>gf not a virgin
>mild tramatic sexual history
>we sleep in the same bed every night for like 3 months
>playing around naked most nights
>she puts penis to vaginal opening
>okay nothing wrong with that
>somehow I didnt realize the difference between being against opening and tip barely being in
>she get incredibly aroused
>gets on top of me and puts the tip in her
>I give her an expression like what the fuck
>shes like dont worry its just the tip
>I tacitly let it go
>she full on mounts me and starts riding
At some point my reason kicks back in and I go limp. She freaks out and is about to cry saying stuff like what have I done. I try to make her feel better by saying I could have stopped it.
Now its a few days later and Im reflecting upon the situation. Im mad at myself for getting so engrossed in our activities that I didnt notice how far we had gone. And that when she mounted me instead of kicking her off I was too busy thinking to myself that this is how a vagina feels. But Im also mad at her for taking it so far without permission. She also thinks that we should just do it since we crossed the line but I dont want to. Like I was a virgin by choice and now I dont know how to deal with this. I dont want to be mad at her, and I do believe that I should have kicked her off as soon as it started, but that doesnt really excuse her actions.
I cant think straight right now, I blame myself but the more I think about this, the more Im starting to see it as her fault. Im a reasonable guy but my thoughts are starting to be come a mess. Any thoughts. I cant honestly talk to her because Im either going to try to console her or lash out. And if Im left to myself theres a chance Ill become unjustly resentful. Please talk to me.
Fuck that. Yeah, it was rape. It wasn't consensual. If you have to lash out, lash out to get your point across. You have every right to talk to her about this. Especially if she knew your past.
Why you didn't kick her off when she started doing that ? That was either because you wanted to do it or because you wouldn't even care.
You could talk to her and told her that you are seeking any other kind of amusement that didn't involve penetration. Erotic massage can be a lot of fun.
The only way to not fuck up with someone, even if looks like already is, is to be honest.
Hope it helps
>Fuck that. Yeah, it was rape.
Woah, woah, woah, alright there Lizzy the Lezzy lets just tuck our tumblr dicks back into our pants for just one moment.
Now, on the one hand, this story at no point has any reference to any conversations you had with your girlfriend before this point in which you might have told her the actual intercourse was over the line for you.
When two people in a relationship play around naked in bed its a SAFE assumption that sexual activity will be involved unless stated otherwise.
If you have told her this was an act that you weren't comfortable with and she decided to go for it anyways then yes, she crossed a serious line and you need to talk with her, but from the fact that you said she freaked out and started crying because of what she'd done its also safe to assume that she already realizes that she's hurt you and she knows what she did was wrong. What you want past that, I'm not sure.
SECONDLY. Your communication is horrible. You are so afraid of confrontation and making people upset that you pretty much let people walk all over you and then complain afterward about what a victim you are. Yes, there is responsibility for the people that cross your boundaries BUT IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO SET THEM.
If you don't clearly and concisely set your boundaries how do expect people to know when they've crossed them? You can't let yourself endure something as horrible as unwanted sexual contact and then put the ENTIRE brunt of that situation on the person who committed it if you've never told them this was something you did not want.
She deserves an honest conversation, not a consolation or a lashing, but an honest, open conversation about your feelings and your boundaries.
You need to open your mouth and set your boundaries. Its not her responsibility to anticipate your feelings. Its your responsibility to tell her and its her responsibility to respect them.
Oh... So... Well huh. So she's got a crazy past, but she trusts you enough to want to feel good with you. Honestly, that changes a lot. I'd feel honored to be honest. I don't know your reasons for being a virgin, but tread, VERY lightly on what will happen next. Just know she's cares enough to want you inside her.
>That was either because you wanted to do it or because you wouldn't even care.
Im not asexual. Of course I desire sex. But I dont want to have sex. I explain why I didnt in the OP and the answer isnt either of those.
Im not mad because it was hostile. Just mad because I lost something I wanted to hold onto.
Personal reasons. Not that it matters anymore.
>Im a reasonable guy
Why are you a "virgin by choice"?
>inb4 religious reasons
>inb4 actively going against millions of years of biological instinct because an old guy in a robe said the magic sky-daddy doesn't want you to fuck
>she puts your penis to her vagina - don't want sex, but nothing wrong with that
>puts tip in - still goes along with it
>when fully inserted: entirely shuts down
These are not the actions of someone I'd call reasonable. You sound like one of those people who claim that giving someone a hand job/blow job/anal doesn't count as taking your virginity because no PiV.
If you go off the definition of rape. At no point did I give consent. She drove everything. I blame myself for stop stopping her.
I care about her. I dont want to say she raped me or admit it even if its true.
Shes had sex with other guys since and said she used it as a way to feel better about it. Like I said, I care about her. I dont want to hurt her, but when I think about how I feel I become upset.
How would a stable person handle this. Im not to versed in these things if you couldnt tell.
doesnt really feel like rape to me. some people like to use molestation as a more softcore term.
dont get me wrong you were violated but its not like she held you against your will. you could have gotten up and walked away without any consequence other than making her upset. so its not really rape.
Since when is a handjob sex... There was no anal or blowjob.
This isnt about why people choose to be virgins and I dont want to deal with your lack of respect.
Honestly listening to how you hold no regards of people being virgins and how its probable that she didnt either just makes me even angrier at her. I cant reason right now.
I think you need to take some blame because like you said you thought you were only grazing her cunt but you know you shouldn't have let it get that far to maintain your virginity...for some reason.
>dont get me wrong you were violated but its not like she held you against your will. you could have gotten up and walked away without any consequence other than making her upset. so its not really rape.
Yeah which is why I dont want to blame her. But the thing is she knew i didnt want to have sex. She has tried to convince into sex multiple times and Ive shut her down each time.
I feel taken advantage of i guess. Like she took the opportunity where I wasnt thinking properly enough to reject her to initiate sex.
I guess part of the anger comes from feeling violated. I could never say that to her.
Was it rape? Yes. You were borh engaging in some very foolish and risky behavior, but this doesn't excuse what she did to you.
The above said, it's up to you to decide what that means. You don't sound particularly traumatized, which is remarkable, but it happens sometimes. She sounds like she's learned her lesson, which is remarkable in its own right: few rapists ever do, unless and until they are caught.
I'm forced to admit that I'd think it quite strange if you decided to stay with her. But this is an unusual case, and unusual cases may call for unusual outcomes.
I can't say whether it was rape or not. If you weren't okay with what was happening, those feelings are real and not stupid regardless. However, if you gave her no signals one way or the other, that complicates the matter.
Do you think it should have been obvious to her that you wanted it to stop? If so, why? I think there might be some key information you're leaving out. There's certainly a reason you feel messed up over this.
Notice everyone, how OP conveniently dodges the one voice of reason in the thread:
I see this happen in certain threads, and I've come to understand that it means one of two things.
1-OP is a troll
2-OP only came here looking for validation and people to back him up in his own view. Now, what will likely happen is OP will back pedal and say he missed the post, or argue relentlessly when he is called out on his bullshit.
Lets sit back and watch.
well you have to say somethign to her. my advice? its time to break up. she doesnt want the same things you want, and thats okay, but there is no point in dating. if you arent ready for sex you probably arent ready for a relationship anon. sucks to suck but all adults expect sex in their relationships. there are rarities out there but you shouldnt date someone and hope they can put up with this if they dont like it.
Yeah I know. I know I should have stopped it there.
But in my mind I kept thinking... is this okay. its not sex... As long as it DOESNT go further its fine. This is how I convinced myself it was okay.
So your point is that handjobs are sex...
Op, I would describe your situation as "violated" rather than raped. Raped implies open protest like saying "stop" or "don't do that" and her ignoring you. You not having the willpower to say "stop" at the time because you were aroused is more like, you had sex and then regretted it. Your GF should have been more open about whether or not it was ok to go further, but she isn't a rapist for not being able to read unclear signals. Moving forward, take this as a learning experience. Set clear boundaries ahead of time or communicate clearly when you don't like what is happening.
What happened to you may technically fall under "rape", but as someone who has actually been forcibly beaten and raped, my experience and your experience are very different.
Your gf is not a "rapist" and should not face the same consequences as someone who maliciously overpowers another person
Didnt even see that post. But Im so tired of people like you saying everything is a troll Im not going ot read it because I doubt someone like you could say something helpful.
> if you arent ready for sex you probably arent ready for a relationship anon
This is bullshit and you know it.
Honestly, man, I have serious reservations classifying this as rape, and yes I would feel the same if you swapped the genders in this situation. Consent isn't just verbal; when you're in a situation in which nonverbal consent might be implied (and therefore misinterpreted if you don't mean to give it) then you do have a responsibility to communicate actively and clearly. Which you ... didn't do. Your communication was terrible, in fact. She thought you were giving consent to full-on sex; you meant to consent to something less than that, and failed to make that clear. If you want, you can hate her and start self-identifying as a rape victim, but I don't think that's either healthy or fair.
What a fucking stupid, stupid retarded topic. So you don't say anything when she starts riding your dick, just give a vague expression that doesn't mean shit, and then when she full on mounts you freak out and she stops and feels bad?
IN NO FUCKING WAY IS THIS RAPE. This topic is dumb, further discussion is pointless, and this was a waste of my time to read. Don't make the mistake of dragging this topic out longer.
Thats the thing. I wasnt really given a chance to say stop. I was kinda under the belief that she understood that sex was a no go since it was stated multiple times. If you just jam you penis into a virgin and they say stop is that not still rape? She just sat on my penis after saying she wouldnt. When I look at it that way I dont even blame myself for not saying stop because it was so far against what I expect to happen I wasnt prepared to handle it.
I guess part of my anger is that I do feel betrayed because she said she wouldnt and I really believed that.
In light of that, what she did is pretty fucked up, and I would consider that nonconsensual. If it was previously agreed that you wouldn't have sex, some heavy petting doesn't override that - especially since she didn't ask.
"Rapist" is a really heavy title, but you were definitely violated, and what she did was wrong.
I would consider talking to a professional to work out your feelings before you try to figure out the state of your relationship.
Thats the thing. I wasnt really given a chance to say stop. I was kinda under the belief that she understood that sex was a no go since it was stated multiple times. If you just jam you penis into a virgin and they say stop is that not still rape? She just sat on my penis after saying she wouldnt.
No I stopped it.
The thing is, that its not like she didnt know I didnt want to have sex. It was something that was made very clear all the time. So in my mind I trusted her to respect that.
Wow didnt see this coming. It didnt occur to me that she betrayed my trust.
Yeah, it does depend on what kind of understanding you had going into it. If you very clearly said "I'll do anything up to full on-penetration, but no matter what I do not want to have sex" then my answer significantly changes.
Allow me to spell it out for you. In your OP, you said you were a reasonable person. I felt that, given the circumstances you've described in conjunction with your reaction to the situation and the posts here, it was more likely you were not a person motivated by reason, and more likely a person motivated by an unreasonable belief which was leading to you wanting to "preserve your virginity" by any means possible, including self-delusion.
This observation was based on the fact that you were totally fine with her pressing your penis on her vagina, and were readily convinced to continue when prompted with an excuse like "it's just the tip," but were suddenly appalled when it continued past that. I then continued to surmise that, based on the fallacy that pressing your penis against her vagina and even going so far as to achieve insertion wasn't sex, you would be likely to believe in similar fallacies, such as that certain sexual acts which don't specifically include penis-in-vagina insertion didn't count as "sex" for the purpose of defining one's virginity; in this manner, you could safely participate in sexual acts while maintaining an illusion of purity in your own mind.
And to top this tirade off, giving or receiving a hand job is, in fact, a sexual act.
stop worrying. you were violated. its not the end of the world. explain why it made you uncomfortable, and break up with her. it doesnt have to be spiteful. you both had needs you jsut cant fulfil.
>tfw no violated /b/ro to cuddle through the tears.
Lemme recap that for ya
>Playing naked in a bed
>Girl friend puts tip o cock in her vagina
>OP is fine with it, OP says "oh well, I'll let it go"
>OP's entire cock ends up in his own girlfriends vagina
HOW COULD THIS POSSIBLE HAPPEN!?
Damn dude, it's sex with your girlfriend. You may have issues but shit, make her sign a 6 page contract before every sexaul encounter I guess.
If you don't want to have sex, you need to draw the line a little earlier than "just the tip is okay."
Also, no means no, but you actually have to FUCKING SAY IT.
Jesus, dude, you've been foreplaying the shit out of this girl for three months. If you don't want to have sex, fine, but look what you've been doing to her, she's probably been an erotic powderkeg.
Also, it is seriously, seriously fucked up for you to use the word rape about this. I don't give a fuck what over-liberal dipshits say, a romantic encounter taking a distressing turn is NOT RAPE without you having an inability to safely withdraw consent.
Do not lash out at her over this, she just really likes you and your insecure ass was never in any danger. Just talk her through it, tell her not to initiate anything ever again, let you be the initiator or at least she needs to verbally ask and you need to VERBALLY assent.
Long story, but I have been told that I was "raped" by my boyfriend. No idea how the general consensus on the incident is, I'm sure there'd be some who consider it rape and some who don't consider it rape.
Regardless of what others might think, it just made me mildly irritated, I didn't care beyond that. I also enjoyed it towards the end. My boyfriend felt bad the next day, and I told him I just felt mildly irritated but that it wasn't as bad as he was making it out to be. He was a little drunk. We talked about it and are fine now. We all make mistakes and I know him well enough to know he's a good guy. How long have you known your girlfriend? If you haven't known her long this should be something to pay attention to, if you intend to stay with her.
Basically my point with this post is people do all sorts of things, people screw up, and it's not useful to get caught up in definitions or whatever. Something happened, you feel violated, that's valid. You could talk about it with her or someone else and discuss your feelings, or decide you don't want to be with her because of this. You were a virgin so I can't relate there, maybe there is a counselor you can talk to if you feel like you're not dealing well with it on your own? Not many guys feel like this about their virginities, nothing wrong with it, but it's just rarer. It might be harder for people to know how to help you with this problem.
Sex and consent are tricky, it's always a better idea to be 100% sure that the person you're with wants to have sex with you. But sometimes that doesn't happen, not due to malice or purposeful ignorance. Some people are traumatized by that, some aren't. Be honest to yourself about how you feel about this, regardless of what the people of /adv/ say or what society says, and work from there. Don't listen to the people saying you definitely were or weren't raped, find out what you think.
I don't care what you think; making fun of someone who thinks they might have been raped - regardless of whether they actually were - is incredibly shitty. You should not be giving advice about this if that's the kind of person you are.
>more likely a person motivated by an unreasonable belief which was leading to you wanting to "preserve your virginity" by any means possible, including self-delusion.
You dont know my reasons for keeping my virginity and its not up to you to decide that a handjob is the same as not being a virgin.
>certain sexual acts which don't specifically include penis-in-vagina insertion didn't count as "sex" for the purpose of defining one's virginity
If its not sex then its not sex. I have my reasons for wanting to keep my virginity but aversion to having my penis touched was not one of them.
>were readily convinced to continue when prompted with an excuse like "it's just the tip,
No I wasnt okay with that. But as I said before, I wasnt prepared to handle the situation. Right now youre advocating that not giving dissent is the same as consent.
Oh oh wait ok.
If you said ahead of time "no sex at all" then that is more messed up. If, knowing you didn't want to have sex, she had sex with you, then that is more messed up.
You're kidding yourself if you think you "didn't have a chance to say stop". They whole thing was a chance for you to say stop.
The fact of the matter is that you were aroused, and were unable to say "stop" or "no". She, also, was unable to "stop" or say "no". You both had a hand in this, so please don't cast your guilt on her by making this 100% her fault. Yes- she violated you physically and she violated your trust. But it was also your mistake to allow yourself to be in a situation where you could not say "stop".if you get so aroused that you cannot stop a situation when it's becoming hot and heavy, then you also have poor self control. Next time, don't let it get to the point where you're too aroused to say stop. The whole "just the tip" thing is BS. Never do that.
>Also, no means no, but you actually have to FUCKING SAY IT.
Its been said multiple times. I didnt say "just the tip is okay." Just like now, I guess I didnt want to be angry with her and wanted to over look it. In the moment I didnt know how to handle it when a girl who knows you dont want to have sex and has been clearly stated, puts the tip of your penis in and convinces you its not sex.
This isnt like we sat down and discussed that we were going to go that far. She just moved too fast for me to handle.
"Too fast for me to handle"
Op PLEASE you are so transparent.
You were enjoying it, and then felt guilty when it went too far. Saying that she "didn't give you a chance to say no" is stupid. You have to SAY STOP while it is happening to snap her back to reality.
It's not like your GF has a little timer that asks "are u ok with what is happening?" Every 10 seconds.
YOU are an active participant, and YOU control how the encounter goes and escalates. Next time cut it off before your brain becomes mush.
YOUR GF IS IN THE WEONG HERE- but do NOT paint it like she is some seductress rapist bc you were too much of a pussy to be like "hey I think we should cool off a bit"
>You dont know my reasons for keeping my virginity
No shit. I asked you what your reasons were (as have several other people) and you haven't answered us yet.
>and its not up to you to decide that a handjob is the same as not being a virgin.
>If its not sex then its not sex. I have my reasons for wanting to keep my virginity but aversion to having my penis touched was not one of them.
Sounds like someone had a hand job and wants to continue to believe they are still a virgin.
>Right now youre advocating that not giving dissent is the same as consent.
In the case of stranger on stranger, you're right, it isn't. In the case of lying naked with someone you are intimate with in bed, like some other guy said in this thread, some degree of physical intimacy is implied, and if you want to set up boundaries you need to be absolutely explicit about it, and not wait until your cock is literally inside her to say that you're uncomfortable.
>.if you get so aroused that you cannot stop a situation when it's becoming hot and heavy
I can only give post defacto reasons why I didnt stop it. But it wasnt because I wanted sex. Stopping after some has already started riding you is a different story. Like if you tell someone that they cant do something, and they do it anyways and you dont stop them, doesnt mean you have poor self control.
>don't let it get to the point where you're too aroused to say stop
I wasnt too aroused to say stop. If I thought she was going to start riding me I would have stopped it. She convinced me she wasnt and just did.
>The whole "just the tip" thing is BS. Never do that.
I didnt do that. And at the time, I didnt know how to handle someone doing that to me. The only thing I mentality was okay with was my penis being against her vagina.
It's the real world. OP can learn from this.
Luckily the only consequence here was that his dick went into his own girlfriend's vagina. If you are in a situation, that is obviously going down a road you don't like, and all the warning signs are there, you need to hit the breaks. OP didn't even ease off the gas.
Damn, if you can't take a bit of pepper with your adv/ then go to Yahoo answers.
So why didn't you stop her then?
While she was rubbing your penis on the edge of her vag- why didn't you say "hey, that's a little close- let's back up."
Is it because you were enjoying it?
You could have easily said it at any time- "she didn't give me a chance" is not an excuse.
>Sounds like someone had a hand job and wants to continue to believe they are still a virgin.
I dont want to believe. I dont see a handjob as sex. If I were sticking my penis into something I could see your point but your argument is honestly just dumb to me. When I masturbate I dont consider it sex with my hand. You just seem crazy to me and have no idea what youre talking about.
> if you want to set up boundaries you need to be absolutely explicit about it
Did you not read the thread where I stated that I clearly made sure she knew I didnt want sex with her. She pushed for sex many times before and Ive stated that I wanted to stay a virgin adn rejected her and I thought she respected that. We both know that sex as a no go. Its not about convincing you we knew that.
That's complete bullshit.
First off, saying no to sex is incredibly nerve-wracking. The other person will often feel rejected or insulted, so just figuring out how to phrase your refusal is difficult.
And you weren't there. You don't know how fast anything happened. It could have been hours or seconds. You just don't fucking know, and you have no right to be so rude about the matter.
>hey, that's a little close- let's back up
It wasnt sex. Thats what I thought. It never occurred to me that she would do it. Like I just assume that we both were on the same page since we've talked about how sex wasnt okay before.
Honestly you dick would've ended up in her vagina by the end of the night anyway OP, let's be honest. You got in a bed and had some naked wrestling and you rubbed your dick on her clit.
If someone walked in on that, do you honestly believe you could convince them you weren't having sex and had no intention of having sex?
This is like putting a sandwich in your mouth , chewing, swallowing the entire sandwich, and saying "I haven't eaten the sandwich yet, I'm not sure if I'm going to poop it out. It's not eating until I poop."
Just so you know- I am very familiar with this situation actually.
My boyfriend and I are abstinent for religious reasons. We both messed up several times in the beginning- and had similar feelings to op.
Op, if you are going to cast the full blame on your partner without taking any responsibility, then you are not mature enough to be in a relationship.
Abstinent relationships are tricky. I know how quick things escalate when it gets passionate, and I know how easy it is to let go and just let things happen until the inevitable guilt hits.
Do not cast away the responsibility you have.
You 100% WERE violated, but to call your gf a rapist is an insult to people who have actually been violently raped. Your gf loves you very much, and was unable to prioritize your beliefs in the heat of the moment. YOU were also unable to prioritize your beliefs in the heat of the moment. Do not blame her for your short comings as well as your own. She is responsible, and so are you.
>Saying that she "didn't give you a chance to say no" is stupid
As stated above. If I just jam my penis into a virgin, does she have a chance to say no. You cant consent to sex after someone pulls the trigger on it.
Tell me, when you put you penis to a girls vagina and tell her your not going to do it. Then jam it in, when did she have a chance to say no.
I tell my girlfriend I'm to tired for sex at least once a week. She gets pissed, then she goes to sleep. Not difficult.
I've told a girl right as it was getting heavy that I had to take an emergency shit, because her vagina smelled like brillo pads, and rotten crab meat.
This is what you get when you walk on eggshells all the time with the new generations mindset of "don't offend anybody ever!"
I have been raped before- you say no WHILE IT'S happening. You say "stop" clearly. When they don't stop, you scream "STOP!".
If you had said "stop"- do you think your GF would have stopped?
If yes, then she's no rapist, she was just very aroused and did not prioritize your values
>If someone walked in on that, do you honestly believe you could convince them you weren't having sex and had no intention of having sex?
I dont care what someone else would believe. In my mind we were never going to do that. I assumed we were on the same page. Its not like we never talked about it.
>YOU were also unable to prioritize your beliefs in the heat of the moment
I was only unable to prioritize it once it was too late. When the moment came and I thought she was about to mount me, I was honestly going to stop her. She managed to make me think she wasnt so I dropped my guard. Not because I got caught up. I dont see trusting her as a short coming even if you do.
>hand job isn't sex
>"If I were sticking my penis into something I could see your point"
>OP: ">she puts penis to vaginal opening"
">gets on top of me and puts the tip in her"
And on top of that:
>still hasn't told us his reasons for wanting to stay a virgin
I hope you're not a Christian trying to abstain, bc if so you are doing it all wrong.
In most religious beliefs, ANY type of "sex" (oral, handjobs, anal) is all forbidden because it leads to stuff like this.
Now you know.
If you are trying to abstain for religious reasons, you need to cut all that out
>you say no WHILE IT'S happening
This is bullshit. Im not saying that you need to sign a contract for consent, but saying that because a person didnt kick and scream doesnt not mean its not rape.
Ill go ahead and say it. My gf was raped for her first time as well. Shes never really spoken about the details of what exactly happened, but I know it was with someone she said she loved.
You DO have to openly communicate with the person that you are not okay with what is happening.
I get that you "did that ahead of time" but by not taking any responsibility, you were setting your GF up for the blame so that you could get off and still maintain your "holier than thou" virgin status.
If you say "I don't want cake" and then someone brings you a slice, you're not obligated to eat it. Fatties (people with poor self control) might eat it and then be like "why did you bring me cake when I said not to?? This is your fault!". WHILE IT WAS WRONG FOR YOUR GF to not prioritize your values, you DEFINELTY had a hand in this.
Rape from a loved one is not like what happens to you. Rape from a loved one would be like if your gf was having sex with you as you said"please stop!! No!!" And she held you down and did it anyways.
Yeah if I were going around putting my penis in girls Id agree with you. This is something she did without my consent.
>still hasn't told us his reasons for wanting to stay a virgin
You dont get to fucking know. Deal with it.
Im straight up not in the mood to be trolled right now so unless you have something to actually say dont expect me to reply.
Like I said, I can only give reasons in retrospect. I know it wasnt because I wanted to have sex and couldnt think straight.
I actually didnt process that we were having sex. The moment I did was when I went limp. Like immediately.
I know this sounds ridiculous, but this wasnt a situation that I could process immediately because I honestly didnt see it coming. I didnt believe that she would do it. I didnt have a timer or me. But if I were to estimate how many times she bounced on my itd be less than 10. Maybe around 10. I wasnt exactly counting.
Hope you didnt think I was Christian nor that you could tell a christian what their beliefs are.
>You DO have to openly communicate with the person that you are not okay with what is happening.
Yeah but youre not taking into account the shock factor.
>If you say "I don't want cake" and then someone brings you a slice, you're not obligated to eat it
This is a bullshit example. I didnt eat my cake. Someone forced cake down my throat. If you tell someone you dont want cake and they force it down your throat does that make you a fatty?
I was so desperate to have people to talk with I dont know why I thought coming here was a good idea. Its like Im on /r9k/.
I need to find someone to seriously talk to and its not going to be her. If I tell a friend or someone close theyll know its about her. Can you at least give me some advice here.
Oh my god I hope your trolling.
She brought you the cake and you opened your mouth and didn't say a word, so she took a bit and put it up to your mouth and you are it.
You MISSCOMMUNICATED WITH HER.
The fact that you're getting so defensive just shows that you know you are partially responsible.
Random anon jumping in here.
>I know this sounds ridiculous, but this wasnt a situation that I could process immediately because I honestly didnt see it coming. I didnt believe that she would do it.
So it's okay for you to get caught up in the heat of the moment, and not stop her, but you can't understand that she was aroused too? Arousal can make people do strange, unthinkable things. What made her press on is the same thing that kept you from saying no. You're a bit dumb for not realizing how strong this biological urge can be, but no one is really in the wrong. I'm sorry it happened to you, but what's done is done. You can't take back your virginity. All you can do in the future is abstain from ANY sort of sexual contact with another person (if you still want to stay celibate), because it will all lead you down to this type of situation.
Dude what you are describing is exactly what she was feeling too.
"Too fast to process"
"Got caught up in it"
That's how she felt as well. She didn't prioritize your values because they weren't the first thing on her mind. They weren't the first thing on your mind, either. How you gonna blame your gf for feeling the same exact way that you felt? Smh
>You MISSCOMMUNICATED WITH HER.
its not miscomminication when you say you dont want sex. Then the person says they arent going to do it and then do it anyways.
>She brought you the cake and you opened your mouth and didn't say a word, so she took a bit and put it up to your mouth and you are it.
No, she took the cake, said she wasnt going to put it in, my mouth was open (guard dropped analogy I guess), and then fucking did it.
>The fact that you're getting so defensive just shows that you know you are partially responsible.
I believe that everything that happens to me is my responsibility. I take responsibility for this is the same way I blame myself when I was mugged because I didnt watch my back.
That has nothing to do with the blame I put on other people. Im defensive because you dont seem to understand that I made it clear that I didnt want it, was led to trust she wasnt going to do it, and then was betrayed.
If she stuck the tip in and didnt say she wasnt going to do it I was going to push her ass off me.
We're frustrated because you refuse to accept that you were overcome with lust.
You're cherrypicking things to reassure yourself and ignoring the feelings of your partner.
Also, people who accept responsibility for their actions don't yell "rape" when they regret sex
D O U B L E S T A N D A R D S
The bottom line is, you didn't and don't want it, she took it way too far.
Do not think she was just trying to be nice. Remember if the situation was reversed you'd be in deep shit with the law right now.
She needs to know what she did was deplorable. I'm at least glad she understands what she did was wrong though. There's hope.
You wanted advice, we gave you advice. This is coming from a group of people who have no emotional attachment to you, no reason to soften the blow, and no reason to lie to make you feel better. But we also don't have much reason to lie to make you feel worse, and if you seem to be getting the same response from multiple people, that should probably tell you something about your situation isn't quite how you'd like to think it was.
If you want validation that your viewpoint is correct, go elsewhere. We don't have the inclination to appease you, so if your viewpoint is so rigid you can't take a look at your situation through a different perspective you're only going to either convince us you're just a troll with nothing better to do, or else you are so far gone as to be completely beyond any means of reasonable hope.
For the sake of your supposed girlfriend, I sincerely hope you're just a troll. If you are being entirely serious, you need more help than random people on the internet can offer.
>So it's okay for you to get caught up in the heat of the moment, and not stop her, but you can't understand that she was aroused too?
No I fully understand that she was caught up as well. But she acted anyways. Which is the difference. When youre an active participant in a crime you cant claim to be caught up and blame it on that.
Like I said, I know she also got caught up. Its why I didnt blame her immediately. But that was because I didnt think about the situation. Only how to make it so that she doesnt break down.
It wasnt too fast for her not process that she couldnt act.
>Im defensive because you dont seem to understand that I made it clear that I didnt want it
That all goes right out the window when people are turned on. You have to aggressively stop someone, at that point.
>was led to trust she wasnt going to do it, and then was betrayed.
You were both not thinking straight, due to your level of sexual activity. If my guy and I were doing that sort of thing, and he didn't stop me or verbally tell me know, I'm going to assume he's okay with it in the heat of the moment and go for it. I understand that it's a big deal for you, since this was your first time, but for most people, this isn't a big thing.
>We're frustrated because you refuse to accept that you were overcome with lust.
If I were overcome with lust and started humping her Id grant you that. I layed there. Didnt fucking move a muscle. Its like being paralyzed from fear.
>You're cherrypicking things to reassure yourself and ignoring the feelings of your partner.
What exactly am I cherry picking. Her feelings dont change what said did. Please tell me how saying you arent going to jam your penis into a virgin, then jamming it in is okay.
>Also, people who accept responsibility for their actions don't yell "rape" when they regret sex
Im sure people who are violently raped regret the sex.
Things that your GF is at fault for:
- losing her head and violating your trust
-taking the focus off of your feelings by making herself the one who needed to be consoled
That is it. Does that make her a rapist? No. Honestly most people would have done the same thing she did.
Op, she DID violate you and you should go to therapy//resolve your emotions about this. But do NOT say you were raped in a situation like this. You were violated sexually, but not raped.
>Im sure people who are violently raped regret the sex.
You dropped the ball here. Don't try to compare what happened to you, to a violent rape where an assailant with no regard for another person's well being forces themselves upon their victim entirely against their will.
2/10 You had me going, but you dun fucked up.
>I'm going to assume he's okay with it in the heat of the moment and go for it.
This is rape. This is how most rapes occur. One person thought it was okay when it wasnt. Kicking her off me the moment she sat down wouldnt have changed the fact that it was pretty much rape at that point. If you stick your penis in a girl. Tear her hymen, she says no and you stop. Do you honestly believe thats not rape.
>That all goes right out the window when people are turned on. You have to aggressively stop someone, at that point.
This is honestly bullshit. If someone is incapable of saying no for whatever reason, and you knew it was against their wishes and proceeded anyways do you honestly believe that anyone would agree with you because you got caught up.
Yeah youve only said things that are ridiculous excuses for raping someone. Honestly when the thought occurs to me that she might think like you I just want to go to my campus safety and report the situation.
You guys are making me so angry Im forgetting how strongly I care about her.
>- losing her head and violating your trust
>-taking the focus off of your feelings by making herself the one who needed to be consoled
Doing both of these things is the grounds for rape
Hi op! I'm sorry that happened to you, but please don't think that you're worth any less because of what happened. If you can no longer trust your girlfriend, then you should break up with her. I would try to re-build the connection if I were you, but if she messed up this one time she might mess up again.
I do have a question too though:
I'm dating someone right now and we are both in college and sleep in the same bed every night. We don't have sex because we are Christians, so the most we do is kiss.
A few nights ago I woke up to him putting his penis in me. It hurt really bad and so I told him to please stop but he didn't. It hurt a lot and he stopped a few times when I kept asking but after he paused for a few seconds he'd keep going. He felt reeeeaaaaallly bad afterwards and tried to go kill himself. He's still really upset and we don't sleep on the same bed anymore.
Was this rape? I don't think he is like a "rapist" though, I think he just had poor control of himself. What do you think I should do? I didn't enjoy the sex at all but I'm honestly too worried about him to know how I feel about what happened
>This is rape.
No, it isn't. Consent isn't just verbal, it's physical. If he's rubbing his dick on me, and seems to really enjoy what we're doing, I'm going to assume he wants more. If he doesn't, then it's on him to make sure it never gets to that point in the first place.
>One person thought it was okay when it wasnt.
Communication is key. If you don't want to do something, you have to make it clear. If you're unable to communicate, for whatever reason, don't have ANY sexual contact with another person. You're going to send out the wrong signals. I was raped when I was a kid, but as an adult, I played it safe and never found myself in that type of situation (while my friends often did).
>Kicking her off me the moment she sat down wouldnt have changed the fact that it was pretty much rape at that point.
You shouldn't have let it get to that point, if your virginity is so important to you. You should be feeling regret over your poor choices, not blaming her.
>If you stick your penis in a girl. Tear her hymen, she says no and you stop. Do you honestly believe thats not rape.
In this hypothetical situation? No, as long as sex is stopped as soon as she says no. But this isn't what happened in your situation. You put yourself in a bad position, gave her all the wrong signals, and didn't properly communicate with her.
>Why do people think having sex with someone in their sleep is okay
Because most normal people in long-term relationships enjoy waking up to sex. It's the best way to start a day.
OP you weren't raped. Calm down. I get that you wanted to be a virgin, but you aren't anymore.
Grow the fuck up and deal with it. You need to get out more if you actually give a shit about this and please don't try to make her or anyone else feel bad about it. Seriously, get out more.
OP your aspies is leaking so goddamn much I need to wipe my computer screen.
How exactly is men's virginity defined anyway?
The second penis touches vagina?
The second it's inserted?
Inserted at all, or inserted all the way? Or is it at some point halfway through?
If it's all the way, does that mean you can thrust in and out as long as it isn't the whole thing?
>Was this rape?
Yes. You verbally told him to stop, multiple times, and he continued.
>I don't think he is like a "rapist" though, I think he just had poor control of himself.
Unfortunately, this type of situation isn't uncommon in certain religious communities. It's not healthy to repress yourself.
I'm not really sure what to tell you. Time and distance may allow you to get through this, or it may eat away at you. There's not much you can do for him.
I have a terrible problem with that actually. My body has a mind of its own - I've actually fallen into microsleep having sex, only to wake up a few minutes later and continue to go at it, with my girlfriend not being sure what the hell is going on and with myself having zero recollection of the event the next morning.
Luckily for me, she thought it was funny. But this never happened out of the blue - it only happened on nights when we were having sex as we were going to bed, and I fell asleep mid-coitus. But I could totally see how something like that could be jarring.
>No, it isn't. Consent isn't just verbal, it's physical. If he's rubbing his dick on me, and seems to really enjoy what we're doing, I'm going to assume he wants more. If he doesn't, then it's on him to make sure it never gets to that point in the first place.
This is the definition of rape. You also completely twisted what happened. He only laid there like a dead fish. You had to lie and say you werent going to continue so that it didnt stop.
>If you don't want to do something, you have to make it clear
Too bad we never talked about how sex wasnt okay. Hell Im not even going to argue this with you. She understands what she did was against my consent. I dont see why Ive even been entertaining you here.
>You're going to send out the wrong signals.
Said every rapist. Cant rape the willing right.
>You shouldn't have let it get to that point, if your virginity is so important to you
I can do what ever I want to. Its not a poor decision trusting someone
>In this hypothetical situation? No
Alright bait. Im done here. Not in the mood.
>As a guy who was actually fucking raped by a woman and man, no you shit you were not raped. Get over yourself.
You didnt fight her to the death to stop it. Its not rape.
This is some expert level red pill you guys gave me.
OP you were raped. Calm down. I get that you wanted to be a virgin, but you aren't anymore.
Grow the fuck up and deal with it. You need to get out more if you actually give a shit about this and please don't try to make her or anyone else feel bad about it. Seriously, get out more.
Alright, I feel like Im ready to talk about this with her. If I hear anything along the lines of whats said in this thread Im going to push it as far as possible.
It means he's gonna give her a taste of her own medicine and see how she likes having something forced upon her without her consent.
That something being an ill-conceived and completely illogical argument. gg OP no re
>"Push it as far as possible"
Im not even sure. Before I was mentally defending her as much as possible so that she doesnt get mentally rekt'd by the situation more so than she is from her past trauma.
But if she thinks like this its a waste. I comforted her because when she started breaking down saying she raped me I thought I couldnt let her feel this way after being raped herself. But now I feel like was thinking about her too much and not thinking about myself at all. Id probably just talk to friends and family about the situation first and see what they have to say. Maybe seek professional advice on what I should do.
We've been dating for a long time now and have known each other for years so I doubt Id just lash out and call the cops on here or something that extreme without thinking things through for a while.
>He only laid there like a dead fish.
I didn't read that part. In the OP, he said they were doing nightly "sexy" things before bed, like it was some sort of routine.
>She understands what she did was against my consent.
Again, consent can be verbal or physical. You have to make it clear that you want to stop. If you didn't, that's on you. I was violently raped when I was a child, by someone I thought I could trust, and I did everything within my power to get them to stop. When I was a teen, and even after I became an adult, I knew better than to put myself in risky situations because I didn't want to end up like my friends: sad and filled with regret.
>I can do what ever I want to.
Then you can also be an adult and take responsibility for allowing this to happen in the first place. If someone doesn't want to be date raped, or put into a situation where they can't say no, then you have to take preventative action. For some people, that's not leaving your drinks unattended, not allowing yourself to get blackout drunk around strangers, and in your case, not having sexual activity in a shared bed with someone that has different sexual values.
>Alright bait. Im done here. Not in the mood.
Honestly, you sound like bait. If I'm playing around with my guy, and he sticks it in without asking, and THEN I tell him to stop (and he stops), that's NOT rape. It can be uncomfortable and strange, but the line was drawn and no one took it further.
>he said they were doing nightly "sexy" things before bed, like it was some sort of routine.
It was stated that she started pushing things past the routine and the responses stopped
>I let her put my penis in her
>I was raped
Yeah I guess I just don't understand.
>if Im playing around with my guy
>say no sex
>he says he wont stick it in
>he sticks it it and then I tell him to stop
>thats NOT rape.
How is this not bait.
>I was violently raped when I was a child
I completely agree with you here. I believe that violent rape in the face of dissent is a special type of rape. However if you say no to something. Such as no someone cant borrow the keys to your car. And if someone asks you in your sleep and you ignore them because you trust theres no way theyd do it without your permission. And wake up to realize they did. They stole your car.
So you're going to tell your friends and family that she raped you in hopes that you can once again feel "pure" like a virgin?
The sex you had "counts", you know. Trying to "save face" by putting down someone you supposedly love in front of your friends and family is a low blow. It really shows where your priorities are you are selfish, vain, and prideful.
You may be able to fool yourself, but God can see right through you
If I thought I could get away with
>it didnt count
I wouldnt even be mad.
Do you even know what this phrase means. Im not in a position to save face from a private affair that isnt going to get out.
>It really shows where your priorities are you are selfish, vain, and prideful.
I see. Victims shouldnt speak out, and look to others for help. Always sympathize and protect their rapist. Bottle everything up.
Im not even saying she was hostile. But your logic is stupid.
>How is this not bait.
I didn't say that I specifically said, "No sex!" You're twisting this to fit OP's situation. I never specifically say what we can/can't do, because we've been together for a long time and asking ruins the mood. Based on my situation, and from what I've understood from other couples, people tend to just let things progress naturally. But as soon as someone says no, they stop, and it's all good. If you're someone that values virginity that much, then clearly you're going to take it as someone violating you.
>And if someone asks you in your sleep and you ignore them because you trust theres no way theyd do it without your permission.
I've had people do this to me before, because I do weird stuff in my sleep (I can hold conversations and appear to be awake, but still sleeping). You know what I do? When they come back, I take back the keys and tell them not to ask things of me until I'm out of bed.
Thats because youve said that the situation wasnt rape and that its an equivalent situation. Are you admitting the situation is rape now?
>I take back the keys and tell them not to ask things of me until I'm out of bed.
Yeah not imagine if its a stranger you didnt know. It theft. Just because you let it go doesnt mean its not theft.
Didnt consent. Just didnt kick her off immediately because she did it without asking or consent. Then phrased it in a way such that for that instant I believed what she did wasnt rape.
Because if you count just the tip as sex then at that moment I had been raped.
I didnt consent to anything. I didnt move. I sat their trying to process what the hell was going on. You seem to believe that
>just the tip
happened before or that it happened over a long period of time. It all happened back to back without me moving in a matter of seconds.
Yes it took me a second to realize what the hell was happening. No I dont think that inserting the tip doesnt count as sex. I would have never done that.
This is how messed up sex is now for youth.
No such thing as sensuality or eroticism they have to check in every step of the way "are you okay?"
Most people who lost their virginity in a healthy way were aroused to the point that they "gave up" something they had considered to be special.
They did not ask every second is this okay???
Plus just the tip is still your dick in a vagina so you already lost your v-card before she even did what she did.
This sounds like an extremely normal way for someone to lose their virginity but you are emotionally damaged in some way.
> in a crime
People say they want to be virgins until they are overcome with lust and say no. You putting your frigging penis tip in her made her think you were ready to lose it after 3 months of her being patient and understanding.
You tricked HER.
Possibly be expected to understand that for you a penis tip doesnt "count" as part of your penis
>You putting your frigging penis tip in her made her think you were ready to lose it
I dont understand how no matter how many times I say she did this without my consent. You think that I did.
>Possibly be expected to understand that for you a penis tip doesnt "count" as part of your penis
Uh no, this is what she said when she did it because she noticed I was upset.
Its not rape you idiot.
When I lost my virginity it was not because I said "hey I want to lose my virginity today" it was because when the penis got near my vagina That day I did not say no.
>when the penis got near my vagina That day I did not say no
This isnt the first time my penis got near a vagina and guess what she did. Ask if we could. Guess what I said. No. Guess what we talked about later. that were not going to have sex.
Doing something without consent is not a normal way to take someones virginity. Especially if you lead that person onto think you wont do it.
Read your original post you dumb dumb you were playing together naked didnt realize durrrr durrrr then she put the tip in and you "gave her a face"
Go report her any cop would laugh in your face
In fact I would love to see you try to report this and get pooed on by everyone you tell bc you are such a weirdo deformed weak freak of a man.
The best thing you could do for this girl is dump her because she deserves better than your narcissistic head games and your emotional problems.
>Doing something without consent is not a normal way to take someones virginity. Especially if you lead that person onto think you wont do it.
Is this how they raise college kids nowadays?
Your generation is very deeply disturbed.
what about my original post. She was laying ontop of me naked with my penis pressed against her vagina. Thats not sex. I didnt consent to her sticking it in.
lets imagine what a cop has to say. You realize that law on campuses now are if there isnt explicit yes its rape. Its why I havent told anyone.
Because laying there doing nothing is protesting as well.
Hopefully OP actually gets raped so he can see how much of a cunt he's being.
>we sleep in the same bed every night for like 3 months
>playing around naked most nights
No you didn't get raped you faggot. If your virginity was so precious to you, you shouldn't be sleeping with a woman naked in the same bed or playing with each other you fuck. Don't blame her because you want to fool around like a fucking idiot when, apparently sex is off the table to begin with.
You put yourself in a situation that if you ever gave a shit about being a virgin you would have never done. But you didn't, you are a faggot and you should fuck off because you didn't get raped, you brought this upon yourself. Your virginity wasn't important, you didn't act as such but you will pretend it did and then act like a victim like every asshole blaming everyone else for your poor decision making.
>If your virginity was so precious to you, you shouldn't be sleeping with a woman naked in the same bed or playing with each other
And why wouldnt I. Are you saying its my fault that after communicating and talking severals times about this I trusted her.
>your virginity wasn't important
Glad you think your ideas about what I think is important fuels your argument. Just another troll.
With the surge of trolls I dont think she'll say anything remotely like this. We might be able to work it out because she's not a rape advocate like you guys seem to think
>Anyone who doesn't validate me is a troll.
No you didn't get raped because I know if I didn't want to have sex with someone I wouldn't be sleeping naked next to my girlfriend, sleeping fully clothed, and all intimate actions would be done during the day instead of half asleep.
Just like those bitches who get fucked black out drunk, they didn't get raped. They should have chosen to not drink so much to black out, it is not everyone's responsibility to look out for your own personal problems and hang ups.
You didn't care, and it is very clear you didn't. But you are going to deflect any fault of yours in this situation to blame your girlfriend so you can maintain your psychopathic complex about how you were diddled by someone at a young age and you have to remain pure for that special someone. You are just trying to blame everyone else just like every other shitty person does when life slaps them in their face for acting stupid.
>No you didn't get raped because I know if I didn't want to have sex with someone I wouldn't be sleeping naked next to my girlfriend
Glad you think that way. I see know reason to do any of those things as long as theres trust between the two.
>You didn't care, and it is very clear you didn't.
Yeah thats why she lied right. Said she wasnt going to do it because she thought I didnt care if she did right?
This is just bullshit. Youre a troll. Plain as that.
look, you never ever SAID NO during the act.
you had an erection.
you LET her put the tip in.
It's only rape if you deny consent or are unable to give consent.
you weren't on drugs.
you weren't bound and gagged.
she wasn't going to hurt you or even be upset if you said no.
it's offensive to even consider calling this rape, OP.
girls who get black out drunk and then get fucked by sober guys have totally been raped.
Who the fuck has sex with an unconcious person?? That's a lot more rapey than the op's situation.
Any sober person that has sex with an unconcious person who can't even speak is a rapist
Yeah I wasnt sure before I made this thread. But from how weak the arguments for its not rape is, and after the trolling made me stop thinking about always defending her, its clear that its rape. It wasnt even about whether others would think its rape. This is a college campus which by law considers the case rape. Of course I dont want to throw someone out there who i care about like that.
No, it's not.
Rape occurs when sexual contact occurs without consent.
While it is not always violent, someone needs to either say no or be unable to say no for it to be considered rape.
The fact that you would even consider labeling this as rape makes me question your 'mild traumatic sexual history'.
The world would be a better place without people like you.
>look, you never ever SAID NO during the act.
I dont need to say NO when someone says beforehand that they arent going to do it.
>you LET her put the tip in.
Didnt realize that if someone does something without your permission you let them do it.
If the person goes to a gathering that is sexually charged, and chooses ON THEIR OWN VOLITION to get unconscious by drinking alcohol, they have given up all rights to blame anyone but themselves for their poor decision making.
People are scumbags, this isn't some new fact and people will get sex through easy means instead of having to work for it. This is also known, the ideal as a female getting fucked while black out drunk, isn't something new fangled thing.
You have to protect yourself, not depend on everyone else to protect you because you have no discipline or responsibility to get black out drunk in your own home if you want to get wasted and forget about life.
What is YOUR argument?
How was SHE supposed to know you didn't want sex if you LET HER FUCK YOU without saying a single word to stop it?
the only verbal interaction you've claimed is that, when she said just the tip, you said fine. Or in other words, gave consent. Maybe not consent for sex, but seeing as you never expressed in any way that you DID NOT WANT TO HAVE SEX AT THAT MOMENT, she DID NOT RAPE YOU.
>While it is not always violent, someone needs to either say no or be unable to say no for it to be considered rape.
You cant say no when you arent given the chance. And she was the one raped not me.
Why did you come here asking if this was rape when you had obviously already made up your mind?
>is this rape?
>oh okay it was rape
Anyways op- you'll look like a lunatic if you tell people your gf raped you and since you have zero evidence she'd probably just turn it around on you to make you look like the bad guy if you did pursue anything. My only actual advice to you is to go to therapy and to stop seeing this girl. Don't make it a big deal- resolve your issues and then move on with your life.
>the only verbal interaction you've claimed is that, when she said just the tip, you said fine.
No i didnt say that. If you read the thread it was agreed upon ahead of time that sex was a no go. I did not say fine. I just stopped the incredible hostile expression I was giving her after her words about how she wasnt going to initiate sex.
>you never expressed in any way that you DID NOT WANT TO HAVE SEX AT THAT MOMENT
This is just dumb. If i reach for you car keys. You look as if youre about to stop me. I say Im not going to steal them. You drop your guard and turn around and I take them. That does not mean the person gave consent or that you didnt steal it.
No one is saying that it's a good idea for a woman to go to a party and get black out drunk.
I wouldn't even say that that woman would be entitled to safety.
However, if you're sober/near sober, and you have sex with a blackout drunk girl, that's rape.
literally kill yourself.
sex is a beautiful thing and you're using it as some kind of power trip to fuck with your girlfriend.
that's disgusting. whatever 'abuse' you suffered does NOt justify creating some ridiculous situation where a person you claim to care about can 'rape' you by escalating a consensual sexual act.
i hate you.
i will remember you and hate you forever.
and i hope terrible things happen to you for the rest of your life.
Yeah kinda but the thing is because of gender roles it's usually the other way around where the girl is a virgin and the guy is horny af. Yeah she was wrong and you for sure need to talk to her about it but keep in mind she probably had good intentions that were warped by her cooch being too hot, guys do that with a boner all the time. She just wanted to make you feel good and was really (too) forward about it.
I say let her know how you really feel and about what went down. Girls are great with emotions and shit like that, just tell her why things went that way.
The thing is that remaining a virgin isn't the easiest thing to do realistically. Assuming that you've made a good judge of her character and shes a good person for you, it's fair to say that for most people it would be a good time to have intimate relations. However you have to realize that you're a bit different than both most virgins and non-virgins.
NOBODY ASKES, DURING SEX, "IS THIS OKAY!?
You had the option, the whole time, to SAY STOP or NO or I DON'T WANT THIS.
You did NOT do that.
That IS consent.
Yes, actually, that's literally what 'letting' someone do something is.
If a person touches my shoulder without my permission and I don't do or say anything about it, I am LETTING that person touch my shoulder.
Okay, done feeding the troll.
I'm not saying that the female has no responsibility.
But there should be no such thing as a "sexually charged environment". One should not ever assume that another person wants to have sex with them just because they chose to attend a "party". Lots of people go to parties just to hang out with their friends and dance with no intention of having sexual contact.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that we should be working towards an ideal without ignoring the reality of things. Yes- some people are scumbags. But in the same way that a woman who is raped in an alleyway "should have been carrying pepper spray", a girl at a party "shouldn't have drank so much". There is always a "could have" that should be taken into consideration, but that does not take away from the mal intent of the rapist. A sober man who fucks an unconcious woman is a scumbag. Having too much to drink does not excuse that person's crimes and make it "not rape anymore".
Obviously when both participants are drunk, or if the girl is only tipsy- that is more complicated. But if one partner is clearly incapacitated, that is not an invitation to touch them innapropriatly.
>you'll look like a lunatic if you tell people your gf raped you and since you have zero evidence she'd probably just turn it around on you to make you look like the bad guy if you did pursue anything.
Only way for her to pull that off is to lie and say I either vocally expressed consent or that we didnt have sex. Again, the law itself considers this rape since on college affirmative consent is needed. I came here because just because the law says so doesnt mean I have to agree.
the arguments saying no were just rape apologetic. I didnt make up my mind because it was clouded with trying to protect her. This thread made me drop that. I dont really want to tell a rape victim that they raped me. But now Im more prepared to do so.
>My only actual advice to you is to go to therapy and to stop seeing this girl
Im not about to go to therapy when I have others I can talk to. Im also pretty sure any therapist on campus is required to reveal these things so I might as well tell campus safety.
Ill talk to her first. If she tries the defensive bullshit this threads been pulling or Im not happy with the result Ill talk to friends and family and see how they feel about the situation. Im only here because telling the story here insures that I dont have to worry about someone else reporting this and fucking her over when I dont want that.
>If a person beats me up without me saying anything I am letting that person beat me up.
If a person touches you shoulder after you express that you never want them to touch your shoulder, the law will side with you.
Id grant it if I had never said no sex. Also did you miss the part about me stopping sex once I realized whats going on.
>NOBODY ASKES, DURING SEX, "IS THIS OKAY!?
By law you have to ask before doing so.
>You had the option, the whole time, to SAY STOP or NO or I DON'T WANT THIS.
Yeah its so easy to tell someone to stop raping you.
>That IS consent.
For those of you posting here:
Is it rape/sexual assault if a woman says no again and again, but the man puts his penis inside a little but the woman stops them, and so the man says it was an accident. The woman doesn't think it was an accident but decides to test her luck because she's tired and just go to sleep, after saying not tonight for the last time. After a couple minutes the man puts his penis inside her, finishes, and goes to sleep. She does not move and pretends to be asleep.
Is this a violation? No one says no or stop during the act.
What is a "result that you will be satisfied with"?
I'm just going to go ahead and tell you that you need PROFESSIONAL help. I was raped once, and while I don't agree that your experience should be labeled as "rape"- you were obviously violated and need to have some professional counseling. Don't push this burden on to your family/friends. Counsellors will keep confidentiality, and they can help you channel your emotions into constructive healing pathways.
The main problem here also is that "rape" and "sexual assault" are kind of recently named concepts. "Sexual assault" didn't have a name until like the 70's. These terms are limited by their vagueness. Sexual assault, for example, can cover anything from catcalling to unwanted groping to unwanted penetration. "Rape" is the same way- there are different levels of severity. Having been through a particularly violent rape myself, it is hard for me to imagine a situation like the one you described falling in the same category as what I went through. That does not, however, mean that you feel any less awful or violated than I do. I wish there was a better vocabulary here so that we could actually address your problems without getting hung up on the language.
>The main problem here also is that "rape" and "sexual assault" are kind of recently named concepts. "Sexual assault" didn't have a name until like the 70's. These terms are limited by their vagueness. Sexual assault, for example, can cover anything from catcalling to unwanted groping to unwanted penetration. "Rape" is the same way- there are different levels of severity. Having been through a particularly violent rape myself, it is hard for me to imagine a situation like the one you described falling in the same category as what I went through. That does not, however, mean that you feel any less awful or violated than I do. I wish there was a better vocabulary here so that we could actually address your problems without getting hung up on the language.
> Anonymous 01/07/16(Thu)08:38:06 No.16655026 ▶
>"No one says no or stop during the act."
>You typed that the woman stopped him/said no several times throughout the night???
I meant prior to penetration, saying she did not want to have sex that night. Not when he entered for the final time or during the act.
you said "the man put his penis inside a little bit she stopped him". That counts as a clear "NO" signal.
If your GF had put the tip in and you had "stopped her", the situation would have clearly been rape.
Also, in your hypothetical situation, the woman is supposedly unconcious, which means that the man knows he's taking advantage of her incapacitated state.
The two scenarios are totally different, I don't know if you were trying to make parallels with your own situation but- I think the hypothetical situation IS rape, and your actual situation is not rape (violation, but not rape)
I'm not OP. In my example the woman is tired of having to say no so she tries to fall asleep, since the man says putting it inside her is an accident. She says no but 10 minutes pass after she says no and he goes inside her. He takes the lack of saying no as consent. When she lets her guard down he puts it all the way in, proving the previous times weren't really an accident. So no one is unconscious and no one said no after penetration began.
>What is a "result that you will be satisfied with"?
Im not even sure about it. i feel violated and betrayed. And robbed.
The previous conversation went along the lines of her admitting to pretty much what I said, and me saying its my fault for not taking action.
Ill drop the word rape because its just a word and violent rape in the face of dissent is on another level than rape without consent.
Before I had a more wish washy stance on what happened because the event is kinda surreal.
Before when we talked it was her derided herself and me comforting her. Which is bullshit given the situation but seeing as how see was previously raped and Im not sure of all of the circumstances she could have needed it more.
The thing that pisses me off more is not just that she made a mistake and violated me, she now is pushing for sex harder with excuses like the line was already crossed. She'll only feel like a rapist if we dont have sex properly. I have to deal with the fact my first time was shit. Was a few seconds of a girl riding me against my will. I havent gotten a boner since I went limp. I dont know how we are supposed to move passed this.
how is this conversation supposed to go. Hey I know someone took your first time without your consent, but you took mine without my consent.
What if she tries to use my words of comfort against me. I can only imagine how triggered Id be if she told me I should have stopped her. She hasnt yet. She knows that I was uncomfortable during the situation which is why she feels so guilty. Ive also been avoiding her telling her I need time to think so she could be trying to build a defense for herself right now. After all if she feels cornered thats what any person in a corner would do.
Im not about to see a counselor. Someone on 4chan isnt going to convince me to do so. Itd have to be a really close friend or a family member.
I just really needed to talk to someone. Even the trolls here. Talking to myself was driving me mad.
She was never an active participant, and in the situation the man obviously disregards her wishes (which she has made very clear in the moments surrounding his actions).
She isn't unconcious, but the man THINKS she is, which reflects poor intent.
In op's situation, he is an active participant. Things are getting hot and heavy and slowly escalating. Things go too far, he has regret, and then the situation stops abruptly.
As an active participant, however, he is partially responsible for not clearly communicating with the girl.
If op had said RIGHT BEFORE they had sex "okay remember no sex!" Then I would have more sympathy for him. However, it seems that he and his gf have just "talked about it before", meaning that it could potentially be months or weeks since they last mentioned it.
I condsider saying yes/no to sex right before sex an "in the act" action. Like if I say no to sex for the night while we're laying in bed, that is clear, in the act communication. If op had done that, or if he had refused his gf's advances only to have her take advantage of him when she thought his guard was down- then yes, it would have been rape
>If your GF had put the tip in and you had "stopped her", the situation would have clearly been rape.
Think of it this way. She puts the tip in without consent and then she stops before I vocally express dissent.
And in her situation the person is pretending to be asleep.
>violation, but not rape
Violation in the form of sex without consent is by definition rape
because I didnt want to be laid. This isnt my first time being around a girl. Just the first time someone has done this to me.
>If op had said RIGHT BEFORE they had sex "okay remember no sex!"
Did you miss the part about how she said we werent going to have sex and started riding me literally 1 or 2 seconds later.
> "talked about it before", meaning that it could potentially be months or weeks since they last mentioned it.
Thats quite the assumption you made. This is not what happened if it helps you reason. We talk about this very often. Like pretty much every time we are naked as if shes was waiting for me to say yes.
Well I guess she got tired of waiting for a yes.
I'm know I'm not going to convince you- but at least hear me out and consider what I have to say-
Counsellors have been trained on how to listen to your feelings, validate your mood, and direct you in the way of healing. Like that problem with you not getting a boner? That could potentially stick around for a while. You might have nightmares about what happened. You may have a loss of identity and lose all motivation. Having someone to vent to is important, and I encourage you to do that with close friends and family. But for HEALING, you really should consider going to a therapist at some point if you start to have noticeable side affects.
You had an experience that hurt your soul and your mind. In the same way that you go to a doctor when you hurt your physical body, you should see a professional when you hurt your mind.
I think that you should tell your gf how you feel about what happened, and you should tell her how uncomfortable she is making you by pressuring you for sex. Then I'd personally advise some distance. You don't have to end things with her abruptly, but you need some time to focus on yourself. She'll likely feel hurt by what you have to say, but if you focus your attention on her, you'll be pushing aside your own feelings.
Good luck op
>but if you focus your attention on her, you'll be pushing aside your own feelings.
Thats what I feel like ive been doing. But thats to this threads masterful reverse psychology I dont plan on doing that anymore.
I think it's safe to say that this is now a bait thread and OP is a troll.
Go back to your lives people. Show's over.
To me, if you aren't a troll, what you experienced that night seemed to be a symptom of a shittier situation. It would seem to me that you were manipulated more than you were unlawfully violated. I was in a similar situation when I was younger, and if your post is sincere I sincerely give my condolences. However, you need to learn how to cope with it and take responsibility for it anon; it's not fair, seemingly, but it's the only way.
I'll explain fully, if she hadn't mounted you what would you have done afterward? Would you (or her) be seriously content with "just the tip". Probably not. But I feel like you'd feel hurt regardless of if you'd personally said okay. From my perspective it seems like she wore you down. Like a frog in the pot (it's an outdated metaphor, I know) she kept gradually turning up the heat until you didn't even know what was happening. How did the night "play" happen. Did you originally want to do it?