Cheating

>>16819430
I guess that depends OP, would you be fine if your girlfriend messed around with a big black dude? If so, then by all means enjoy an open relationship where both of you can have carefree sex

>>16819439
Of course Id hate that. But if I never found out Im not being hurt. So whats the problem.

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>>16819439

Most people against cheating have some ignorant argument, like this.

To be honest, OP, nothing in life matters, There is no moral right or wrong, just your personal code for living. The way I see it is as long as you spread love and not hate, that is have a mistress for the excitement, not to hurt your girlfriend, how can anyone say what you're doing is wrong?

If you're doing it ethically, informing both partners, using protection and getting tested, then it's not called cheating.

It's only cheating if it can be reasonable assumed that you're in a monogamous relationship. People's definition of when that starts varies.

>>16819447
It's not so much not finding out, it's when you do. Plenty of relationships happen where people cheat and the couple is still together because neither have found out. If you're okay with a relationship where one day your truth might slip out or an equally ugly truth might slip out of your partner then do it.

>>16819448
How is my argument ignorant? I'm posing a very real situation where he could either object or be okay with the consequences. I never judged him, I just presented the reality.

>>16819449
But whats wrong with cheating.

>as long as you don't hurt anyone
You're hurting your girlfriend.
>she is honestly hotter than my gf and wants to mess around
So break up with your girlfriend
>I mean honestly I wouldnt leave my gf for her
So don't fuck around with her

Unless your girlfriend is ok with making your relationship open, your relationship is exclusive to her. You made a commitment to her. The fact that you're considering it means that you enjoy the security of your girlfriend but you want shit on the side. Cheating means you're a weak sack of shit.

>>16819458
I obviously dont plan on ever being caught.

>>16819460
>You're hurting your girlfriend.
How. She will remain in the same state she is now. No harm done.
>So break up with your girlfriend
No.
>So don't fuck around with her
Why not.
Say what you want about me, but whats so bad about cheating on her. As far as she's concerned, our relationship is exclusive.

>>16819461

Personally I could not live with that. But, do what you please :-)

>>16819448
That's not even an ignorant argument. That's asking him how he'd feel if that happened to him and he said he wouldn't like it. And >>16819447 OP even though you say that it doesn't hurt because you don't find out, there's still that betrayal. If you want to fuck around with people, do it. But don't do it if your girlfriend believes that she's the only one you're fucking.

>>16819469
Whats wrong with it when no one is hurt?

>>16819430
>. People say youre free to do what you want as long as you arent hurting anyone,
This is one of the many things wrong with our society

>>16819466
You made this thread with your answer already in your head. You don't need the blessing of strangers on the internet to do what you want to do.

>>16819466
basically what >>16819469 says. your relationship is exclusive. why not just open your relationship up so you two are free to fuck other people while still being together.

>>16819466
You're just kind of a shitty person aren't you

>>16819476
Im asking because people seem to think that cheating is wrong. But it doesnt hurt anyone. It doesnt make sense.
>>16819478
Why would I be in an open relationship when I dont want one. So what if our relationship is exclusive. Im not going to hurt anyone so why is it wrong.

>>16819481
Why am I a shitty person when I dont hurt others.

>>16819490
>wants to be able to fuck around
>doesn't want to extend the same courtesy to girlfriend
Go ahead and cheat, I hope she finds out.

>>16819490
I mean, if you don't think cheating is wrong, you just won't get why there are people who think cheating is wrong or their thoughts. Similarly, they'll never understand why cheating isn't wrong to you.

It is what it is

If there's nothing wrong with cheating, why don't you tell your gf about it? :^)

>>16819497
>Why am I a shitty person for lying? It doesnt make sense!

>>16819490
You don't think cheating is wrong. The people in here have told you why it's considered wrong - it's an act of betrayal and it damages your relationship. If you're so sure you won't be found out and you still cannot see why it's wrong, then nothing anyone says in here will make a difference.

>>16819499
Why would you wish she gets hurt? Arent you the bad one here? I wish she stays happy the way she is.

>>16819505
Because telling her would hurt her.

>>16819502
Do you not agree that people should be free to do what they want as long as they arent hurting anyone. Because I agree there and it sounds like theres something Im missing to you.

>>16819459
>What's wrong with cheating?

Cheating is breaking a (often unspoken) contract with a person that you're in a monogamous relationship. i.e. it's lying.
People don't like it when people lie and are often hurt. Add on top of that the common social expectation that humans are monogamous in relationships and you see why it is considered "wrong". If you don't care about hurting your partner's feelings, then go ahead.

>>16819430
It's wrong because you don't respect your gf enough not to lie to her face.She trusts that you're faithful, and in return she's being faithful.
You're in this relationship on false pretenses, and therefore you're depriving her of the chance to sleep with other men (if she too prefers being non-monogamous), or to break up with you and find someone better matched to her (if she prefers being monogamous)
Not to mention, she'll eventually start getting suspicious, at which point you'll gaslight and manipulate her, further showing how you don't truly care about her at all. At this point, she won't only be hurt, but most likely she'll be permanently damaged in her relationship to men.
Finally, it'll come out one way or another, and she'll never be able to trust like she did before.

Of course, none of this really matters to you, or you wouldn't be considering cheating in the first place.

>>16819506
Why am I a shitty person for keeping her happy and not hurting her? Explain that to me.
>>16819507
It doesnt damage anything as long as she never finds out. No one is hurt. Everyone is happy. How can that possibly be wrong.

>>16819522
How am I going to hurt her feelings. Shes never going to know. She will never be hurt. No one is going to be hurt.
HOW IS THAT WRONG.

>>16819430
Go for it. No harm, no foul. Just be really careful the gf doesn't find out so remember the golden rule....

Don't stick your dick in crazy.

>>16819520
Well, my personal moral compass extend into doing right by my partner even if it means they are unaware, because I am doing an action that would cause them great pain if they found out, which is as bad to me as if they already knew. It also has to deal with me not wanting to be placed in that situation, be I aware or blissfully unaware.

Your code is obviously very different from my own, be mine or yours superior is not a matter that I care to argue about; only that we follow our own ideas because they feel right.

It's ethically wrong, and can hurt somebody psychologically. But if you're gonna keep making excuses for it then you're probably just gonna justify doing it no matter what.

>>16819524
>It's wrong because you don't respect your gf enough not to lie to her face
This sounds awfully arbitrary. How am I hurting her? The pretenses arent false to her and shes happy with that. Im happy with her being happy and ill be happier cheating. Everyone can be happy.
>therefore you're depriving her of the chance to sleep with other men
Im not depriving her of anything. She chose to be in a relationship with me.
>break up with you and find someone better matched to her
We are very happy together. We'll probably get married at some point if job stability comes through.
Shes not going to find out so dont worry there.

>>16819526
>Why am I a shitty person for keeping her happy and not hurting her? Explain that to me.

Well if youre doing those things then i dont have anything to say. However youre not since youre trying to cheat on her lol

>but she doesnt know
thats not how commitment works in a monogamous relationship you psycho

By fooling around with this other girl, OP, you are essentially robbing your girlfriend of choice and autonomy - as a monogamous couple, you agree to exclusivity unless otherwise discussed. You both agreed, both made your own choice, to enter this relationship under this pretense. You are now going back on that agreement without her knowledge, and essentially nulling the meaning of that choice and robbing her of any discussion the two of you could have, and even if she does not know it, you are actively hurting her by taking away her freedom to choose whether to accept you messing around with this other girl and stay a couple or to separate. Actively doing things which rob others of their autonomy IS a social harm, whether you want to believe it or not. You should discuss this with your girlfriend, if you want to be with this other women to fool around, if you respect autonomy at all, including your own.

>>16819430
No one who does something bad thinks they're gonna get caught.
People who shoplift don't think they're gonna get in trouble or else they wouldn't do it. Same goes for murderers. You don't commit a crime anticipating that you'll get caught.

Cheating isn't illegal in the same way that those other crimes are, but the fact that you are putting your partner's feelings on the line to satisfy a primitively sexual urge shows your lack of maturity.

My suggestion to you is to end things with your GF and go have a lot of sex with a lot of women. Get it out of your system, and then try to reconnect with her or settle down with someone new after you've had your fun.

Never break a commitment like that.
Again, it shows that you don't care about your partner or about the trust that you share

>>16819540
I dont get it. You feel like its wrong to do something that doesnt hurt anyone. Thats unnecessarily oppressive.
>>16819541
Cheating doesnt hurt anyone. Its the knowledge of being cheated on that does.

>>16819547
Explain to me how cheating on her without her ever finding out and her always being happy is hurting her. Im not seeing it.

>>16819430
You are hurting her because she's having to stay faithful and miss out on some great dick while you're not making the same sacrifice as her. Atleast try to make it an open relationship or something instead of cheating on her

>>16819529
I have been doing the same for 15 years of marriage. Same rationale, she's not hurt if nobody knows, so I go to extreme measures to never get caught and make sure nobody knows, often the girls involved don't know I'm married or they're also married so have equal need for discretion.

Love my wife but I also love new pussy. Life's good.

>>16819545
>This sounds awfully arbitrary. How am I hurting her? The pretenses arent false to her and shes happy with that.
But the pretenses are false. You're not who you pretend you are, so you're depriving her of the chance to judge you fairly.
>Shes not going to find out so dont worry there.
This never happens ever. At most, she'll never have proof. But through the history of mankind, there's never been a situation where the person doesn't become suspicious. Which refers me to my point, where you'll gaslight and manipulate her.

>>16819558
Is she? Are you sure about that?

>>16819557
You're taking away her opportunity to sleep around.
That's a sacrifice that you and her have both made up to this point, right?
If you get to have your cake and eat it too, and she doesn't, then that is unfair to her.

Also people get caught cheating. How would you feel about yourself if she found out somehow? Would the guilt eat you up? Would the relationship fall apart? Is it really worth sleeping with this girl and having a few minutes of physical pleasure? Just fuck your Gf and imagine the other girl or something

>inb4 tits or gtfo
as a girl myself, I can most def tell you that your girl will not want to be with a pos like you. honestly if you're thinking about banging some other chick who apparently isnt worth it in the end, then dont. and dont even be with the girl you call your so called girlfriend. you don't actually care about her!! if you did, she would be more than enough for you. find someone who is going to satisfy you instead of leading people on.

>>16819529
I love it when people say things like this, and then an unexpected STD pops up or the other woman shows up 9 months later.

>>16819550
>robbing your girlfriend of choice and autonomy
Thats some bs right there. She isnt hurt. You are stretching that argument way too thin.
>I didnt buy her a house to Im robbing her of her freedom to sleep in there.
Thats how crazy you sound to me.

>>16819565
Unless you have proof to believe that she's cheating on you, don't just assume she's cheating in order to justify your own cheating.

Plus, if she is cheating on you, then just agree to an open relationship and then everyone's happy

>>16819559
If you dont ever give her an std, and can avoid her getting into baby mama drama, then Im with you. Its exactly my thinking as to why I should do this. Everyone wins.

>>16819575
You sound like a teenager desu

>>16819558
She has me and is 100% happy with that. Shes not sacrificing anything. Shes happy and Im going to keep her that way and never hurt her. Whats better than that.

>>16819583
Again, no one plans to get a hookup buddy pregnant or to catch an STD- it happens regardless.
No matter how careful you are, there's always a chance something will mess up or not go according to plan. You have to be willing to take that risk every time.

So: you would be ok with your girlfriend cheated on you but didn't tell you? Kind of like a don't ask don't tell kinda thing?

>>16819430
fuck you cunt you are making our gender look bad. why are you even dating if you are not going to be loyal? do you even logic? why don't you mess around with sluts who also only want sex like you why do you have to fuck over good girl? seriously you are the scum of the earth.

>>16819575
No, because your example is apples =/= oranges. Autonomy does, however, equal choice. In your example, you would choose to buy her a house and she would choose to sleep in there - that would be valid with the logic I just used. For what it's worth, part of my masters is in logical validity. I am simply breaking your arguments down to the logic and philosophy which it represents. Autonomy is an actual things sentient beings have. The ability to make choices is what makes humans (and other animals capable of conscious thought) ~*special*~. So no, I am not running my argument thin - this is an actual thing we have, OP. Furthermore, since your girlfriend made the CHOICE to enter this relationship under the pretense of confirmed exclusivity, you ARE voiding her choice and causing harm to her, even if it is an unseen harm. Robbing individuals of choice is an inherent harm, autonomy is what makes any sort of social contract work, thus social harm. Read some fucking social and political philosophy sometime, you pleb.

>>16819571
This is why we keep these things secret. Plus what's more hurtful, doing something on the sly, carefully and discreetly or say to her, hey babe, I'd really enjoy sex with a few different girls, just for variety.... You're a nice person but I'm bored in bed and you're not doing it for me anymore. Ok?

>>16819568
No she is taking away her ability to sleep around and shes happy with that. She chose to only sleep with me and is happy with her choice.
>>16819563
>But the pretenses are false
Only hurts if she finds out. Which she wont. Shes not getting hurt. As far as shes concerned she has everything she needs to be happy.
You just assume Ill get caught. I wont. Im going to make her happy.

>>16819588
>what's better than that?
Having a boyfriend that actually cares about you enough to not stick his dick in other girls

You will hurt her one day when she finds out you've been cheating.

Why not tell her that you want to fuck other women then? If she's 100% happy with you and you satisfy everything she wants and needs in a partner, then she should harbor no resentment, right? At the end of the day, as long as you're here, that's all that matters to her? Or is that not the case?

>>16819571
She wants to be with me. Shes happy with me. No one is getting hurt. Everyone is happy. WHAT IS WRONG WITH THAT
>>16819573
Im going to be careful so this never happens.

>>16819598
>and is happy with that choice
Ok so then she won't mind that you're sleeping around then, right? According to your example, she isn't missing out on anything by being single so she'd rather be with you even if you're screwing other women than be single.

>>16819598
>No she is taking away her ability to sleep around and shes happy with that
She assumes you have also given up the ability to sleep around.

>>16819586
too bad im 26
>>16819591
It happens because people arent careful enough. Which I will be.
If I dont know I cant be hurt by it.
>>16819595
How am I scum when Im not hurting anyone.

>>16819596
>Robbing individuals of choice is an inherent harm
So Im robbing her of the choice to sleep in that house right?
For all you know I have a minor in philosophy because I wasted my college years doing useless shit and regret it now.

>>16819619
You're a very immature and self righteous 26-year-old.

You sound like a teenager desu senpai

>>16819583
Vasectomy and careful selection of partners. I don't do random hookups. As I prefer married women with lots to lose we make sure STI's aren't an issue and stick to just one additional sexual partner at a time.

And.....

I don't ever stick my dick in crazy.

At my age of 40 I am spoilt for choice, so much pussy so little time to enjoy it given the caution required.

Because....

I never stick my dick in crazy.

>>16819600
She will not find out.
And why would I tell her. I have no reason to. Everyone is happy and Im going to make sure it stays that way and never bring harm to her.

>>16819557
Holy fuck, you must be one of those people who thinks that they can do anything as long as they think they can avoid the consequences. We've already pointed out the obvious shit that its wrong to break the monogamous agreement you have with the person youre in a relationship. You also said that she would be hurt if she finds out. At this point you should have realized that if thats the case then cheating is fucking wrong. "But its not wrong because she doesnt know!" is NOT valid. Youre a shit boyfriend who just wants to rationalize his filthy monkey urges.

This is Degrassi tier bullshit. Go ahead and cheat on her, you refuse to listen to logic.

>>16819610
>she'd rather be with you even if you're screwing other women than be single.
I didnt say that. As far as shes concerned shes in a loving monogamous relationship and is happy. So shes happy and no harm is done.
>>16819615
And shes happy with that assumption and not hurt.

>>16819634
The last 5 words in your post above.... You have to really mean that to carry this out successfully. Sometimes you just gotta say 'no' if the risk is too high or the chick is high on the crazy meter.

>>16819630
Oh so you dont have a point. Okay.
I dont care how you feel about me, but Im not doing anything wrong because Im not hurting anyone.

>>16819606
>Im going to be careful so this never happens.
No matter how careful you are, something can always go wrong. That's part of life.

>>16819554
When you're saying cheating doesn't hurt anyone the knowledge of being cheated on that does is like saying cancer doesn't kill people it's the symptoms that do --->>> OP is a person who lacks empathy and logical thinking.

>>16819631
Yeah Im not getting a vasectomy now but you seem to have taken the needed steps to make sure no one gets hurt.
>>16819644
Shes not crazy, shes just... sexually empowered I guess. She had a thing for me and we got close for a while, but things fell out. But shes still a 9.9/10.

>>16819637
As I said in the OP, you can do anything as long as no one gets hurt. There are no consequences if she never finds out.
Theres nothing wrong with cheating if she isnt hurt.

>>16819640
But it's a false assumption. You're being dishonest. Your relationship is built on a lie. If you don't see why that's wrong, then there's no reason for this thread. In your make-believe world this is okay, which is cool, but the moment your imaginationland crashes with the real world there will be consequences.

You can say you're being careful, that nobody will find out. Nixon likely said the same about Watergate. Any scam or scheme or conspiracy you've ever heard of that got out into the open, they weren't planning for it to be found out.

You cannot account for every possible scenario or variable. Your brain is literally incapable of doing so. No matter how well thought out you think you have this, there are dozens of things you haven't considered.

If you want to cheat, go ahead and do it. But it's asinine to pretend that you aren't doing something wrong. Morality is not predicated on consequence.

>>16819649
No matter how careful I am she can get hurt by anything, thats life. I just do what I can to avoid that.
>>16819651
If you could remove the symptoms of cancer than sure, cancer doesnt kill people. Im removing the 'symptoms' of cheating so no one is hurt.

>>16819673
Explain to me where the harm is?
You seem to think that its wrong even if no one is ever hurt. You are is bsing yourself there.

>>16819674
>I just do what I can to avoid that.
You aren't, by cheating. You're upping the risk.

OP. You admitted that you'd be hurt if your girl cheated on you. You would be betraying her. How could you fool this person into spending the rest of her life with you? How could you not feel bad about it?

You know what you want to do is wrong and that you wouldn't want it to happen to you. So why do it to someone else?

>>16819674
LOOOOL!!! Are you for real??! you're telling me you seriously think it is the symptom of cancer that kills people and not cancer itself??! Well i have no words now. Good Luck OP

>>16819678
When you can learn more than 10 sentences I'll be more inclined to have a discussion with you.
You never offer any form of rebuttal, you just repeat "no I'm not" ad infinitum.

It doesn't matter how good you are at hiding it. A woman will know when you're cheating.
Her gut instinct is a powerful thing and you will be hurting her when she does eventually find out. Stop playing games OP and grow up

>>16819680
Theres a slight risk every time you walk out the door. You just gotta be as careful as possible doing it.
>>16819685
I admitted to being hurt if I found out. I cant be hurt if I never find out. I will never subject her to that kind of pain. She'll never be hurt.

>>16819686
Cancer can be benign and do nothing. Cancer can kill people based on other scenarios. Nothing is wrong with cancer if its benign. Nothing is wrong with cheating if she never finds out.

>>16819694
Because you havent rebutted my original argument made in the OP. Explain to me wheres the harm done.
>>16819699
Everyone just assumes she will find out. Shes not going to.

>>16819707
You just assume she won't find out. She's going to.

>>16819700
But you are. You are risking it. The fact that you're willing to risk it means you are ready to put her in that world of hurt, and it's very very probable that she'll find out.
I'm serious, she's going to find out one way or another.

>>16819703
"Benign" refers to a condition, tumor, or growth that is not CANCEROUS. OP please check your understanding of words before you use them.

>>16819700

I never said she would be hurt. I'm just asking after it happens can you say to yourself "I'm a good person and this relationship is 100% legit because my partner knows all the info she needs to decide she wants to stay in a committed relationship with me"

Thats assuming you never get caught

>>16819700
>Theres a slight risk every time you walk out the door. You just gotta be as careful as possible doing it.
And I'm saying that the risk of her finding out that you're cheating is much greater than something like being randomly shot at or run over by a car.

The people that always think they're careful and will never get caught always end up getting found out sooner or later. It's not a matter of if, but when. It could be 20 years from now, after you're married and have kids, and she'll feel like she wasted her youth on you and leave. Your kids, mutual friends, and family will forever hate you for harming someone that they care for. And even if you think you'll be safe from STDs, there are some things that condoms just don't protect against, and there will be "oops!" moments. If you come home smelling like another person, or another person's body wash, or even have a "clean" smell, she's going to know. There are so many subtle clues that people can use to figure these things out. She may not call you out on it immediately, but once she notices that something is off, she'll pay more attention to your activity.

>>16819714
>>16819711
She wont.

>>16819738
She will.

>>16819717
Oh fine it doesnt even matter. Cheating is a tumor and cancer is her finding out. You feel better now?

>>16819738
And OP just keeps saying she won't find out, she'll never know and he's not doing anything wrong sounds like he's just trying to find a way for him to cheat without feeling guilty.

>>16819726
Yeah, shes happy, Im happy. No one is hurt. I see nothing wrong with that.

>>16819640
So then, she IS giving something up by being with you then.
Otherwise, why would she be upset at you screwing other women as long as her needs are met?
It's because, by cheating on her, you're not meeting her needs. Therefore, she is giving something up that you are not, and you are hurting her/taking advantage of the relationship in an unhealthy way. Justify it all you want, but you ARE a bad person if you cheat, and you WILL be hurting her.

If you don't care, then go for it. But don't pretend like you're not in the wrong here.
That's like when fat people eat a huge surplus of calories and then blame their obesity in genetics. Just own your poor impulse control- that's the only way that it will ever get any better. Justifying it just makes you look like an idiot and a scumbag who can't even take responsibility when he fucks up

>>16819742
NO you got it wrong cancer is you cheating on her and the symptoms are her finding out

>>16819748
Why would I feel guilty about never harming her?

Also by cheating on her you are depriving your gf the right to choose to be with a guy who is 100% honest with her and treats her the way she treats you

>>16819755
No, because the symptoms are what make it cancer. If theres no symptoms ever its not cancer because its then benign.

>>16819760
then why do you care if it's right or wrong

>>16819767
>>16819755
Oh I get what you are saying. Its not cheating if she doesnt find out. I can agree with that.

>>16819767
you cheating on her (cancer) causes the possibility of her finding out and getting hurt (symptoms)

File: Bait_Shop.jpg (232KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

232KB, 1920x1080px

This is clearly a bait thread.

>>16819771
What do you mean. Of course Id feel bad for doing something wrong.
>>16819765
She can never be guaranteed that. She just has to make a leap of faith. And she did that with me. No harm done if she doesnt find out.

>>16819760
Because you're breaking her trust.
Here's another example:
You have a friend that you talk shit about behind their back. They tell you some deep personal secrets and you make fun of them behind their back to their other friends.

Are you still a "good friend"? Maybe, to the person who is being made fun of, you seem like a good friend- but objectively breaking that trust makes you a bad friend. People who are uninvolved or who are listening to you trash your friend with think of you as a bad friend.


Or what about people in abusive relationships who are brainwashed into loving the person who's abusing them? They're "happy" so even if they're being mistreated, it's ok?

Trust has a larger impact on morality than you think. Your character isn't just judged by how one person sees you. Your GF might think you're a good person, but the person that you're cheating with will probably realize that you're a scumbag, and you also may have some internal guilt at having deceived your girlfriend.

You're trying to justify your actions (aka brainwash yourself into thinking it's ok) but down inside, you KNOW that it's the wrong thing to do, and the guilt will eventually eat you up inside.

>>16819777
That implies that cheating on her has symptoms. because its not cancer if it doesnt have symptoms. But if you are saying that its not cheating if you dont get caught then thats fine. Only makes my argument better.

>>16819780
then you're lying to her? can you lie to the person you truly love and at the end of the day you are lying not only because "you don't want her to find out" but the most important thing is you are covering for your own ass

>>16819781
Does my friend ever find out?
Abuse is harm. So its clearly wrong even if they are happy. Im not hitting her. Im changing doing anything that effects her.
How is it wrong when no harm is done.

>>16819783
a lot of cancer don't have symptoms until it's too late you know... that's why so many people die from it since it can be highly undetectable

>>16819784
It keeps her happy and doesnt bring harm to her.

>>16819789
anyhow my point being your gf doesn't find out does not make it right (at least not for her)

>>16819789
But it has symptoms. Its only cancer if she finds out eventually. Which she won't.

>>16819794
Its not wrong because no one is hurt is what Im saying.

>>16819787
Lying and breaking trust is a form of harm, even if it doesn't make them unhappy- because it is acting in a way that is disrespectful and potentially VERY harmful.

And no, in the example your friend does not find out. They think they can trust you and you continuously break their trust without them knowing.
Again, the relationship seems good to them, but to anyone looking on from the outside who knows the full story, you're seen as the bad guy.

That's the real key to the whole "right and wrong" thing, here. Knowing all the information: does the situation reflect you in a positive, or negetive light? When we omit certain negetive details, anyone can convince themself that they are a great person.
Hitler thought he was an innovative man who cleansed the human race of filth, expressed himself through art, and dos everything he could for the people he loved. Looking at only that side of things, hitler seems like a fine man. But when we look at the WHOLE story which includes the murder of millions of innocent people at his command, we realize that overall, he was a pretty shitty dude objectively. Even so, there were people who knew butler personally and thought he was a great guy.

So, to your girlfriend- YES- you can have a happy relationship with her and cheat.
BUT YOU ARE A BAD PERSON FOR IT. You can get away with it- sure. But do NOT try to delude yourself in to thinking that your actions are somehow justified. No matter how delusional you get, most people will view what you're doing as despicible, and YOU WILL BE SEEN AS THE BAD GUY MORALLY.

OP why did you start this thread? You seem to have all the answers. A decent person feels bad when they betray a person. Even if the person never finds out.

>>16819809
>Lying and breaking trust is a form of harm
No its not. Only harmful if they find out.
How is a person who never harms someone a bad person. Your friend analogy doesnt hold up because its defamation of character which is a form of harm. Cheating hurts no one.

>>16819813
Why when they arent hurting anyone. Thats just arbitrary.

>>16819813
I wasnt sure before. Maybe I was missing something.
But the only argument in this thread is that she can find out which she wont so it isnt a problem.

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>>16819797
>cancer doesn't exist until it has symptoms

>>16819824
>tumors that never cause harm are cancerous
keep trying.
Your analogy only works if she eventually finds out. Which she wont.

>>16819827
just so you know it's not all the same person...

>>16819827

">tumors that never cause harm are cancerous"

Do you know what tumors are?

>>16819835
yeah, they dont always cause harm. Which is my point.

>>16819820

If I told you that I came in your mothers mouth while she slept every night without her concert would you stop me? No harm though because she would never find out and I'm providing nutrients right?

the only reason OP opens this post is to try and convince everyone it is the right thing to do cheating on his gf

>>16819838
tumors grow, silly

>>16819843
thats irrelevant to the analogy they were trying to make. If you dont know the points being made dont jump in.

>>16819841
Of course I would. But you chose to tell me so you get to incur my wrath. If I never find out and she never does and no harm is done you cant be angry.

it is impossible to argue with people who think they're absolutely right, unwilling to listen to others and don't have a sound logic

>>16819778
From a more sinister position, OP may be genuine. There's this little psychological quick of polarization, and it's well enough known that it's not unlikely he's aware of it. Someone takes an opposite position from you, yours hardens up. OP can easily take himself from a simple straw devil's advocate position, through repetition and mental wagon-circling, to a point where he has no doubt in his mind that cheating is perfectly justified.

It's a safe way to build up confidence to do it. There's no risk involved in arguing moral what-ifs on an anonymous image board.

Either way, OP is an asshole for making this thread. The "golden rule" makes morality as simple as possible.

>>16819854
hence everyone should give up and stop trying to tell OP there's something fundamentally wrong with him as a person

>>16819852

Why would you be angry though? I'm not harming your mother. she doesn't know it's happening and she's technically not being harmed.

>>16819863
I can be angry for whatever reason I want. She'll know after you tell me.

op is evil

>>16819854
It is you whos unwilling to listen to others with unsound logic. You have not pointed out how any harm is done.

>>16819881
we keep pointing out you keeping ignoring it and arguing with illogical arguments

>>16819817
You're not defaming your friend, you're just sharing things that he asked to keep private.
In either case, my analogy or in a relationship, breaking someone's trust is a poor reflection of character even if it does not directly cause the person harm.
people who lie and gossip and break trust are still generally regarded as bad people as long as they're puting someone they care about AT RISK of being harmed.
That risk of putting someone you care about at harm for selfish reasons is enough to make you a bad person

>>16819876

So you would hurt your own mother by telling her what I've been doing? Why would you do that?

so what exactly wrong with cheating is it is a reflection of your shitty character and this does not need to stem from you causing any harms

>>16819891
Yeah op, wouldn't you be the one harming her if you told her?
Otherwise she would have been happy

>>16819857
But I am using the golden rule. If shes cheating on me, and I never ever find out. I cant be hurt.

>>16819891
Id tell her because you are actively doing something to her and effecting her without her knowledge. You may remove the traces, but you still did it.
Cheating has no effect on my gf.
Also why would you tell me. If you are going around telling people you are defaming her character and she is being harmed by that alone.

>>16819895
No, doing something to someone without their knowledge doesnt mean you arent hurting them. Like stealing from a retarded child. You are still hurting them. Cheating is an action between me and someone else. No harm to her.

>>16819901
Yes, because of your actions

>>16819913
Im not the one going around defaming her character. That was your first mistake.

>>16819545
>She chose to be in a relationship with me
Just like you chose to be in a relationship with her

>>16819904
>>16819901

If I'm a healthy male with no ailments I'm technically doing no harm to her.

and you both just stated something that everyone's been try to tell you

>"you can do harm to someone without them knowing you're harming them

It doesn't matter if it's physical or emotional

Do you think your girlfriend would be okay with you cheating?

>>16819921
Which is why everyone is going to be happy. And no harm done.

>>16819904
By making a commitment to her (eg "being in a relationship") you have involved her. The whole basis of having a monogamous relationship like the one you have with her is loyalty and fidelity.
If you break that trust by ignoring the commitment you made to her, you are involving her in your bad decision.

>>16819923
>If I'm a healthy male with no ailments I'm technically doing no harm to her.
I dont know that. You shouldnt have told me because I have no reason to trust you. Shes getting tested immediately.
>you can do harm to someone without them knowing you're harming them
Ive been saying that the whole time. But cheating doesnt harm anyone. Because harm implies that there is a change made from a state of not being harmed. Her state is unchanged. If anything the only person I harm by cheating is myself.
Shes only harmed if she finds out because only then is her emotions hurt.
>>16819926
Of course not. Which is why id never tell her.

>>16819928
Shes not involved in a bad decision. Theres no bad decision being made.

Op, in these situations, you need to weight the worst case scenario against the best case scenario.
Best case scenario: you have an affair and she never finds out, and you have no residual guilt every. The pros: you get to have a few minutes of pleasure with someone different than normal.
Worst case scenario: you cheat, and she finds out. Now what? How do you feel about yourself? Are you able to move on quickly or do you loom in self loathing? Does your GF break up with you? Does she get revenge on you? What's possible? What are the cons?

You've already deluded yourself into thinking that what you're doing isn't bad unless she finds out: ok.
But don't delude yourself into thinking it's impossible for her to find out. EVEN IF you destroy every shred of evidence and cover your tracks- the girl that you hook up with will know that you cheated on your GF with her, and your GF is just a Fb message away. What if she decides to blackmail you or fuck up your life for no reason? Women are unpredictable, and you'll never be able to insure that she won't come out and just tell your GF, or that she won't kiss& tell and eventually have it get around to your GF

>>16819935
She is involved in you cheating, then. There is/ will be cheating occurring, right?
So she is involved since you have a commitment to eachother, thereby proving that it is an action not just between you and the person you cheat with. It is an action that involves the three of you.

>>16819950
No there is no action that effects her. There is never a change in her unharmed state.

>>16819931

If you assume I have ailments then it's fair to say that I can assume that your woman will find out you're cheating.

But if you're %100 certain she won't find out then I can say im %100 clean. Can you give me one negative thing that can come from someone ejaculating into your mothers mouth that's not emotional. So the only harm that can be done is if anyone(you) open your mouth to your mother. Only then will harm be done and you would be causing that harm not me. Is that not what you're arguing? No harm is done until knowledge of the wrong doing is known?

>>16819954
The action places her from a "NOT AT RISK OF BEING HARMED" status in to a "AT RISK KF BEING VERY HARMED" status.
You're compromising her potential happiness for a selfish, lustful desire. You obviously don't care about her, why not just break up?

>>16819965
Theres no risk. Shes not going to find out.
>>16819957
I dont know anything about you. i have no reason to trust you. You might not have ailments. But I dont know that until she gets tested. You can say that as much as you want. But the people you tell have no reason to believe that.
>No harm is done until knowledge of the wrong doing is known?
That only applies to cheating. Im arguing that no harm is done if nothing changes and the person is never effected. Cheating fits this. If she finds out then she is emotionally harmed so it no longer fits.
Obviously if you shoot someone in their sleep youve harmed them even if they dont know. You are being retarded.

>>16819965
At risk of being harmed is not harm.
>>16819946
Id feel like shit if she found out. But I feel certain she wont. Why would she. Theres no reason she would.
Id just deny deny deny if she said anything. Theres no reason why she would be believable anyways. I dont plan on getting caught.

OP you are not a good person. It's sad seeing you try so desperately to convince yourself otherwise. I hope you choose to do the right thing.

>>16820010
I dont have to be a good person. I just need to not do anything wrong.

>>16819430
>160 replys
>23 posters
>falling for b8 this bl8tnt

Maximum kek OP

>>16820028
Are you saying that you think I am hurting her and just pretending?

>>16819447
it's ok for your gf to steal money from you to get hotel room where she will be gang banged as long as you don't find out?

>>16819857
> the Golden Rule
is don't get caught.

>>16820053
Stealing my money removes my ability to spend money that is mine. It obviously effects me. Gang bang or not. If she snuck away though and was gang banged and I never found out how could I be mad.

>>16820068
i really hope you are trolling because by your logic it's ok to fuck children in their sleep because they won't find out
>Stealing my money removes my ability to spend money that is mine. It obviously effects me.
stds you get certainly wouldn't affect her

>>16820086
No that clearly goes against what Im saying. Raping someone effects them whether they are aware of it or not. Their body is directly effected. Can you people not follow logic.
Obviously if I gave my gf an std id be in the wrong.

>>16819430
cheating is only a issue if you feel guilty for doing it.

>>16820086
Breaking the law =/= cheating on someone.

Cheating on someone isn't a crime.

>>16820146
Nah I'd only feel bad if she knew

>>16820043
Im implying this is some bs you made up to get attention from spreg lords on 4chin

>>16820149
Then don't get caught.

Also you feel bad for being caught or because she found out?

>>16820068
Karma hits you back in the butt, even if you don't see a wrong or think you are in power of eluding someone else's right.
If you are so convinced that cheating is quite a good thing and it won't matter how many people would tell you it would not be a smart
and sanitizing choice for you, then we won't really get in the way to salvage what we couldn't manage to.
If you are going to cheat because that is how you cope with your choices in life, nothing can be salvaged but by yourself.
Hope that you make up your mind about this, because if you are caught you will get screwed up even more than what you are now and
there is only so far you might be able to come back from.

>>16820158
If feel bad that she got hurt by it.

My father cheated on my mother while she was pregnant with me. Wound up giving her HPV but it was dormant in my mother until this year. Truth can come out in the strangest of ways

>>16820191
It really just sounds like it comes out if you get an std. Which just means you werent careful enough.

>>16819430
It's called "empathy".

what a sucessful bait.

You're doing something you agreed not to do. Simple as that really. You're betraying somebody after leading them to believe you were trustworthy. It reflects on your character. Lack of integrity, respect, self-control, self-discipline, and regard. Deceitful, selfish, and cowardly. Irresponsible. Impulsive. The list goes on.

>>16819881
Lmao dude you can't into logic worth a damn, look at this >>16819827 what is that shit?

My ex cheated on me for at least 9 months and, obviously, I found out.

I first heard it from a friend but I refused to believe it, even though I knew it was probably true because all the signs were there, subtle signs and obvious signs.

I 'officially' found out (and got proof) via a very simple mistake. My ex had gone out while I was over and said I could watch a movie on his laptop. He thought he'd logged out of facebook, but he either forgot or it didn't work.
So when I went to log into my facebook, his was still logged in. With a conversation between him and one of the girls he cheated on me with right in front of me.

Basically, everything this anon said >>16819524 is true.

When your gf finds out she'll 99% never be able to trust you again, let alone forgive you. And because of that, while you're manipulating her and gaslighting her, she'll end up resenting you, as well as being permanently damaged. You're literally what we call 'baggage', aka a few months or years down the track when she finds someone who actually respects her and who actually loves her, she'll never be able to 100% trust them in return, because you broke her heart all because you wanted to get your dick wet.

After she finds out, she'll likely always be damaged from it, and she'll never be able to be as happy as she could've been, had you not been a selfish piece of shit cheater.

If you actually legit love her, you won't ruin her by cheating.

>>16819430
OP if you don't think anything is wrong with cheating you should tell your gf what you're planning to because "there's nothing wrong with it"
if you feel like you're allowed to cheat, well then you need to accept your gf is allowed to cheat too, which is also a reason why you should tell her. She should be allowed to have the same options as you do.
You can't say what she don't know don't hurt her, cause she'll find out, maybe it's you who spill what happened maybe it's the other girl, maybe she can feel you're acting weird and go snooping, maybe someone you know will spill the truth.
no matter what you can't have a trusting relationship if you're not trustworthy and by lying you're not trustworthy at all, even if you don't understand why you shouldn't cheat

>>16820585
But how is it not empathetic. You dont know so you arent hurt.

>>16820613
No harm done so its not wrong. You can insult my character all you want but Im not hurting anyone so theres nothing wrong with that.
>>16820642
Its called logic.

>>16820712
empathy for dummies:
If i got hit in the head that would hurt
Therefore i don't go around hitting others in the head.

you understand?

You would be sad if she cheated on you
therefore you don't cheat on her

>>16820689
Why should I tell her? Thats not a reason to tell her. And shes not going to find out so it doesnt matter.

>>16820719
Id be sad if I knew she was cheating on me. If I dont know how can I be sad.

>>16820722
you would be sad just thinking of her cheating on you, even if you knew it or not

you clearly don't get empathy and that is enough reason for me to tell you your gf is better off without you, regardless of you making her happy or not.
you should go seek a doctor

>>16820721
you can't say "i'm allowed to do it, but you're not"
that is not how a relationship works, and again if you thinks it okay then it shouldn't be a problem telling her

>>16820727
you clearly don't have empathy sorry for my misspelling

>>16820676
Or I could just not get caught. Thanks for the advice on mistakes not to make though. I might get a burner phone that never says at the house. Maybe my car and just say a friend left it and the text are his. Its brilliant. Thanks for helping me come up with this plan.

>>16820727
Thinking my gf is cheating on me is irrelevant to whether or not she is cheating on me. You cant do anything about that. As long as I dont know I cant be sad.

>>16820733
you really need to see a doctor
you are clearly sick

someone should find out who you are and screenshot this thread for her to see, you're what's wrong with humans

>>16820727
Theres no reason to tell her.

>>16820742
EMPATHY IT'S CALLED EMPATHY
a thing you clearly don't have, go seek a doctor and come back when you've got your head fixed

>>16820733
You will get caught though. Whether it be in a month or in 10 years, you will be caught out.
I also wasn't the only anon who gave a way of not getting caught, but you'll still slip up and get caught. And if your gf has any brains or this thing we call 'common sense' (which you so obviously lack), then she'll know you're cheating. She's going to find out one way or another, the only question left is when.

>>16820743
Well if you guys could tell her then I wouldnt be making sure that I never get caught.
Im not going to get caught so she'll never be hurt.

>>16820750
Empathy is putting myself in her shoes. Which I did. If she doesnt know she isnt hurt.

>>16820750
Anon, having empathy means you value a person in a certain way, and have such strong feelings for them that you truly care about their well being. OP does not have that kind of feeling for his girlfriend. Therefore he does not possess empathy for her. He may have it for someone else, who knows. But possessing the ability to feel empathy does not mean you extend it to everyone. It's extended only to those you feel something strongly toward.

>>16820753
>when
Never. And she'll be perfectly happy.

>go to bed
>wake up
>this thread is still here
If this guy isn't a baiter, it's one of the more fucked up people I've seen on this board.

>>16820757
EMPATHY you really don't get empathy.
it doesn't matter if she finds out or not the only thing that matters in empathy is if you wouldn't like someone did it to you, you don't do it to them regardless
>>16820749
That's just stupid if it's okay and there's nothing wrong with it, you can tell her without any problems.
but you choose not to because you know it wouldn't be okay

>>16820757
You can't predict the future so you cannot possibly know that she won't ever find out.

You're just a coward with a huge ego compensating for a lack of empathy. You can't handle the huge and extremely likely possibility of getting caught out and having to face the consequences, so you act like nothing bad will ever happen, when you KNOW that she's probably going to find out anyway.

You are weak and will die alone and unloved.

>>16820721
>Why should I tell her?
Because you want the security of having a girlfriend and the thrill of fucking someone else. You even said that the person you want to fuck is hotter than your girlfriend. Why are you even still with her if you want to fuck someone else. You keep saying it's fine because she won't find out but the people who don't get found out over their cheating are very few. Most people would have guilt over this. You clearly do not. You don't need us to convince you otherwise because you've already made the decision that it is not wrong. Why are you even still here.

>>16820771
Her knowing would not be okay. Her not knowing is 100% okay. It shouldnt be that hard to understand. She's only hurt if she finds out.
I would be perfectly happy if I didnt know. Id hate to know and be hurt by that. Which is why she'll never find out.
>>16820769
I work in the afternoon and when I came here the thread was on the front page. I didnt see a reason not to continue the discussion.

>>16820778
Im going to die very happy with my very happy gf who's probably going to marry me one day.
Im not worried for the future.
>>16820779
Like I said before, I could have been missing something. When I first made this thread I wasnt sure. But now I pretty much am because the only argument against it is that she might find out.

>>16820780
BUT THAT IS NOT HOW EMPATHY WORKS YOU DICK

Empathy is not doing stuff because it would hurt others, it doesn't fucking matter if she finds out or not, CHEATING IS NOT OKAY WHEN YOU HAVE AN AGREEMENT THAT SAYS WE ONLY HAVE SEX WITH EACH OTHER

HOW CAN YOU BE THIS STUPID
IT'S TERRIBLE! you should be locked up somewhere

>>16820788
>Empathy is not doing stuff because it would hurt others
Which is exactly why I wouldnt tell her. Because only that would cause her pain. Cheating is not hurting her. Shes very happy and will stay that way.

>>16820784
that is not true?
the argument against you cheating is
1) you hurt her trust
2) you wouldn't like if she cheated
3)you'll manipulate her to believe you are trustworthy when you're not
4) you won't give her the option to cheat herself, because that would hurt you
5) you made an agreement when you entered the relationship
you want more reasons?

>>16820784
>only argument
No. It's not the only argument. As far as she's concerned you're her boyfriend and the only person she's fucking. She expect the same from you. The fact that she doesn't know you want to cheat on her doesn't change the fact that you're already breaking that relationship. You already stated that you wouldn't extend that to her because then you would know that she was fucking other people. Also, you didn't respond to that other anon - why are you still with your girlfriend if you aren't as attracted to her and you want to fuck other people.

>>16820795
you still don't get empathy
empathy is not doing it because it would hurt others even if the didn't knew you fucktard.

you not telling her just make your lack of empathy even worse because you would have zero bad feelings over lying to someone you say you care about which you clearly don't

>>16820796
>1) you hurt her trust
She still 100% trust me if she doesnt find out.
>2) you wouldn't like if she cheated
Only applies if I find out
>3)you'll manipulate her to believe you are trustworthy when you're not
Not hurting her
>4) you won't give her the option to cheat herself, because that would hurt you
Not hurting her
>5) you made an agreement when you entered the relationship
Not hurting her

Keep them coming though.

>>16820716
I don't think he was insulting you personally, just speaking in general on what it means when a person does cheat.

However, given you're taking it personally, it's starting to seem like you've already cheated or have already made up your mind about cheating, so why even bother asking us about it.

>>16820068

And what if the nigger dick she is fucking steals away her desire to have sex with you, so when you two do fuck she fakes orgasm?

Is it still ok, as long as you dont find out?

>Lol she won't find out because I can perfectly see the future

Die gurgling in a pool of your own blood you subhuman faggot animal.

>>16820802
Its empathy because I think of how I would be hurt. Shes not being hurt. The only wway she can be hurt by this is if she knew. Youre just being stupid. If I stole your car youd clearly know your car was stolen. So I wouldnt do that because even if you didnt know it was me you would be hurt. But her she'll never be hurt.

>>16820803
So you agree that manipulating someone is okay and not hurtful? Even someone whom you claim to 'love'? Someone who's your supposed monogamous girlfriend?

You honestly believe that manipulating your own fucking girlfriend isn't bad and doesn't cause any harm to her?
You are such a piece of shit.

>>16820803
>manipulation would not hurt her
I didn't know people were this stupid

>multiple people have asked OP why he's still with his girlfriend if he wants to fuck around
>it's the only thing he won't respond to

>>16820813
Oh now Im fairly certain its not wrong. I wasnt before.
>>16820816
This only applies when cheating effects your partners happiness. Obviously I dont plan on making her unhappy. She'll never know.

Petition for OP to an hero!

>>16820820
empathy is not to think of how yourself would be hurt... you are a psychopath and should go seek some help because you really lack empathy, you lack it so much you can't even understand the term

>>16820830
>She'll never know.
This guy.

>>16820830
>Obviously I dont plan on making her unhappy. She'll never know.

Honestly, go for it OP. Id rather just give you the validation than have you sit here and shoot down every reasonable bit of advice people give you.

Go cheat on your girlf friend, you brave man

>>16820830
Why don't you just break up with her when you don't find her attractive anyways?

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>decide to check out /adv/
>this is the first thread I read

>>16820798
I really like my gf and as said above, if job security plays out Ill probably ask her to marry me.
>breaking that relationship
Only if she finds out. She still believes its there.
>>16820822
If you arent hurting the person by manipulating them, how is it wrong. How is she harmed.
>>16820829
>Not reading the thread.
I dont have to repeat myself for you lazy people.

>>16820835
>put yourself in person shoes and think about how you would feel
What more do you want. Id be fine because I wouldnt know.
>>16820838
Not brave, just not doing anything wrong.
>>16820840
>when you don't find her attractive
When did I say that.

>>16820830
You keep saying that she'll never know. Now, the possibility of her eventually finding out aside, what more important OP, is that YOU'LL know.
You'll know that you're doing something that would make her unhappy should she find out.
You'll know that you're doing something you wouldn't want done to yourself.
You'll know that you're lying to her.

And if you still brush all that off with a "that's okay" then there really is something wrong with you.

>>16820843
>If you arent hurting the person by manipulating them, how is it wrong. How is she harmed.

you are already hurting her right now. Its obvious you dont give a shit about her or her feelings. You know its not gonna last. If you REALLY cared for her, you would just end it now and spare her this long-drawn out 'fake' relationsip where you are cheating on her the whole time, ramping up her attatchment to you only to dump her and most likely have her find out you were cheating the whole time.

Whether or not you actually cheat on her at this point is almost irrelevant. You're still scum. She could be dating someone who ACTUALLY likes her and wants to have sex with her. You're living a lie and wont come out unmarked

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>>16820841
I actually clicked on this board by mistake and now thanks to this thread I can't leave.

>>16819512
But you justify cheating by saying no one will be hurt...

>>16820855
>You'll know that you're doing something that would make her unhappy should she find out.
Ill feel terrible if she ever does. So we are both at risk of being harmed there.
>You'll know that you're doing something you wouldn't want done to yourself.
I know that I would be happy if I never knew.
>You'll know that you're lying to her.
Not harming her. So its not wrong.

Its okay because no one is hurt.

>>16820843
>I don't have to repeat yourself
>has been copying and pasting "shell never know" for the past few hours

>>16820864
Because she will never know.

>>16820860
That's how I found /adv/ too

>>16819474
Ate you literally autistic

>>16820849
>When did I say that
>"Honestly a friend from college moved to where Im at and she is honestly hotter than my gf"
That's from your original post in case you forgot. The minute you said the girl you're considering is more attractive than you're girlfriend means that you value both the relationship and your girlfriend less than your need to be unfaithful.

>>16820870
Thats a good point. I should put that in my clipboard at this point. You guys arent listening.

>>16820841
>>16820860
as someone who lurks here once in a while, it's threads like these that trap you in

>>16820878
My original post doesnt say shes not attractive. If you are too stupid to read then I dont know why Im even replying.

>>16820849
you said that the girl you want to fuck is hotter, this means you don't find your gf that attractive anyways.
I find other men attractive of course but i sure as hell don't find any man more attractive than my bf, if we ever came to a place in our relationship where i desired others or found others more attractive i would leave him.
because if he ever knew it would hurt him incredibly much and i would also just be holding him in a place where he would never be able to be with someone that truly loved him, i would keep him from being really happy because in reality i didn't really loved him as much as he deserved.

and you don't love your gf as much as she deserves not at all. and the fact that you can't see that makes you sick

empathy is not just putting yourself in someones shoes it's acting from that point
you know if she ever found out you would hurt her as hell
therefore you don't ever do anything that could lead her to being hurt, regardless of she found out or not
and you can't see that at all

>>16820867
>I know that I would be happy if I never knew.

How the fuck could you possibly know that?

When people cheat, its not just one isolated incident.

First of all, if they're not caught, they are more likely to repeat the behavior.

Second, the partner is going to get a sense that something is 'off''. If your gf cheated on you she would probably act colder towards you, she would want to fuck less and you would wonder why.


You seem to think that you will be able to do this and walk away uneffected and unchanged, and you might, if human beings werent inherently emotional beings

>>16820879
Hey congrats, neither are you

>>16820879
>You guys arent listening.

So you admit that you made this thread not to receive advice but to justify to strangers on the internet why you are going to cheat on your girlfriend?

Sounds like you already feel the guilt

>>16820885
It's one thing to say that the other girl is attractive. You said she's more attractive. I don't think I have to ask this because you've proven it already but are you really this stupid? Just break up with her if you can't control your dick.

>>16820858
What damage is done to her. Explain that.
Im happy, shes happy. Im just going to be a little happier.

>>16820867
YOU ARE AT RISK AT GETTING HURT?

your mental health is not okay
you can't talk about your feelings when it's you who want to cheat what is wrong with you
if she ever finds out and she stabs you or cut off your dick she is 100% entitled to do that because YOU HURT HER, she didn't do shit to you, YOU HURT YOURSELF
you are mentally ill OP

>>16820897
No you just have been ignoring the points Ive made which only validate them.
>>16820899
Theres no reason to break up.
>>16820904
>youre entitled to harming someone
really reaching there.

>>16820886
>therefore you don't ever do anything that could lead her to being hurt
Which is why she will never find out. Its only bad if she finds out.
>>16820887
You just seem to be thinking that somehow Im going to slip up. If I thought there was a good chance of that happening I wouldnt do it.

>>16821003
you want to fuck other people, so why would you stay with your girlfriend that you find less attractive than the person you do want to fuck

>>16821021
Theres more to a relationship than how hot someone is. She makes me happy, I make her happy. Im just going to have sex with someone a more attractive.

>>16821025
so then tell her you want to have sex with someone else

>>16821025
>She makes me happy
not happy enough, apparently

>>16821035
Why? Theres no reason to tell her. In fact telling her will only hurt the relationship.
>>16821038
Happy enough to think about marriage at some point. Which is all I need.

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>>16819430

>>16821069
Grats, just tell me. How can a such horrifying being have a girlfriend? And even be not crushingly unhappy about living in your conditions? I am genuinely curious at this point.

>>16821069
so if you want to fuck someone else, how are you so sure she wouldn't be ok with it.

See, the thing is, your argument is built well. It is, and I congratulate you for that, but it's just a trick. It's one of those riddles where someone convinces you that there's a missing cent, or that seven is actually five, or shit like that. I don't exactly know how to deconstruct it and refute any individual part of it, but you claiming that seven equals five? That I can call bullshit on.

You can be arrested for speeding or driving recklessly even if no-one is hurt because you're creating a risk. It's similar to if someone started shooting at you; would you only blame him once he hits you?
It's a condemnable action because of it's intent, not because of it's result. Here's my best attempt at convincing you about the result part, too:

ASSUMING that you can pull this off, we're entering philosophical shitstorm territory here, so bear with me. This is simplified, but you can figure out the exceptions yourself. There are two kinds of people when it comes to truth compromising happiness; Those who want to know the truth, and those who don't. First, you'd have to find out which kind of a person she is, which once again creates suspicion, but we already talked about that in step one.
If she is the kind of person who wants to know the truth, she would be happier if she did know the truth. You will try to argue agaisn't this, but it's true. Personally I've never regretted hearing things like these, even if they sting, because I always come back from it stronger. You know those things that really suck when you're doing them, but their results are good, like studying? You are therefore obstructing her from reaching the truth, something she considers good and something that, in the long run, makes her happy. You may think "No, even if she wants to know, that's bs, she wouldn't be happier", but that's not up to you. Just because you might not understand doesn't mean it isn't true.

[cont]

>>16821288
[cont]

>but we already talked about that in step one.
This step one disappeared when I had to cut some stuff out (2000 letter limit), but in a nutshell: "I doubt you can hide it from her but let's assume you can"

Now assuming that she is the type that wouldn't want to know, and still assuming that you can hide it from her, you MIGHT have a case in which she prefers her dreamland, and your argument still only holds up in theory, not in practice, because as I said, this is a simplified version. There are exceptions to cases. Someone might want to believe someone died painlessly when they didn't, but might want to hear if they were cheated on. You'd practically have to look her in the eye and ask her "Would you be okay with me cheating on you if you never found out", but that of course leads to a metric fuckton of suspicion. Otherwise you're still risking the possibility that she might want to know, and you're not telling her. And risking that possibility for no good reason is morally wrong.

>>16820716
Harm would be done if she were to find out. You cannot guarantee she will never find out. This is fact. Knowing full well she could end up finding out and thus be harmed if you do this, you are choosing to pretend that isn't how things work because that allows you to feel like you aren't in the wrong about going ahead and doing it anyway. Your word means shit. You can't be relied upon. That in itself is enough for something to be counted as wrong.

>>16820716
That is not logic by a longshot. Mental gymnastics, yes. Logic, not even close.

If you wabt to cheat, do it. You may hurt her feelings if caught but you arenot really risking much. I say that because when a man and a women are in love there is a bond and trust like no other. You are not in love if you want to cheat.

What the fuck do you even mean by "wrong". Like morally wrong, or what? That's subjective and an idiotic way to look at this issue.
It's all about preferences, pros, cons and alternatives. First of all some people dislike cheating. Not only being cheated on, but cheating on someone else too. Obviously, for them cheating is "wrong", bad and all that. Now I guess this isn't the case with you, but there are still a few things to consider. Mainly, you're lying to a person that should be close to you and risk hurting him/her deeply. You may not care much about it, but you should consider the social stigma that comes with it and the possible revenge. I know you probably think you'll get away with it, but cheaters get caught more often than you think. Even if they don't find out you may feel guilty at one point or another and it may affect your relationship.
Now it really depends on your personality and desires. If you really want to bond with a person and a have a lifelong relationship then risking it for some sex is obviously retarded. If you just want a convenient person to fuck, talk to, etc and don't value your relationship too highly then cheating won't be that big of an issue for you.
Basically, what I'm saying is, if you value your relationship, cheating is "wrong", because it brings a pretty high chance of fucking it while offering no long-term benefits.

>>16819430
Because we are not all decadent morons.

>it isnt wrong if noone finds out

this is the most retarded logic ever, even for 4chan

>ignorance is bliss

except your gf thinks you arent a piece of shit, you degenerate.

>>16821502
/thread

OP's premise that if she doesn't know she's unharmed is in fact completely true. All the counter arguments I've seen are only based on altruistic or ideological points of view.

OP's girl is happy. She'll remain happy and content and ignorant of factors that would make her otherwise unhappy. And if they have a long happy relationship why should that be damage by stuff that won't be a factor if it remains a secret.

Proper secrets don't get found out. Otherwise they're not secrets.

>>16821610

why date someone at all if you want to cheat on them anyways?

if you cheat, you arent happy in some way. the only person OP is fucking over, is himself.

>>16821610
This is all true. Yet, if given a choice, I'd rather know and be hurt then and move on knowing that I dodged a bullet than live happily in a lie.

Yes, I understand that she won't be hurt by what she doesn't know but it's also incredibly unfair - she loses the right to an informed decision.

I'm sure most people would like to have an informed decision in regards everything.

Just my two cents.

if you want to fuck lots of random people, dont date

it's not fucking difficult, you retard.

you know, I hope she is cheating on you already. that would be good irony.

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Cheating is breaking a social contract you signed yourself.
Like buying a car and agreeing to pay monthly forever, then missing a payment and having it eventually repossessed.
Non-monogamy, however, is not cheating because all parties consent to the arrangement not just being between the two of you.

>>16821622
But you don't know it's a lie. Ergo, you don't need to make a choice and thus just continue to live happily.

>>16821624
That's a dumb way of looking at it.

What if you find someone you want to marry and build a life with but still want to sample some more pussy/cock before settling down with them?

>>16821665

you dont want to marry someone if you arent getting your needs met from them.

if you want to be a slut, why get married at all?

>>16821628
I agree with this analogy, it's a good one and perfectly suitable.

Yes, I signed an agreement for a car I make payments on forever and I reliably and faithfully make those payments. I love my car.

But, occasionally I drive other cars, just for fun and my car is happily sitting the garage, shiny, well maintained and oblivious.

>>16821668
To get married for all the reasons one normally does. The odd side sex that's completely safe and secret has nothing to do with being married.

>>16821681

there is no point in getting married if you want to fuck around with the ones you "love".

>>16819557
What makes you think that you stand a better chance at upholding the lie than all the other bumfucks before you?

>>16819430
>free to do what you want as long as you arent hurting anyone
Exactly, and if you're sure that your cheating won't hurt anybody, feel free to.

Though don't fall for the "will never find out" bullshit, there is always a chance, if your partner would be hurt, if he/she found it, it's wrong.

>>16821746
Also, shockingly, there are some people who believe that actions like betrayal are inherently degrading to the victim regardless of whether they ever find out about them. Might seem like a quaint, old-fashioned attitude to you cheaters, but I know which kind of person I'd rather share a beer with and which kind I'd prefer to kindly keep the fuck away from me and my loved ones.

>>16819430
>as long as you arent hurting anyone

you just answered your own question OP

you're in a relationship that is until now monogomous

you want it to not be monogomous but don't want to bring up the topic with your gf because you know she'd freak out and probably dump you

but somehow you think it's okay to cheat anyway

you're either retarded or stupid, either way you shouldn't be allowed to procreate

>>16819466
Just fucking cheat then since your not gonna listen to anybody and I hope she finds out an stabs your pussy ass

OP here. Im back. Will respond in like 30mins though.

>>16821133
It doesnt matter if she is okay with it or not if she doesnt know.
>>16821323
How is anything Ive done wrong when no one has been hurt.
>>16821379
Sounds like some bs definition of love but you can have that.

>>16821384
A lot of cheaters get away with it. You only hear about the ones Its not wrong when she wont be hurt.
>>16821567
Tell me then, who is harmed by me cheating. It isnt me, or her.
>>16821610
Thank you. Its a secret I plan to keep.

>>16821867
Can you 100% guarantee that she will never ever know? What if she becomes the friend of the chick you want to fuck in few years?

>>16821624
Why not both?
>>16821628
Cheating is not like missing a payment because the person you are supposed to be paying can argue they are harmed by not receiving money. Not paying someone based on an agreement is clearly a negative effect on them. Cheating without getting caught has no effect.
>>16821677
This is more accurate.

>>16821742
Because a lot of them get away with it. Only reason you even know I exist is because Im on an anonymous image board.
>>16821746
There is a chance that I could accidentally run over her or some other bs. You cant make choices because theres a slim chance something wrong could happen. Its not wrong because no one is hurt.

>>16821761
It cant damage them if they dont know. >>16821766
>but somehow you think it's okay to cheat anyway
Wheres the harm done.
>>16821784
>I hope she stabs you
How is wishing for both her and I to get hurt not wrong. Hell youve hurt my feelings which is far more damage than Ive done. You are a worse person than me.

>>16821654
That's where I think that your stance is wrong. You are robbing her of a choice she should have.

I'm not here to judge you or anything, I'm just trying to point out that it is unfair.

>>16821887
Chick lives on the other side of the country. She'll only be here for a short period which is why Im even considering it. I wouldnt do it with someone she would ever meet and spend extended periods of time with. Thats just asking to be cheated on.

>>16821909
What choice. She's chosen to be with me and thats all she needs. She is unaffected by me cheating so its not robbing her of anything.

>>16821914
The choice of being with you after knowing who you truly are. You are lying to her.

>>16821288
>You can be arrested for speeding or driving recklessly even if no-one is hurt because you're creating a risk
No its not even if theres a risk. Laws like this are for order. While you dont create a risk, the law letting people who think they arent creating a risk do so is a risk for society. Theres nothing wrong with driving fast, only hitting others.
If someone shoots me he has legitimately tried to take my life and caused harm to me and should be put away because he is a danger to me and others.
You say she would be happier, but she would be happy if I gave her money as well. She doesnt want it because she doesnt know Im cheating. Its not wrong if shes unaffected by my actions. Just because I would want to know doesnt mean I want to know.
Its not a risk and no one is harmed so I cant be wrong. No one is hurt.

>>16821923
>lying
Whats your point. She is happy and there is nothing wrong with that. To her I am who she thinks I am and thats all that matters.

>>16821941
I no longer have an argument. If you can't see for yourself why lying to a partner is wrong, I don't think I will be able to explain it to you.

Like I said, I'm not here to judge but if you at least admitted that its wrong even if you'd still do it, I would have much more respect for you.

>>16821938
>Just because I would want to know doesnt mean I want to know.
Behold, the logic of a moron.

>>16821950
If she isnt hurt its not wrong
>>16821955
Im not even going to insult. You are just uneducated. Look up 'higher order' in terms of philosophy.

>>16821960
Honesty is assumed between partners in our society. Your being a bf and gf implies mutual honesty and monogamy, unless you both explicitly agreed otherwise.
You lying by omission breaks the mutual agreement and is a blow to your integrity. It is clear that integrity is a concept you are not familiar with, or you just push it aside by rationalization.
There is a second side to this, too. While you cheating doesn't hurt your gf directly, think of it as of taking out a loan, where the currency is her pain. If you cheat, the longer you keep her in the dark, the more she will be hurt. You're not hurting her directly, you're risking her getting hurt in the future, the wager being if she finds out or not. This risk is not yours to take.

>>16822027
Shes not going to be hurt. So its not a wager.

>>16821899
>There is a chance that I could accidentally run over her
>accidentally
This is what makes the big difference. Your action now is deliberate and you know that it will hurt her once she realizes it.

Why do you even bother with all your rationalisations, I don't know if you buy them, but nobody else will, nor does it seem to bother you. So go on and cheat. Kinda sad that getting your dick sucked has a higher priority than minimal personal integrity but whatever floats your boat, man.

>>16822046
Theres no difference. Im just driving a car (cheating) and her getting hit (finding out) is clearly an accident.

>>16822034
You cannot be sure of that. You might do your best to keep it private, but not all aspects of the case at hand are under your control. They never fully are.

Here are the straight fucking facts, OP.

Chlamydia and gonorrhea are two of the most common STDs transmitted today.

The VAST majority of these infections have 0 noticeable symptoms.

They can both be transmitted anally and orally as well as through PIV sex.

Condoms only REDUCE the risk of transmission, not eliminate it. This doesn't even count for when condoms outright fail and break or slip off.

Now for the average sexually promiscuous single person, this isn't really too big of a deal. They pick it up with regular testing and take antibiotics to cure it.

However, the real danger is for people, especially women, exactly like your girlfriend. Who think they are in an exclusively sexually monogamous relationship, by their partner is in fact cheating.

You could very well get chlamydia from a partner who doesn't know she has it. You won't know you have it. Then you'll give it to your girlfriend, and she won't know she has it either. She won't know for months until she has horrible abdominal pain. By that point, it will have turned into pelvic inflammatory disease.

The doctor will be able to cure it, but she will probably be left with chronic pain and complete infertility. She will then learn the only place she could have gotten it was from you. You will have literally taken away her ability to have children and left in it's place life-time physical and emotional pain.

It's a very very real risk, and the fact that you're willing to take it proves you do not love her and you are a horrible person.

>>16822051
More like speeding the car on a dark road when you know 100% that she's in your way. Might pass her and shit will be fine, might drive the bitch over.

>>16822078
Condoms eliminate the risk when used properly. But you are right. Ill get tested before sleeping with my gf again.
If she gets it and she thinks its from me, which it is, ill just say I must have had it before we were dating but never showed signs.

>>16822090
Im clearly takes steps to make sure she doesnt get hit. So stop whining. She isnt harmed so its fine.
>>16822053
I dont need them to. I trust the factors that arent enough to do it.

>>16822095
Aww, pride before the fall is adorable. Just don't come back with a "gf left me after I cheated on her" thread.

>>16822091
>Consistent and correct use of male latex condoms can reduce (though not eliminate) the risk of transmission of sexually transmitted diseases (STDs),

From the CDC itself. And have fun with your condom blowjobs and always using dental dams for oral.

Also, you won't be able to have sex with your girlfriend for two weeks after every time you've cheated, because it takes two weeks after exposure for the testing window to be sure you are truly not infectious. Try explaining that to her.

>>16822103
I dont plan on her finding out so dont worry. I wont be here.
>>16822108
>I had it before we got together
Not really worried there. But itd be best not to do that to her.

>>16822116
What if your plan fails and she does find out?

>>16822116
>I had it before we got together
Not really worried there. But itd be best not to do that to her.

Literally just trying to cover your own ass now. This clearly isn't about "not hurting her" anymore, because she'd still have a disease (probably long enough to seriously damage her), and all you still care about is her not knowing it was from you cheating.

You're putting her at a risk for very real physical harm. That is why cheating is wrong and can "hurt" her.

>>16822116
Your confidence has me wondering whether you're awfully naïve or just plain delusional.

Do you even have an outline for this crazy master plan?

>>16822128
I second this. Surely a mastermind like you knows better than to put all of his eggs in one basket. Tell us your plan b, oh wise OP.

You're thinking about committing something that you're fully aware WILL hurt her if she finds out, and she most likely will. (Girls have that intuition it seems.)
But you don't think there's anything wrong with it?
You're basically lying to her and that's just a start to an unhealthy relationship. You probably aren't breaking up with her because over girl is only staying temporarily which means you can't date her. Grow up dude. You don't deserve to be in a monogomous relationship if you're a lying and cheating cunt. Break up with her and save her the heartbreak your ungrateful ass is gonna give.

You're being selfish, inconsiderate, and arrogant.
I hope she cheats on you with numerous guys. I mean, it won't hurt you right, since you'll never find out.

>>16822128
Then Ive hurt her. But her knowing is worst case scenario and avoidable
>>16822130
She'll be fine. You cant scare me with your std nonsense. Im not talking about hookers.
>>16822131
step 1) dont get caught
That was easy.

>>16822176
If I dont find out how can I be hurt.
>>16822135
Theres not going to be any heartbreak because she wont find out.

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>>16822187
>stds are nonsense
>only HOOKERS have gonorrhea and chlamydia
>y-you can't scare me

Holy kek OP BTFO. Confirmed for scumbag in the wrong.

>>16822230
No ones hurt. Nothing wrong. Keep trying though.

>>16822262
Damn, you are one thick motherfucker.
Go for it, brah. Tell us how it goes. Live the dream.

>>16822078
This is exactly what my gp suspects happened to me, and my then bf did in fact turn out to be a cheater.

So OP, if you're okay with ruining your so called gf's life like this, go ahead and cheat.

But at the end of the day, you're the one who gets to try and stomach the guilt of burdening and ultimately ruining the girl you apparently "love".

OP is right, existence is based in consciousness, if her GB never gets to find out, then it never happened for her.

Also, must of you are acting like hiding it requires being a genius... hiding it is not that complicated really.

Falling for bait in 2016, o i am laffin adv