How come a game studio does "anime CG" better

Infinitely bigger budget

>>138304901
Because it's all fucking based on cg.
And if you're going to bring up anime cg you might as well bring up boobs while you're at it. They need more boobs to make cg better.
If you've seen any game where the character has boobs it's likely they have their own gravitational field and also SWAY IN THE WIND.
What is that shit about? I like boobs but come on, that makes me dislike them.

>>138304941
/thread

>>138304941
I dunno man, Arc System Works aren't exactly loaded. Probably has more to do with their way of doing it http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1022031/GuiltyGearXrd-s-Art-Style-The

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>>138305038
The boobs thing you mentioned are exactly why their cg models work. They aren't affectd by any physics at all, every single movement is manually crafted. For example, if a character points their fist towards the camera, the fist becomes huge to mimic the "errors" of 2D.

>>138305574
So you're saying the boobs are bigger because it's mimicking 3D? What i'm saying is that boobs don't sway in the wind. They don't bounce up and down when a character turns their head or breathes. The fundamental flaw is trying to do something unnecessary to something already so great. Boobs and butts are some of the best things to exist, and yet they pervert their true nature. Sickening.

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>>138305798
I don't think we're on the same track here. I was trying to say that this game has doesnt have that weird swaying, because there's no boobs dedicated physics engine or anything pulling the string. EVERYTHING you see is pretty much hand made. They even go as far as to deform the models for every single frame rather than just move the limbs around. Their motto was something like "Everything must have been a made decision, not a calculation by the engine". Like damn, shit has smears and everything.

Because cg in anime is almost always used to save budget, nearly all of the cg you see in anime is bad cg.

>>138306413
That just makes me wonder, aren't those dancing scenes in idol shows the equivalent of important fights in action shows? In action shows you usually see the budget being saved for those fights that have to look really good, but in idol shows, the perfomances are like the only scenes where they reosrt to cg. Do nips actually prefer 3D in their dancing scenes? Last time I remember seeing hand drawn dancing was in Kyokai no Kanata, and that shit was gorgeus, so you gotta wonder

>>138306765
Isn't it because they love doing those dynamic sweeping cameras during the concerts? CG really helps with that.

>>138306765
This is why iM@S is infinitely superior.

>>138304901
Name?

CC2 is better

>>138306925
Guilty Gear XRD

>>138306075
Wouldn't it be better to just have the engine do the calculations for you instead of painstakingly doing it by hand?

>>138305137

Even so I can tell you that there is no way Guilty Gear was made on a <$5 million dollar budget.

>>138306827
Now that you mention it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGgKVnEPf2c doesn't have those sweeping cameras. I still prefer this stuff though and sweeping cameras are just a matter of talent I think

>>138307020
Not if you want it to truly look 2D. If you have nothing to do watch this http://www.gdcvault.com/play/1022031/GuiltyGearXrd-s-Art-Style-The

>>138304901
>how come someone who are more experience and well studied on this system is more better than those who aren't.

>>138307084
So it's a stylistic choice, huh? I think it only works for video games where you have to work with CGI.

>>138305798
>What i'm saying is that boobs don't sway in the wind

i cant stop laughing

>>138307020
Assuming that your physics engine produces accurate results, sure.

Creating a physics engine that give you the results you want isn't easy though, anything that isn't a rigid body is a pain to simulate.

>>138307020
Cheaper, yes. Easier, yes. Better, no no no. It's the real reason why Xrd looks incredibly good for CG animu style.

>>138307151
No, it's a stylistic choice to Mimic good anime look as best as possible. It overcomes the limitations of CG compared to drawings, by doing it MANUALLY.

This in turn loses out some of the advantages of CG, but the result is fucking beautiful.

>>138304901
More time and money. IT's that simple.

>>138306952
CC2 are good too, but their stuff is "too perfect" which makes look more 3D than ASW

>>138307371
Not really, well, kind of. It's not just that they had time and money, but that they manually made the CG look good. Pure CG can't match the artist's touch yet.

>>138307319
With all that work involved, I think there are only very few works that actually do that properly because programming models to mimic anime aesthetics more faithfully is harder and more tedious than actually drawing those anime aesthetics.

>>138306981
>not having a PS4

;_;

>>138306765
It's easier to have lots of body movement, such as for dancing, while staying on model when using 3DCG animation. It's especially efficient as you can do things like basically repeating movements but with different viewpoints and different characters (dancing in sync). It's also easier to find staff that can do that work. If they could actually have the same work, as in the same dance choreography, done in 2D, on model, then they'd prefer the result, but it's less likely to be practical (and becomes less so the more dancing you need).

>>138307741
It's also for PS3 tho go get it

>>138307741
>>138307763
It's on PC.

>>138304901
What I don't like about Guilty Gear XRD animation is that jarring low framerate movement "to imitate hand draw animation". It doesn't work like that, you faggots. Hire and/or learn from some real animators how to animate!

>>138307799
Watch that presentation that has been linked a couple of times in this thread now. Thea guy show the same swing in 60 fps andet limit side by side and its clear wich one looks more 2D

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>>138304901
Daisuke is a fucking genius, i tell ya

>>138307799
I don't know, it feels more like they are doing it on purpose when you cancel a normal into another normal

>>138307750
>It's especially efficient as you can do things like basically repeating movements but with different viewpoints and different characters (dancing in sync).

I cannot stress how much time this can save.

If you have a load of backup dancers with very similar models performing the same motions you only need to animate once dancer. Then apply that set of animations to all of them and tweak as necessary to compensate for any differences in their models.

>>138307750
If its for the sake of practicality, I can see why they would do it but it just seems like the kind of thing you would save your budget for

>>138307956
Wasnt the first GG just an excuse for him to publish his music or something?

>>138307956
And also a better writer than Mori

>>138308147
Who knows, maybe he just wanted to voice Sol

>>138307799
The real animators who are moving to 3DCG do the same thing. It's just Japan/the industry, they find full-frame CGI weird-looking for whatever reason.

>>138308147
Wouldn't surprise me if it was. I wasn't all that impressed with the first GG, the series only got good with GGX.

>>138308220
GIRLFRIEND

a 7 second intro and outro isn't shit

stop baiting

>>138308252
You're saying that they don't like their CGI stuff at 24 fps? Either they're cheap as fuck or they're oldfags who won't try new things.

>>138308358
I think this is just a veiled GG thread.

>>138308501

Everything's fucking GG with you SJW's, fml.

>>138308491
Yeah, they don't like how it looks and want to imitate 2D anime more.

>>138308637
The thing is, if all they do to make it look 2D is animate it as usual but keep the framerate low, shits just gonna look choppy rather than natural. You gotta craft each frame with the goal in mind

>>138308315
GREEDO SEVAH
The engrish in fighting games is so cheesy, I love it.

Fuck yeah gonna grind some Millia/Ramlethal right now.

Can't wait for Revelator to come out.

>>138308501
GG has a manga, so it's good to go. Maybe

>>138308950
>revelator out in june
>meanwhile CF will be out sometime in november if we are lucky
Honestly, fuck arcades.

>>138308831
I believe they render or partially render it in full and then cut that down themselves, so there is an element of selection, but I agree it's not really working as intended.

>>138309157
What they need to do is make 2D imperfections since no 3D software has an "artist touch" function

>>138308831
There is technically smoothing curves for that, but as anybody who has done entry level animation can tell you: Its really tricky to get it working properly.
Unsmoothed animations is some time superior because its less choppy.

>>138304901
more time to release finished product

Because https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhGjCzxJV3E

You're welcome

>>138307956
Ainu or jomon?

>>138304901
Because they actually bother to get the face right. Anime CG faces always look retarded.

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Post more Jack-o

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>>138304901
Because they have a shitload more time on their hands.

Have you seen the amount of effort that goes into Guilty Gear's visuals? Every frame of animation is relighted to ensure the phong shading is always perfect.

>>138304901
>Budget
>Different scope of the project
Doing what Arcsys did to a 1 cour anime would be crippling and would never be worth it in the end.

>>138312921
Do you really think anime studios would put in the same amount of effort given the time? There are both shows and movies in full CGI now and since those use cgi as their main thing and not just to patch stuff up, they really have no excuse

>>138313598
Yeah it seems like they're using CG just to cut corners.

>>138313598
Yes but most studios DON'T have the time to make a good effort. A 12 episode series has crazy time constraints unless it's done in advance or with more-than-usual production time.

Cheap CGI is used in series to speed things up instead of drawing more things, which is why the standard is set low.

That's why films usually always look better becuas ethey have more production time.

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Can't believe how many times I would've used this, so I made one for future use.

Can't find the 60fps presentation anywhere, so unless anyone wants to do interpolation, you'll have to do with this.

>>138306413
>budget meme
IT actually costs appreciably more than traditional animation. The problem is that most directors switch to CG, but don't know the inner workings of things.

There are maybe three studios that can do CG well. I'd probably say Orange takes the cake, Ayylmaotable isn't bad, and Sunrise's in-house team CAN do really good, but they've got wild inconsistency issues.

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People keep talking about CG but last I heard Xrd is just regular-old 3D models with visual filters to give it that look. Now, I know that's how CG is made, but then OP's question becomes "why are game studios better at making and designing 3d models than animation studios?" Which is a silly question, budget aside. Right?

>>138314846
Dude have you even read the thread? If applying a filter was all you had to do to achieve Xrds look, cg in anime wouldn't be so shit. They achieve the look by remodeling and deforming the models ind every singlen frame, leaving nothing left as a result of a computer calcuation

I like CG when studios use it sparingly to just enhance 2D. Dynamic camera angles and lighting goes a long way.

>>138314314
The main problem is the loss of clear movement of the leg, and less frames for the red streak.
Its honestly a weird thing, and its not obvious what is best.
I.E Jedi Knight would play like SHIT without the streaks left by the sabers.

>>138315086
That must suck, having to work on and develop every single frame. Can't imagine a medium where you'd be required to do that.

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>>138313731


Let's talk about Game dev's doing 2D now

>>138313598

You'd need to change everything about production then.

>12-24 episodes per year
>12+~ months full production time (not including when it's announced/financed, but the time spend drawing)
>now have to compensate sale price for that against the current 36+ episodes a year + and out sourcing they did (in both directions)

Being a GAME, there are probably far better 3D modellers in employment than there are for the few CG scenes in some anime.

It's just another time/money issue and being an established franchise. Anime studio's need to hire better CG artists, but they all probably want to work with the movie industry or games.

>>138307319

Still waiting for dreamworks/pixar level CG from anime (decades probably). The only hurdle left is the face, panda 3 was fucking beautiful. Just not sure how well it's suited to anime style slapstick and deformation though.

>>138304901

Because anime studios would rather pick from the bargain bin and vidya industry rejects than actually invest money into making their own CG good

Japanese much talent make videogame.

Japanese little talent make anime.

Japanese no talent salaryman.

>>138318101

Also should add that there's more money to be made in the vidya industry over the anime industry as a modeler/animator

Save for an undying love for anime, if the vidya industry industry pays more obviously more people will choose it

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POTEMKIN PLAYERS FALL IN!

SALUTE IN THE NAME OF FAB!

>>138318233
Japanese with really great talent make cool cars

>>138317706
>want to work with the movie industry or games


just games, I assume, given how shitty Jap cg is,

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>>138318410
Aye aye, sir.

Let's not turn this into a /v/ thread

>>138318002
>still waiting for hundred-million-dollar CG from million-dollar productions
This is not a matter of skill or industry culture anything, it's just not going to happen unless someone revolutionizes CG so it's cheap as hell.

>>138319336
Anime fighter is like a daywalker, it can be either videogame or anime. The word anime is right in the title.

With that artstyle in a game. I just hope it could spread to anime studios. But that's fuck huge time and money.

I think it would work great, but if there's so much 'purposeful deformation', there's only a few situations it would be better than 2D, and they already seem to use it for that stuff (keeping mechs, large objects on model with perspective change), just not to the same detail or skill as game animators.

This just proves that you can, with CG keep the look we are after, it doesn't need to all go dreamworks level of attempted photorealism in the backgrounds, which could still be 2D. Though with the added 3D models you could do far better terrain design that's more than just a background blur or static.

Just waiting for you billionaire anon to pump money into the industry at a loss and improve it.

Right now it's still probably too costly, but if ANime studios managed to make 3D look as good as GGXrd's, I'd welcome our CGshit overlords.

They need to animate far fewer frames.

>>138319336
Agreed just...man it is impossible for him to not have a fun to watch match in any version of gg.