What went wrong?

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What went right?

Something went wrong?

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>>137457048

>>137457048
They made all the characters cool except the main ones.

>>137457048
power levels escalating out of control. To be fair, it's not like that was preventable, what with the mc having a hidden OP mana well that was bound to become relevant in the future.

fuck off narutards

>>137457134
what the fuck are they doing on the moon?

>>137457114
See
>>137457262

>>137457193
I thought Naruto was a really good relatable character since he was kinda of a shitty brat and not a stoic "hero"

But then they stopped with the whole "everyone hates him because he has a demon inside him, so he has to prove himself" plotline and he became the chosen one

The story was sold to us by being about an underwhelming underdog who tried hard to become a ninja. Then the story focused on the importance of lineage and the main character turned out to be jesus.

>>137457893
and the actual underdog got shit on and never had any moments that mattered to the story

>>137457624
He became a hero so of course he decided to like him.

>>137457048
Shippden.

>>137457048
powerlevel wankery.
The abandonment of stealth and tactics in favor of ever more ludicrous powers.
Sharingan wankery.
the entirety of the bijuu WMD nonsense.
basically everything after the chunnin exams.

Conspiracy on top of conspiracy stoped Naruto from being a simple and fun underdog story and turned it into some poor man's house of cards that should've ended 300 chapters sooner.

>>137457262
You're retarded of course it was preventable. The whole hand seal/jutsu system was set up very well and so long as the author tried to give every fucking named ninja some basics instead of making every single one a god damn X-man that ignores the basics 99% of the time it would have been GOAT battle shonen.

But no, the author figured since the X-men rookie 9 were all one trick ponies and no one cried at how stupid that was, it was totally okay to let grown up ninjas also be reliant on gimmicks in spades to the point where well rounded ninjas that act like ninjas are probably the most rare types in Naruto.

Naruto was just a shitter with one special gimmick at the chuunin exam. He couldn't rely on it to cruise control his whole way through, nor could he rely on it to learn jutsus in 1/100000th the time it took everyone else back then. He was still a fucking dumb kid drop out who simply had a lot more chakra which made selling the enemy moves feasible which from a story telling perspective is a cliche just like how your average battle shonen MC will always tank the enemy's trump cards before kicking their ass. You would have to skip a lot of that shit if your MC wasn't in a position to get his ass beat for 10 chapters straight and most mangaka can't possibly write stories like that. Hell Naruto wasn't even the best hard worker, that was Rock Lee, who had legitimate autism whereas Naruto always slacked off like a normal child whenever things didn't interest him early on.

It could have been an actual Yugioh Battle Shonen using ninjas instead of CG monsters and bikes. But no fuck that, X-Men takes less effort.

Why do you think all the greatest anime fights in Naruto mostly consist of taijutsu? Because taijutsu is the least special snowflake and the fighting form that least deprives the enemy of the ability to react and stand there like a retard making reaction faces.

Too many small things to count. One big thing. Power creep.

>>137459275
Right, and sence that was Naruto's original goal it should've ended around there, not limp on for 300 chapters to a ninja war that only succeeded as a backdrop for Naruto's final fight with Sasuke.

>>137459931
No one big thing is Edgy and villain never overcome pass pussy.

>>137457048
A vast amount of back story and lore brushed aside for muh uchiha genes! Muh hatred! Muh lineage!

>>137457048
Rin died

>>137459931
definitely this. Powercreep rendered most of the cast irrelevant, and if naruto had anything it was a strong cast.

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>>137457048
This faggot appeared

>>137460114
>naruto had anything it was a strong cast.

Disagree, guys like Kiba were super bland and just cardboard stereotypes and 99% of their development is in a simple flash back chapter/episode. It also doesn't help that they are one trick ponies with their fighting abilities.

Fucking MOBA shits have more fighting styles than the Naruto cast.

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>>137457048
Everything

>>137457134

I stopped watching Naruto a long time ago, so at what moment the show become Dragon Ball Z?

>>137457048
Is it any mystery?

>>137460356
The episode when Naruto and neji fought, just like goku v vegeta

We've already agreed that it everything went to shit after the Chuunin exams. Basically Naruto went to shit the minute Kishimoto stopped plagiarizing Hunter x Hunter.

>>137460356
Somewhere between 450-500 is where it went completely off the charts.

>>137457048
Almost everything after the timeskip.

When magic eyes went from granting super sight and hypnotism to summoning uber fire and giant ethereal skele-robots

>>137457048
chapter 2

Naruto should've been about ninjas in training and their wacky shenanigans in school while they slowly become proper ninjas. Instead, it took itself way too seriously and we ended with ninja wars, nuclear strike jutsus, revive the undead, bloodlines and special snowflake abilities being the only thing that matters, etc.

>>137460726
Unfortunately series that pace themselves slowly to develop and not jump the shark usually lose readership. Mx0 is a great example of this.

Pain and the Sage mode Naruto was my favorite part of the series.

Second part. Beginning could be passed off as ok.

Everything turmed irredeemably shit, absolutely irredeemably shit the moment Tobi/Madara gets introduced and the whole Uchiha shtick unfolds.

It really couldn't help itself. The shit Madara was pulling off just kept cranking up in stupidity,

The meteors, holding of the Kage, the Beasts then bam Rabbit God outta fucking no where

Man I really prefer the early Naruto art to everything post Shippuden. It felt so much better with the feel of the manga.

Kishimoto really did just stop trying.

fuck off narutards

90% of the dialogue is utter garbage that relies on the setting rather than the characters and the few times it doesn't the characters come off as assholes and idiots.

>>137457105
>nigger fat chick
>blue haired sasuke/ochimaru hybrid
It's like they want this to flop

>>137460222
maybe if Nardo wasn't such a bitch to Sai in the beginning when comparing him to Sausage, then Sai would have been a nicer guy to him back

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>>137457048
It didn't end when it was clearly supposed to.
Pic related.

>>137460230
>>Disagree, guys like Kiba were super bland and just cardboard stereotypes
Out of all characters you picked Kiba? You could've picked any of the 7 deadly sins.
However, just because they're stereotypes doesn't mean it wasn't a strong-cast. Stereotypes exist in real life and their powers and fights were good pre-timeskip

>>137461933
She's still best girl idc what they say

>>137457105
I dunno. Himawari should have been the new protagonist.

>>137461948
Found another narutard.

>>137457048
Chunin Exam Arc happened

Then chasing a basket through the forest for a year happened

>>137460230
more or less this:
>>137461948

Stereotypes aren't that bad. They're flavor. How you use them makes it interesting. The sasuke retrieval arc, for example, made great use of "bland" stereotypes.

>>137462079
Prove anything I've said wrong.

>>137462060
>Himawari
couldn't get the naming rights I bet

>>137457105
Are the raws available yet?

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>Itachi was a good guy all along
>Pain brings everyone back to life
>Danzou being fucking useless
>Super Mega Sage Walking Fireball mode
>Sasuke being forgiven
>Orochimaru being forgiven
And then of course there's gif related. Probably forgetting a dozen other things

>>137461948
Who did you want me to pick then? I won't say they are all generic, but if we count percentages among named characters, the vast majority of all Naruto characters are cardboard X-men that define themselves with mannerisms and abilities and only slightly change after a flashback and what happens afterwards.

Only main characters like Kakashi get any semblance of real development and one can easily argue that they take way too many chapters to develop that much.

The format in which Naruto develops characters is so formulaic that 99% of people picking their favorites is simply due to that cardboard cut out fitting their own tastes. Almost no one can claim they found a character shit or boring but then after development turned into their favorites.

>>137462099
Why is the Sasuke retrieval arc a good example in your mind? I found it boring as shit and incredibly repetitive, even more so than the Chuunin exam which at least spaced out the flash backs or condensed them and used the mystery of Orochimaru/Sound's involvement to keep things interesting. With the retrieval arc there was none of that, the viewer/reader knew exactly what was going on, nothing to wonder about, and only looked forward to seeing who would win what fight.

>>137462265
>Sasuke being forgiven
I don't get what Sasuke did to Konoha hate him.
The worst he did was kill the man who ordered the murder of his family. Leaving the village is hardly a crime, and he never actually attacked the village, even though he wanted at one point.

>>137460356
honestly it became that as soon as the end of the first arc when Kakashi did the first raikiri/chidori thing. I remember when reading it back then i felt at that moment "here we go, dbz energy attacks"

>>137462517
>who did you want me to pick
>you could've picked the seven deadly sins
It's like you haven't even read what I said nor attempted to debunk it. You just keep repeating what you say.

>>137462616
People still get arrested for conspiracy, anon.

>>137463167
What the flying fuck is even the 7 deadly sins of Naruto? I don't remember this shit and all Google brings up is fan fiction, why don't you give a specific character name instead of being retarded? No one here believes you, nor supports you. The onus is on you.

>>137462616
>I don't get what Sasuke did to Konoha hate him
He's a fucking traitor who sided with the enemy, caused quite a ruckus during the kage summit and regardless of Danzo"s actions, which weren't actually bad and were for the protection of the village, he did assassinate their leader.

>Leaving the village is hardly a crime
You're cited as a missing-nin if you deflect from your duties in your village which Sasuke did, the only reason why he wasn't given a hit on his head was because of Naruto.

>>137463345
Yeah but why the public hate?

>>137463434
>claims naruto's characters are generic tropes
>doesn't even realize the thematics of naruto character personalities
Like I'm confident you haven't seen or read Naruto at all. Can you even name a single character? It's like you just came here with info you've gained from secondaries.

>>137463443
People don't look kindly to traitors especially ones who side with the very person who tried to destroy your home.

>>137457048
It went from "you can do anything if you put your mind to it" to "lol ur god". Sure, it was going to be hard to find a rational fair way to end naruto without all that extra bullshit that happened, but it could've been done.

>>137462265
Deidara was the best girl

>>137463591
he never attacked Konoha directly or attempted to if I'm not mistaken.
He might've thought about doing so, or planned it, but that's a thought-crime

>>137463504
>literally named Kiba
>dodges point about 7 deadly sins and acts like your fan fiction sekret klub matters

Holy shit the amount of backpedaling is next level here. You have nothing to say do you? There's not a single non-main character you can name that doesn't fall under the generic formula I posted and you know it.

That's why you gotta keep dodging like a little bitch and tell people to read imaginary shit to interpret imaginary exposition.

The funny thing is this all stems from you claiming Naruto had a great cast, when you keep moving the goal post one country at a time. You gonna run outta chakra soon if you keep teleporting like that faggot so step up or shut up.

>>137462265
>Sasuke being forgiven
Only by Sakura and Naruto everyone else seems to not give a shit about him really.

>>137459802
>a simple and fun underdog story
It was doomed from the very start when it started promoting that effort and guts could outdo natural talent, when natural talent and SSJ bullshit will win 100% of the time.

Pretty much the only character for which this is not the case is Lee, and Kishimoto hated him.

>>137463694
Who are you quoting?

>>137463662
>he never attacked Konoha directly or attempted to if I'm not mistaken.
True but he did assassinate their leader so that's a indirect strike at the village.

>>137460356
The moment Jiraya did his first rasengan I knew there wouldn't be redeeming the series

>>137463841
Danzo was a good guy 2bh. I really wish he didn't die so soon.

>>137462616
They had no choice Sasuke was to powerfull to be caputered or killed by anyone other then Naruto

>>137463826
You would know if you followed the thread.

>>137463996
Nah, you're quoting something you've made up yourself then responding to it as if it's something someone else's said. It's quite literally the equivalent of talking to yourself

>>137463912
Honestly I liked the moral grey area with Danzo and his "roots" speech was one of the few well written moments in the manga it just feels wasted that Kishi made him fodder for his boy toy.

>>137463662
I don't think you understand how this shit works

when a ninja from your village goes rogue, YOU are responsible. When a rogue from your village attacks another village, that village will send an angry letter to you and in the name of diplomacy you will apologize and tell them that you'll take care of it. This is how relationships between nations work. If your kid breaks a window because he's a twat, you pay the window and apologize

not to mention he killed their temporary Hokage, Danzo, and tried to kill various ninja from Konoha multiple times (Sakura, Naruto, even Kakashi). Villages are a family; you attack one, you attack the whole village

>>137464092
The end will always justify the means.

>>137464057
Nah you're just shit posting because you lost the argument and now samefagging.

I seriously miss old school, first 4 volumes Naruto. I could never even fucking figure out what time they lived in either. One minute they have cars and boats and TVs and guns and the other they're still using kunais and shit

I have to ask

What is the deal with all the Naruto threads lately?

Are people finally getting Nostalgic for the series?
I noticed myself feeling this way for the last week even though it is overall pretty bad.

>>137464310
Looks like I hit the nail on its head

>>137457337
>what the fuck are they doing on the moon?
rescuing hinata's kidnapped little sister since byakugan suddenly became a plot device again because next-gen needed uzumaki/hyuuga hybrids.

> in nardoverse secret sandniggers lived in the moon to guard the original body of the 10-tails or something

>>137464312
>One minute they have cars and boats and TVs and guns
Nani? Boats are old.
>guns
literally nani?

>>137464463
I haven't watched/read it steadily since the chunnin shit, and on/off up to a little after when sasuke leaves and they go after him or whatever.

I kinda want to pick it up again. I want to feel stupid and young

If you notice, in the chunin arc, the implied power of doujutsu versus regular ninja is played up heavily. Naruto is represented as a regular ninja, a ninja not of destiny (in this case familial prowess). This results in an underdog fight against neji and his byakugan. We are meant to root for the underdog except this underdog is actually the destined savior of the world. So much like Aquarion evol is not about breaking destiny naruto follows into the same trap but with characters that are described by the magic they use. Instead the world is populated with people who are special and the only one to top special is to constantly trump each other with more magic. It's why the early parts are pretty good shounen much like a ippo or something like that because the training and learning is pretty good but the fights themselves are restricted by the strict use of magic and not real fighting mechanics, and the feints that the magic allow is what detracts from the story because there is no tension in the fights for the good guys

The final arc.
Everything else was good.

>>137464463
>Lately
they've been here ever since Moot had that autistic fit and turned the whole of /a/ into naruto to prove the threads are welcome here

you could say /a/ was filled with closet-narutos all this time

>>137460463
sage mode wasn't retardedly overpowered, and even then Pain arguably only lost to TnJ anyway.

the stupid powers were the causality rewriting sharingan bullshit starting with Danzo and the 9T super mode that detects bad feelings and gives teleport-grade speed.

>>137464593
eh the types of naruto threads are dramitcally different especially since the show/manga has finially ended. If this was a power level fucking thread i thinki i'd be spamming just to maintain old /a/ standards on this shit, but discussing the literally mistakes and laziness of kishimoto seems pretty safe, considering all the anno bashing threads we currently get

>>137461933
I never got the love of you guys for this Arc. It was boring, depressing will all the fog. That kid and old man backstory were lame and cliche.

>>137457048
The only thing i didn't liked about Naruto was Kaguya. I know Kishimoto planned her for about 30 chapters before the end but it felt rush. Well at least Madara wan't the final villain seriously hated that guy

>>137461873
But it made a ton of fucking money Anon

>>137464683
>he's an anime police on /a/
>he does it for free

>>137464488
Samefag please everyone knows it's you. At least learn to alternate your posts next time retard.

>>137457262>>137457624

Every Shonen its like that stop complaining

>>137464818
I'm not the hero /a/ deserves
I'm the hero /a/ needs

>>137464775
the sad thing is that Kaguya was transparently an ass-pull even though she was conceived of probably 100 chapters before the end due to the movie production timeline constraints.

but looking back it's not like anything of the war arc was really redeemable.
I don't even remember the order of which mode of tree/10T/jinchuriki the final battles occurred in nor when or why Obito backstabbed Madara then inexplicably turned good.

>>137457048
The moment Itachi hospitalized Kakashi and hospitalized him, the series was sent to a hell of power creep, forced drama, and DARKNESS. Naruto and Sasuke's relationship was just pent with forced drama and the grand meaning behind their squabble (what with the clashing bloodlines and all) was stupid.

>>137457048
Kishi fucked up Sasuke's development during the Sannin arc, then it became pogressively worse and worse from there.

>>137465085
*The moment Itachi looked at Kakashi and hospitalized him

>>137465055
Are you serious? for me the War Arc was pretty good, lets be real, what other than a big war can top the Pain Arc? nothing, The War Arc had a lot of hyped moments

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>>137459823
This man is right.

I though about it and all my favorite battles are fought using every ninja tool possible. Most of them involving Sasuke right up until he got the mangekyou (Sasuke-Itachi was actually a fantastic fight).

The only fight that breaks that norm is the absolute best in the series which is Lee-Gaara, where both were specialists who had their own things. But it worked in that case because at that point that was the exception and because they informed both characters. Gaara had his on special thing and didn't use anything else because it was so OP and exclusive to him that he didn't need to use anything, and Lee used the one thing only because he literally couldn't do anything else, it was a disadvantage in his case.

>>137465091
If he hadn't become so edgy then he wouldn't have been consider the most popular character in the Manga and in a lot of other series, for some reason people back in the 2000's loved edgy characters

>>137464872
Doing God's work anon.

>>137465418
how about something that forced ninjas to act like actual ninjas instead of battalions of kung-fu battle mages?

off the top of my head:
> Madara or whoever uses Hiroshima-no-jutsu, elemental nations shrecked overnight
> no safe haven of villages for ninjas, have to hide in the wild or blend into refugee and prison camp populations
> maybe nardo keeps ridiculous sage powers, but he really can't use them since they'll show up to the big-bad like a beacon, and he'd get curb stomped, or his compatriots would at least get murdered
> smaller tactical missions leading toward strategic goal of killing big-bad and restoring world order

there were scattered great moments afterwards, but the last time the longer narrative seemed strong to me was the Forest of Death.

Things I didn't like about naruto :

Naruto actually only has two skills: making clones and using the rasengan.
Later on he learns the sage chakra and kyuubi chakra but that doesn't actually change anything about his skills, it just makes him Goku-level powerful.

I didn't like how Tobi was revealed to be Obito, everyone expected it so it was the most underwhelming reveal ever.

Sakura was annoying and a useless character.

I don't like how over powered they made the Uchiha.
>haha itachi I am stronger than you!
>wait sasuke I actually have this all powerful sharingan skeleton armor that I can summon!
>neat! I'll use that against danzo!
>but wait danzo has an all powerful sharingan technique that can overwrite reality!
>neat let's use that against kabuto!
>actually, let's use this other sharingan technique that will overwrite his personality and make him a good guy or something

How about every fucking person being a hero. You're a hero! Now you're a hero! Were you ever a dick in your life? Well step right up and get redeemed because in this show nobody is at fault for anything!
Maybe the worst/laziest thing they did was make it about selling shit rather than an actual show. Suddenly after the chunin exam any character that has more than 15 fans is untouchable. Yeah sure they'll kill off one character but it takes a whole fucking war to break out for kishi to do it. You can't feel anything for a show that was billed early on as high risk once it become a comic relief fest. In the beginning they talked non stop about how ninjas don't last very long. It was COOL that Kakashi seemed like the last of an era. I'm seriously concerned their will be an overpopulation issue in konoha with all the amounts of ninja that don't get killed being ninja.

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>>137461933
Man,early art for this thing was great. You could even make Sakura attractive with this art style.

>>137457048
Pierroth.

>>137461923

I really, really hated Naruto and Sakura at this point of the story. Shitting on Sai and crying about Sasuke. I dropped it after they found Sauce in that cave or whatever.

>>137463662
Generally, ninja villages or clans don't take too kindly after a runaway/traitor ninja.

This manga was just following that trope.

>>137464816
Boruto hasn't made any money yet as far as I'm concerned

>>137464820
>>137464820
Looks like I hit the nail on its head

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>>137457134
The fuck is with that scarf comment?

>>137462265
>tfw Obito could have became an actor
How many others can go from full retard to edgelord like that?

>>137457048
Sasuke

>>137457105
Naruto when his balls dropped for Hinata

>>137457048
When 774 turned vanilla

A lot of things.

>Powercreep

This is one of the big ones, and something a lot of shonen fall prey to.

>Plotholes

There's some wide enough to drive a bus through. I'm too tired to dig them all up.

>Sauce and the Edge Gang

Really, this became a major issue as soon as the Chunin exam arc hit. Everything after that was tainted. Topping Gaara as a villain was going to be hard no matter what, but there's few ways to more incompetantly drop the ball than Naruto did when it comes to plot focus and coherency. Things from the first half of the series became issues, and entire plotpoints and messages went down the fucking drain as soon as Shipperwhats hit the scene.

>>137457048
Same as any other long-running weekly series, the author was pressured to keep going long after he had run out of fresh ideas.

>>137464714
>I never got the love of you guys for this Arc.
It's not that it's a good arc, its that after the arc there is a paradigm shift and the series isn't the same anymore.
It's not bad, but it's clearly just dragging on.
And then the series took a nosedive after the Chunin Exams.

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>>137457134
>m-muh scarf
holy shit, cringe as fuck

>>137470179
cliche romance scarf bullshit

>>137457134
Damn Hinata's pretty.

Sucks she's got zero depth left.

>>137462616
>I don't get what Sasuke did to Konoha hate him.
DEY RACIS!
SAUCE A GUD BOI
HE DINDU NUFFIN!

>>137463345
>People still get arrested for conspiracy, anon.
Nah they get their entire clans wiped out friend.
Uchihas did nothing wrong besides trusting them SenJEWs.

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>>137475553
You are so right anon, you have no idea

Still don't understand why they called them "hidden" villages.