How do you help someone who won't help themselves?
My sister unemployed and living at mom's, contributing nothing to household chores and not making any kind of an attempt at looking for a school or getting a job. If and when she's asked about what she wants to do with her life, she has a mental breakdown/tantrum and cries bitterly because she has absolutely zero realistic ideas of things she could stomach doing.
She's been diagnosed with depression and sunk really deep into the enabling tumblr hole and all of the "expecting recovery is ableist" nonsense, and altogether she flat-out refuses to grow up and accept responsibility of her own life.
What can I do to help her?
Well maybe she's just not interested in manual labor? Based on your description I could be your sister. People tell me to grow up and look for a job (which I did but they never hire me), but then they say look for lower class jobs, but I refuse to work in a disgusting factory for pennies or become waiter. I do not want to get varicose veins at 25.
What i'm tryin to say is: find out what is her thought process. What is it that truly motivates her. For me it's Health > Job. Happiness > Job at a soul sucking shithole. Oh and Everyhing else >>>>> money. Personally I couldn't give less of a fuck about money. I know, I know "but it's what puts food on the table" I still don't care. I haven't an ounce of materialistic interest.
You could get me to work at charity for free, but wouldn't take a high paying job offer if the conditions I set for myself aren't met.
>Well maybe she's just not interested in manual labor?
She's not interested in ANY work that doesn't require the kind of high-end super fancy college education that she doesn't have the energy, interest, motivation or intellect to achieve.
She doesn't want to do ANYTHING.
Her thought process is this: "If I can't be an awesome progidy genius with superpowers, I don't want to be anything."
She has failed her own impossibly high standards and will not settle for anything less. Being a failure at something grandiose is infinitely better than being successful at something basic.
You can't unless you:
a). Promise her disproportionate reward.
b). She respects you utterly and trusts every word you say
c). Wants your dick badly (doesn't apply here)
tl;dr: people cant really help other people
Excellent taste anon. Should add ATC to that list. And Chipz.
Dreamers gonna dream, family.
it's music anon. happy, fluffy, eurodance that cheers up the soul.
As for her ambitions...yea I still say, you have to find her trigger and find out what motivates her. Make her do a list of things she's interested in. Find jobs in those areas. Maybe she's interested in animals or nature -> great, she could work at a shelter or a flower shop. Maybe she's into social justice-> get her in touch with some gay rights activists.
The point here is to get her out of the house, and moving, reconnecting with people, and society. Then, when she starts to become normal, you can set her new goals. You could even try to find her a hobby like, hiking or tennis, something you two could do together. ANYTHING. Just get her out of that fucking house regularly.
Honestly, there is nothing to say to people like that. The answer is "Your parents need to kick her out." But good chance she will just kill herself or start sucking dicks if that happens.
Fact is that most people's lives aren't appealing. If she doesn't think she has any sort of chance to get out of mediocrity, normal existence is a hard sell, especially to people whose parents are wealthy enough to keep them in infinite infancy.
>But good chance she will just kill herself or start sucking dicks if that happens.
If she was the type to do either, she'd be doing it by now. I've tried both and we grew up in the same environment. My key motivation to go to work is to make enough money to get away from her.
Yep pretty much this. Enable someone to be a lazy sack of whining shit and what's their motivation to change?
And if she did decide to try to support herself by sucking dicks, at least dick sucking is a job.
If your parents kicked her out. I am saying that's the only step that might make her change, but it's just as likely to just make her desperate.
Psychologists are useless for everyone except really low IQ people.
Forget all the depressed BS, shes not "depressed" shes needs to grow up. start by packing her shit and literally throwing her shit on the lawn and tell her to get the fuck out! swhe wants you to believe shes sad and she may hurt herself is you do this. she wont.
>And if she did decide to try to support herself by sucking dicks, at least dick sucking is a job.
>at least dick sucking is a job.
This message was brought to you by: Whores.
Whores. When the wife is away..
And you can't spell "prostitute sucking loads of dicks" without "AIDS" or "STDs" "slave" or the ever popular "suicide"
Get your head out of yer ass mate. I've seen braindead dogs give better advices than you do. Srsly just stop posting.
Have mommy kick her ass out. She'll straighten up right quick, or be homeless for a bit and REALLY suffer, and then get wise. It truly is amazing how many totally normal and responsible things a depressed person is willing to do when they have some consequences attached to their actions, or lack thereof.
You never see people on the streets for any real length of time because of their 'depression.'
doesn't really matter she's older
if she sees you are being productive in certain area and it makes you happy she might try do the same eventually
don't tell her what to do but tell her if she ever needs help you are the person she can count on
we want to become what we admire
also, take note that her change is going to be a loooong process
>How do you help someone who won't help themselves?
Generally you can't. Attempting to do so is a frustrating exercise in futility. All you can do is not enable them. Sometimes you have to let people hit rock bottom before they can recover. In this case, that responsibility falls on your parents who are supporting her.
I suppose you could try to help her with her depression, though. Invite her out to do things and try to get her involved with other people if you can so that she is seeing other opinions other than tumblr's echo chamber. Keep her busy and maybe see if you can convince her to take walks with you. Walks are very good for the soul.
>She always tried to be a role model for me before the real world slapped her in the face and she gave up on life.
OK, now things are getting interesting.
Tell us more about this, OP. Depression doesn't always have a definite single event that brings it on: some would even say that it usually doesn't. But what you're saying here makes it sound like her case can be traced back to something specific. What happened?
She moved out to discover that she doesn't effortlessly excel at college the same way she did in high school, she moved out to live on her own in a city far away from us and didn't make any friends, and then dad died.
After that she just gave up, and hasn't done anything at all since.
Dad dying is a tough one. I lost my mom and it knocked me down for a few months. I ended up with more motivation to succeed after climbing up from rock bottom.
The other things, though, sound like she's just immature. That's a problem plaguing our generation. We've been so spoiled that anything that requires any real amount of effort terrifies us.
I try to look at hard work as the ultimate human attribute. It doesn't matter what it is, if you work hard at it, you're really living.
I do believe that hard work refines a person. It shaves off the things that aren't necessary. The fat of one's character.
My sister doesn't really agree. Hard work is super hard and it's pointless and it sucks and she wants to go home.
This doesn't sound like someone whose intellect is lacking. Motivation and energy, yes, and maybe even interest; intellect, no.
Where has she picked up on the idea that it is? You've picked up on it, so she certainly has, but it's not helping. Have other people been telling her this?
It sounds to me like you want to show some tough love, OP, and that's valid as far as it goes. But you should know what it looks like. You're throwing around a lot of unclear and imprecise language.
What is it that you want? Are you looking for a place to vent? Are you looking for actual solutions? Or do you just want validation about your sister being a horrible person that you shouldn't have any sympathy for at all?
I'm like this. I refuse to settle but I have to since my goals were unrealistic. Three years ago, I went through this thing after college where I was depressed and wanted to do and be the shit I wanted and if I couldnt, I didnt want to do anything. Other things were happening too. Worst 2 years of my life. Never have been that broke until that time. Everybody got fed up with my bs. Today I am looking for a job after I got laid off but not getting any replies. I've joined employement office job search programs with minimal luck.
It sucks for her as much because she wants to be out there and show the world the good she can do. Get her name out, live out her dream but sometimes its a road not trekable. Im still sorting my shit out. I just really refuse to settle for less because I dont think life is worth it if you cant be who you want.
My advice: let her know she has to get a job. let her know she can work to achieve her goal in her spare time. Let her know she can find ways, hell even help her. Lift her up when she gets down. Its always good to have dough in your pocket.
Though love is OK for siblings and family
not ok for romantic relationships
yes, you should fuck with her mind until she decides to do something.
First like "yeah take this shitty entry level job for 2 months or something only alright? just so you can get some money to buy your OWN things like nice clothes and shit, wouldn't that be nice? when you are done you can quit!"
that will start the spin
>If and when she's asked about what she wants to do with her life, she has a mental breakdown/tantrum and cries bitterly because she has absolutely zero realistic ideas of things she could stomach doing.
We need to know more about the reactions sge has. You're using some imprecise language to describe them.
First question, though: how do these conversations go? Theee kinds of emotional reactions are not a reasonable response to "Sweetie, have you given any thought to what you might like to do in the next year?" or words to that effect. But if these conversations are more along the lines of "You useless bitch, when are you finally going to get out of the house?", then her reaction is more understandable.
For the moment, though, I'll assume that your conversations are reasonably gentle. You speak of tantrums/breakdowns, but those are two very different things, and there's a third category to consider.
She is not having breakdowns. A breakdown is when connections in your brain actually break, hence the name. They're involuntary, and they can be very dangerous, because while the person isn't in control of themselves, they can still act. A psychotic break is one kind of brealdown, but there are others. The big thing, though, is that you can't pull out of a breakdown on your own: you need medical attention. It soubds to me like she may have had a breakdown when your father died, but these crying jags are something else entirely.
Meltdowns -the " third category" I mentioned- are less severe than breakdowns, despite the name. They're the brain's reaponse to being overwhelmed by stimuli or emotions, where everything explodes out at once. Like breakdowns they are involuntary, but a person usually isn't capable of doing much. Unlike breakdowns, they tend to pass on their own, though recovery can take a few hours or days. Most people experience one or two meltdowns over the course of their lives, but if they happen often, that's cause for alarm.
Tantrums, in contrast to the previous two, are an obstruction tactic. Unlike breakdowns or meltdowns, they are voluntary: the person seems to be out of control, but actually isn't. The person allows themselves to get worked up into a frenzy, and then proceeds to make the undesirable course of action as unpleasant as possible for everyone around them. The big telltale sign of a tantrum is the quick recovery time: when the person gets what they want, the tantrum clears up alnost immediately.
So my question, OP, is this: what are these, really? Any of the four suggest that she isn't getting the help she needs, but the implications differ. You say she's seeing a psychiatrist, but it may be time to add a psychologist to the team.
You've got to start somewhere. The best way to break that barrier to get an entry level job you really love. It won't be hard to find when you inevitably become miserable from a lack of purpose in life.
>She always tried to be a role model for me before the real world slapped her in the face and she gave up on life.
Then being the role model is a bad idea. In fact, you should find out if your parents are holding you up as a role model for her, and put a stop to it if they are.
It is never a good idea for parents, however well-intentioned they may be, to compare their kids in front of one another that way. Older siblings are quite ofteb a younger child's first role models, but parents need to stay out of that: it only promotes ugly forms of sibling rivalry. But there is something uniquely poisonous when an older child, having once been held up as the role model, is now said to need their younger siblings as role models. This inversion feels unnatural, as though they've failed as a sibling in additiob to everything else, and it only increases the older sibling's sense of shame. I've been there. Not good times. I am not one of those shame-is-evil zealots, but when shame holds a person back like this, the answer isn't more shame: that only makea the trap stronger.
Don't try to be the role model, OP, and don't let your parents make you into one. If she comes to this conclusion herself, then let her. But it has to come fron HER, and nobody else: otherwise, it will backfire.
I don't know what these tantrums are like in detail, I just hear her muffled voice through the door when she's talking to mom, usually sobbing, sometimes straight-up yelling. I can hear mom talk calmly, and her moaning.
The clearest I've heard has been a wail of "You are my MOTHER. You're SUPPOSED to help!"
Mom's plan of calmly waiting out until her depression settles down and goes away on its own hasn't helped.
Altogether, with your description, it sounds like a tantrum, but it doesn't clear up. She'll still cry for hours after the fact, and usually she doesn't even need a reason to start crying or shrieking in the first place.
She doesn't do that in front of each other. I don't know if mom compares us to each other around her, but to me she always holds her up somewhat.
This one time we (me and mom) were sitting in a car and were talking about the refugee crisis, how most of the current syrians are the family's eldest son that gets sent here first so that the rest of the family can follow him, and I asked mom which one of us she'd send out first.
She answered me, since althogh my sister is smarter (her words), I am the more rational one.
She does kind of look up to dad's memory, since he was the same kind of a pesonality as she is (a difficult cunt) but considering that she is not a literal genius in a filed that pays money, she doesn't really have the redeeming qualities to pull off what he did.
You know, I know several people on 40k+ salaries that are still at home right now. I was making 42k myself out of school and was still at home at the time. Why pay 1k+ a month, at least to live somewhere else when I can my parents pay bills and bank the rest?
It's smart, anon. The only reasons to move out are because you hate it there so you want personal space, you want the pride of having your own place or you care enough about other's opinions that you feel you must do it or not feel successful.