they have gone down in quality since the earlier days. Some of the newer items coming out have really questionable fabric choices compared to what they would have done in the past. Not the whole line, but it's not like every item is a slam dunk like it used to be. Also, the lack of tailoring, repeating of cut and one or two changes in the finishing shows a reduction in quality in itself. It's not like they're the only ones though, the lolita brands seemed to start cutting corners at around the same time.
>>
>>8852203
It is worth buying from them imo, but avoid their cutsew dresses at all costs. They are mostly unlined and they wear out quickly after a while of intense wear. And if you want pieces that last you a few years, go for more sturdy materials. They usually have thin materials for their spring & summer pieces, some of them are of good quality, some not. But most of the time you will only notice after cleaning the pieces for a couple of times. I's a hit or miss. Autumn/winter is more safe in this regard, but again, avoid cutsew dresses and thin looking fabrics.
The tights are also a hit or miss. I do not recommend getting them for retail prices desu.
>>
>>8852408
>desu
fucking filter, I already forgot about it
>>
>>8852380
Yeah I was going to point out that their latest releases (winter season) were using some strange fabrics at times - unusually light weight and thin material for winter. Their velvet pieces are also not proper heavy velvet anymore but 'velveteen', which makes them easier to wear but they don't feel as quality.
>>
>>8852408
I have to agree with this.
I have owned 4 of their cutsew dresses (Royal Order x 2, Royal Stamp, another lesser print) and they really don't hold up all that well. The materials are very thin, they're totally unlined, and the stitching doesn't seem all that sturdy. Despite taking good care of my pieces (being gentle with them, always having them professionally cleaned, etc.), I had to have two of my pieces rehemmed and one seam (along the back) resewn. My cutsew OPs from AP, Milk, and Emikyu have held up a lot better, and I paid a hell of a lot less for them.
On a different note, is anyone planning a cute outfit for Valentine's Day? I wish I could buy this piece and have it arrive in time.
>>
>>8852436
I had similar experiences with my Jane Marple pieces, that's why I don't buy their cutsew dresses anymore. One of my nicest cutsew dresses is from Beth (Victorian Maiden's sub brand), it only costs like 7000 yen new. Thick fabric, strong seams and the print stays crisp after many washings.
>>
>>8852466
What dress is it? Frog Prince is the only one that's coming up in google searches. I was going to buy that in wine but was worried about fit since the waist seems a bit higher than my natural waist. I have a few cutsews and blouses from Beth, though, and I agree that they're great quality/value.
I love cutsew dresses and wish there were more of them.
>>
>>8852436
I can get behind this! If I can get it from home in time, I have an old ETC dress with a sketchy print of Paris cafes and poodles, black on a cream background with a bit of black and white polka dot ribbon at the top for trim. Was going to pair it with a mariniere, a cute 60s hairstyle, and one of my big JM pendants for something low key. Maybe a romantic and subtle petal pink makeup theme.
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>>8852514
Yep that's it. It's a really nice dress for the price tag.
>>
What would you all say is generally the best otome brand in terms of quality to the lowest? There was a lolita thread like this before and it was really interesting to see overall opinions, with brands like Baby being consistently low and IW always being middle ground.
>>
>>8852436
>>8852408
Speaking of JM, does anyone own a regular dress from them and a mini OP? Is there a huge difference in length?

I really love their dresses but I'm 5'0" and they look like they could engulf me. Some girls look fine and some look like they're swimming in fabric down to the calves.
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>>8853041
I'm 5'6". The standard JM length hits me on the knee while the shorter lengths usually hit me mid thigh (maybe a 4-6in difference?), so the short ones should look alright on you as long as they fit your torso. Keep in mind that those girls might also be wearing skirts that are longer than average. I have a few dresses that come to below my knee. You can usually tell these ones because the skirt will be cut more streamline.
>>
>>8853041
Maybe check out the Jane Marple tag on wear.jp. People list their heights so you can probably find someone with a similar build to you and see how it sits on them.
>>
emergency bump
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>>8853041
Regular dress length is lolita length, mini-op is a few inches shorter. Also the fabrics are different (silk/cotton/jaquard vs jersey)
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Which decade would you say dresses like these are inspired by?
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>>8857149
1960s with that silhouette, preppy look and peter pan collar
A lot of otome is very 60s. Of course 60s fashion was inspired by older fashions as well.
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>>8857164
yup, definitely, i just feel like there's something else there. it feels very early 20th century, austere and straight laced...it's irresistible.
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>>8857149
There's some 20s/early 30s day dress in there, with the loose cut, slightly dropped waist, and prim lace collar and cuffs.
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I adore the general feel of otome and I've patiently been following these threads for a good while now. Just today I received my first ETC jsk! It's not an extremely exciting piece, just a cheap find I snagged on Closet Child, but as I've never done lolita or any other style centered around brands I'm super excited about getting my first brand dress! I'm looking forward to building outfits around it and expanding my wardrobe in the future! Hold me gulls, I'm way too happy about this.
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>>8858132
Congrats, anon! Welcome to the fold. Which one did you get?
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>>8858132
>Anonymous 02/10/16(Wed)16:21:55 No.885
Congrats! I hope to be you someday, but where I live everyone dresses so casually that I would get ridiculed for wearing something so cute every day. I just lurk in the shadows instead.

Share pics of what you got!
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>>8858355
How casual do you mean, anon? You might be able to do something on the simple end of retro/arty cute. I live in a frozen wasteland of North Face jackets and Le Pliage bags, but I'm still managing to rock something like CDG Tricot style to work. In fact, restrictions might help with your creativity.
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>>8858417
Semi-Rural South Texas. Every girl goes out wearing tennis shorts and t-shirts almost exclusively in the summer. During the winter, they wear t-shirts, jeans, and knee-high boots. Yesterday I saw a girl in a dress.

I actually wear cute normalfag dresses a lot but I still get strange looks and people ask me what I'm so dressed up for. I WOULD just say "fuck it" and wear whatever I want, but it becomes such a nuisance to stand out when I just want to go to class without being bothered, y'know?

I'm actually leaving next year to Japan to be a teacher (not with JET, I studied abroad), so I'm just holding out until I live somewhere more fashionable and I can get away with wearing cute clothes without literally getting beaten up. In the meantime, I'm here to learn what looks cute~
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>>8858181
>>8858355
Just pic related. I see it popping up on Closet Child a lot, and I wanted to get something inexpensive first because I'm a very clumsy person and I'm afraid of accidentally ruining expensive dresses.

>>8858668
Good luck on your otome journey, anon! I hope you will get to wear all the cute clothes while in Japan.
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>>8859124
Ooh, that's a good choice! Super cute and you'll be able to do a lot with it.
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>>8858668
>Semi-Rural South Texas
How far south anon? Would you mind sharing your city or a neighboring one?
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>>8859675
Close to New Braunfels half the year, Bryan/College Station the other half of the year.
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>>8860064
Huh. Another anon here, but I grew up in Texas and have family not far from New Braunfels. I'm currently out of state though. Who knew Texas was a little bit of an otome hotspot?
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>>8860064
Oh man, that's still slightly north of where I'm at but it's nice to see there's people interested in otome down in south Texas! I feel you on how basic everybody dresses though, spending more than 5 minutes on your appearance is ridiculous here.

>>8861950
Here's hoping it continues growing.
>>
Know we've got a room thread, but I thought it might be more fun here... what do you think otome inspiration would look like in interior design? I'm moving into my first ever unfurnished flat and am stoked to do some serious decorating.

On that note, does anyone know anything about getting Mina Perhonen fabrics outside of Japan?
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>>8865118
Thread replies: 272
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