>>137457048 powerlevel wankery. The abandonment of stealth and tactics in favor of ever more ludicrous powers. Sharingan wankery. the entirety of the bijuu WMD nonsense. basically everything after the chunnin exams.
>>137457262 You're retarded of course it was preventable. The whole hand seal/jutsu system was set up very well and so long as the author tried to give every fucking named ninja some basics instead of making every single one a god damn X-man that ignores the basics 99% of the time it would have been GOAT battle shonen.
But no, the author figured since the X-men rookie 9 were all one trick ponies and no one cried at how stupid that was, it was totally okay to let grown up ninjas also be reliant on gimmicks in spades to the point where well rounded ninjas that act like ninjas are probably the most rare types in Naruto.
Naruto was just a shitter with one special gimmick at the chuunin exam. He couldn't rely on it to cruise control his whole way through, nor could he rely on it to learn jutsus in 1/100000th the time it took everyone else back then. He was still a fucking dumb kid drop out who simply had a lot more chakra which made selling the enemy moves feasible which from a story telling perspective is a cliche just like how your average battle shonen MC will always tank the enemy's trump cards before kicking their ass. You would have to skip a lot of that shit if your MC wasn't in a position to get his ass beat for 10 chapters straight and most mangaka can't possibly write stories like that. Hell Naruto wasn't even the best hard worker, that was Rock Lee, who had legitimate autism whereas Naruto always slacked off like a normal child whenever things didn't interest him early on.
It could have been an actual Yugioh Battle Shonen using ninjas instead of CG monsters and bikes. But no fuck that, X-Men takes less effort.
Why do you think all the greatest anime fights in Naruto mostly consist of taijutsu? Because taijutsu is the least special snowflake and the fighting form that least deprives the enemy of the ability to react and stand there like a retard making reaction faces.
>>137459275 Right, and sence that was Naruto's original goal it should've ended around there, not limp on for 300 chapters to a ninja war that only succeeded as a backdrop for Naruto's final fight with Sasuke.
Disagree, guys like Kiba were super bland and just cardboard stereotypes and 99% of their development is in a simple flash back chapter/episode. It also doesn't help that they are one trick ponies with their fighting abilities.
Fucking MOBA shits have more fighting styles than the Naruto cast.
Naruto should've been about ninjas in training and their wacky shenanigans in school while they slowly become proper ninjas. Instead, it took itself way too seriously and we ended with ninja wars, nuclear strike jutsus, revive the undead, bloodlines and special snowflake abilities being the only thing that matters, etc.
>>137460230 >>Disagree, guys like Kiba were super bland and just cardboard stereotypes Out of all characters you picked Kiba? You could've picked any of the 7 deadly sins. However, just because they're stereotypes doesn't mean it wasn't a strong-cast. Stereotypes exist in real life and their powers and fights were good pre-timeskip
>Itachi was a good guy all along >Pain brings everyone back to life >Danzou being fucking useless >Super Mega Sage Walking Fireball mode >Sasuke being forgiven >Orochimaru being forgiven And then of course there's gif related. Probably forgetting a dozen other things
>>137461948 Who did you want me to pick then? I won't say they are all generic, but if we count percentages among named characters, the vast majority of all Naruto characters are cardboard X-men that define themselves with mannerisms and abilities and only slightly change after a flashback and what happens afterwards.
Only main characters like Kakashi get any semblance of real development and one can easily argue that they take way too many chapters to develop that much.
The format in which Naruto develops characters is so formulaic that 99% of people picking their favorites is simply due to that cardboard cut out fitting their own tastes. Almost no one can claim they found a character shit or boring but then after development turned into their favorites.
>>137462099 Why is the Sasuke retrieval arc a good example in your mind? I found it boring as shit and incredibly repetitive, even more so than the Chuunin exam which at least spaced out the flash backs or condensed them and used the mystery of Orochimaru/Sound's involvement to keep things interesting. With the retrieval arc there was none of that, the viewer/reader knew exactly what was going on, nothing to wonder about, and only looked forward to seeing who would win what fight.
>>137462265 >Sasuke being forgiven I don't get what Sasuke did to Konoha hate him. The worst he did was kill the man who ordered the murder of his family. Leaving the village is hardly a crime, and he never actually attacked the village, even though he wanted at one point.
>>137460356 honestly it became that as soon as the end of the first arc when Kakashi did the first raikiri/chidori thing. I remember when reading it back then i felt at that moment "here we go, dbz energy attacks"
>>137463167 What the flying fuck is even the 7 deadly sins of Naruto? I don't remember this shit and all Google brings up is fan fiction, why don't you give a specific character name instead of being retarded? No one here believes you, nor supports you. The onus is on you.
>>137462616 >I don't get what Sasuke did to Konoha hate him He's a fucking traitor who sided with the enemy, caused quite a ruckus during the kage summit and regardless of Danzo"s actions, which weren't actually bad and were for the protection of the village, he did assassinate their leader.
>Leaving the village is hardly a crime You're cited as a missing-nin if you deflect from your duties in your village which Sasuke did, the only reason why he wasn't given a hit on his head was because of Naruto.
>>137463434 >claims naruto's characters are generic tropes >doesn't even realize the thematics of naruto character personalities Like I'm confident you haven't seen or read Naruto at all. Can you even name a single character? It's like you just came here with info you've gained from secondaries.
>>137457048 It went from "you can do anything if you put your mind to it" to "lol ur god". Sure, it was going to be hard to find a rational fair way to end naruto without all that extra bullshit that happened, but it could've been done.
>>137463504 >literally named Kiba >dodges point about 7 deadly sins and acts like your fan fiction sekret klub matters
Holy shit the amount of backpedaling is next level here. You have nothing to say do you? There's not a single non-main character you can name that doesn't fall under the generic formula I posted and you know it.
That's why you gotta keep dodging like a little bitch and tell people to read imaginary shit to interpret imaginary exposition.
The funny thing is this all stems from you claiming Naruto had a great cast, when you keep moving the goal post one country at a time. You gonna run outta chakra soon if you keep teleporting like that faggot so step up or shut up.
>>137459802 >a simple and fun underdog story It was doomed from the very start when it started promoting that effort and guts could outdo natural talent, when natural talent and SSJ bullshit will win 100% of the time.
Pretty much the only character for which this is not the case is Lee, and Kishimoto hated him.
>>137463662 I don't think you understand how this shit works
when a ninja from your village goes rogue, YOU are responsible. When a rogue from your village attacks another village, that village will send an angry letter to you and in the name of diplomacy you will apologize and tell them that you'll take care of it. This is how relationships between nations work. If your kid breaks a window because he's a twat, you pay the window and apologize
not to mention he killed their temporary Hokage, Danzo, and tried to kill various ninja from Konoha multiple times (Sakura, Naruto, even Kakashi). Villages are a family; you attack one, you attack the whole village
I seriously miss old school, first 4 volumes Naruto. I could never even fucking figure out what time they lived in either. One minute they have cars and boats and TVs and guns and the other they're still using kunais and shit
If you notice, in the chunin arc, the implied power of doujutsu versus regular ninja is played up heavily. Naruto is represented as a regular ninja, a ninja not of destiny (in this case familial prowess). This results in an underdog fight against neji and his byakugan. We are meant to root for the underdog except this underdog is actually the destined savior of the world. So much like Aquarion evol is not about breaking destiny naruto follows into the same trap but with characters that are described by the magic they use. Instead the world is populated with people who are special and the only one to top special is to constantly trump each other with more magic. It's why the early parts are pretty good shounen much like a ippo or something like that because the training and learning is pretty good but the fights themselves are restricted by the strict use of magic and not real fighting mechanics, and the feints that the magic allow is what detracts from the story because there is no tension in the fights for the good guys
>>137464593 eh the types of naruto threads are dramitcally different especially since the show/manga has finially ended. If this was a power level fucking thread i thinki i'd be spamming just to maintain old /a/ standards on this shit, but discussing the literally mistakes and laziness of kishimoto seems pretty safe, considering all the anno bashing threads we currently get
>>137457048 The only thing i didn't liked about Naruto was Kaguya. I know Kishimoto planned her for about 30 chapters before the end but it felt rush. Well at least Madara wan't the final villain seriously hated that guy
>>137464775 the sad thing is that Kaguya was transparently an ass-pull even though she was conceived of probably 100 chapters before the end due to the movie production timeline constraints.
but looking back it's not like anything of the war arc was really redeemable. I don't even remember the order of which mode of tree/10T/jinchuriki the final battles occurred in nor when or why Obito backstabbed Madara then inexplicably turned good.
>>137457048 The moment Itachi hospitalized Kakashi and hospitalized him, the series was sent to a hell of power creep, forced drama, and DARKNESS. Naruto and Sasuke's relationship was just pent with forced drama and the grand meaning behind their squabble (what with the clashing bloodlines and all) was stupid.
I though about it and all my favorite battles are fought using every ninja tool possible. Most of them involving Sasuke right up until he got the mangekyou (Sasuke-Itachi was actually a fantastic fight).
The only fight that breaks that norm is the absolute best in the series which is Lee-Gaara, where both were specialists who had their own things. But it worked in that case because at that point that was the exception and because they informed both characters. Gaara had his on special thing and didn't use anything else because it was so OP and exclusive to him that he didn't need to use anything, and Lee used the one thing only because he literally couldn't do anything else, it was a disadvantage in his case.
>>137465091 If he hadn't become so edgy then he wouldn't have been consider the most popular character in the Manga and in a lot of other series, for some reason people back in the 2000's loved edgy characters
>>137465418 how about something that forced ninjas to act like actual ninjas instead of battalions of kung-fu battle mages?
off the top of my head: > Madara or whoever uses Hiroshima-no-jutsu, elemental nations shrecked overnight > no safe haven of villages for ninjas, have to hide in the wild or blend into refugee and prison camp populations > maybe nardo keeps ridiculous sage powers, but he really can't use them since they'll show up to the big-bad like a beacon, and he'd get curb stomped, or his compatriots would at least get murdered > smaller tactical missions leading toward strategic goal of killing big-bad and restoring world order
there were scattered great moments afterwards, but the last time the longer narrative seemed strong to me was the Forest of Death.
Naruto actually only has two skills: making clones and using the rasengan. Later on he learns the sage chakra and kyuubi chakra but that doesn't actually change anything about his skills, it just makes him Goku-level powerful.
I didn't like how Tobi was revealed to be Obito, everyone expected it so it was the most underwhelming reveal ever.
Sakura was annoying and a useless character.
I don't like how over powered they made the Uchiha. >haha itachi I am stronger than you! >wait sasuke I actually have this all powerful sharingan skeleton armor that I can summon! >neat! I'll use that against danzo! >but wait danzo has an all powerful sharingan technique that can overwrite reality! >neat let's use that against kabuto! >actually, let's use this other sharingan technique that will overwrite his personality and make him a good guy or something
How about every fucking person being a hero. You're a hero! Now you're a hero! Were you ever a dick in your life? Well step right up and get redeemed because in this show nobody is at fault for anything! Maybe the worst/laziest thing they did was make it about selling shit rather than an actual show. Suddenly after the chunin exam any character that has more than 15 fans is untouchable. Yeah sure they'll kill off one character but it takes a whole fucking war to break out for kishi to do it. You can't feel anything for a show that was billed early on as high risk once it become a comic relief fest. In the beginning they talked non stop about how ninjas don't last very long. It was COOL that Kakashi seemed like the last of an era. I'm seriously concerned their will be an overpopulation issue in konoha with all the amounts of ninja that don't get killed being ninja.
This is one of the big ones, and something a lot of shonen fall prey to.
There's some wide enough to drive a bus through. I'm too tired to dig them all up.
>Sauce and the Edge Gang
Really, this became a major issue as soon as the Chunin exam arc hit. Everything after that was tainted. Topping Gaara as a villain was going to be hard no matter what, but there's few ways to more incompetantly drop the ball than Naruto did when it comes to plot focus and coherency. Things from the first half of the series became issues, and entire plotpoints and messages went down the fucking drain as soon as Shipperwhats hit the scene.
>>137464714 >I never got the love of you guys for this Arc. It's not that it's a good arc, its that after the arc there is a paradigm shift and the series isn't the same anymore. It's not bad, but it's clearly just dragging on. And then the series took a nosedive after the Chunin Exams.
All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.
This is a 4chan archive - all of the shown content originated from that site. This means that 4Archive shows their content, archived. If you need information for a Poster - contact them.
If a post contains personal/copyrighted/illegal content, then use the post's [Report] link! If a post is not removed within 24h contact me at email@example.com with the post's information.