>>137185549 She did start off as really tsun but that changed rather quickly, by volume 3 that's gone and it progresses further until she's pretty much 100% dere by the end of volume 8, after that the worst are a few snappy remarks. Anime Kirino doesn't count.
>>137185637 Please don't start this bullshit again, classic, modern or the newest I've heard, neo, have no meaning, it only leads to shitposting. Just don't use those terms and instead write a sentence why x is a bad tsundere.
>>137185782 The development. It doesn't really matter how tsun she is at the beginning, what counts is the progression towards being more dere and showing the loved one more and more affection. In this thread for example Kirino starts really tsun but gradually becomes more dere until most of the tsun is gone by the end and Kurisue starts pretty mild and halfway through the story becomes completely dere. There should also be a reason why she behaves so spiteful at first, especially if she's violent.
>>137185872 Absolutely, ten times this. Modern tsunderes can still be good characters, but they rarely are good tsunderes, still struggling to express their feelings with no character development whatsoever. Reminds me of harem anime.
>>137186224 That's just how Kyousuke started, the problem is that the anime butchered about 90% of his character development, he gets pretty based. Him being a doormat is a huge plot point that relates to his backstory. In volume 2 he shows Ayase some incest works and claims it's the most beautiful and natural thing in the world while holding Kirino in his arms, doesn't sound too wimpy to me.
>>137185073 tsunderes with a reason are the good ones thus kirino is a good one. Good tsunderes must have life problems to be good. The ones with no reason what so ever are the shit tsunderes taiga has daddy problems so that also makes her good. tsundere need reason to be tsundere
>>137186676 We stay alive and numerous anon because the things you post keep us here to call out your shitposting and samefagging. thus you power us to stay kirinofags forever as long as your hate for her exists.
>>137187297 Those times are gone, the obnoxious shitposter and tripfags have mostly left. All you're doing is taking the bait and giving them a reason to post another reply. Right now it's either ignore or actually explain why he is wrong to shut him up for good.
>>137187724 Ive read haruhi, oreimo and one other LN that made so little impact I cant remember it at the moment. Oreimo was not a good tsundere in the LN and people saying read the LN are stupid. The change in the character is so small it usually doesnt change a character enough to make him/her likeable.
Asuka is the og tsundere, but not the precursor. Every tsun pretty much comes from how she acted but only in the sense that she's cute, bitchy, and says the opposite of what she feels. Every other aspect of her character was flushed just like every other thing that came from Evangelion.
Asuka is the only good tsundere because every tsundere that came after is wrong, but that doesn't mean oh fuck glorify her right now, it means the character type should die
>>137187849 >Ive read Oreimo >The change in the character is so small Yeah, sure. I've only read this about a hundred times and every single time it was just shitposters shitposting. Saying Kirino is almost the same in the novels as in the anime is utter bullshit. You must have "read" them with your eyes closed.
>>137187920 not him but all the LN does is provide context. I guess it's pretty important though because if someone read Berserk and it jumped straight from black swordsman towards conviction without providing any reaosns for why guts is such a cunt people would hate him more, but he's right in that ln kirino is exactly the same as anime kirino
>>137187920 >is a bitch to kyosuke 90% of the time >calls him aniki at the end of the first novel >this somehow redeems her And this is how the whole first half of the novels is built up. She is a bitch with only a few blushes and kind words she is somehow okay. Sure she is a bit different in the LN but to call her good is a far stretch and I would go as far to say that if you dont like her in the anime at all you wont like her in the LN. Only if you are on the fence or like her already will you like her more in the LN.
>>137188006 >ln kirino is exactly the same as anime kirino Nice try but that is so wrong it hurts. >>137188052 >>is a bitch to kyosuke 90% of the time >>calls him aniki at the end of the first novel >>this somehow redeems her That was the beginning, where she was really tsun. That changes drastically over the course of the series, your "90%" is just a bullshit generalization, same with "whole first half of the novels is built up". Are you one of those retarded speedreaders who read a series in a few hours?
>>137188131 lmao all that happened during that time was that kyousuke and kuroneko felt really bad because they were subhumans compared to kirino and once things "worked out" for kirino all she did was mock kyousuke furthering their feelings of subhumaness without knowing that it was thanks to both neko and kyousuke that things worked out for her if anything, LN kirino deserves to drown even more than anime kirino
>>137188131 >Are you one of those retarded speedreaders who read a series in a few hours? no, I read it quite slowly since I would have to wait for another release afterwards. I read it before I watched the anime
>>137188205 Sorry, was shitposting at /mu/ so the habit carried here for this bit. Anyway, in the LN when Kirino was sick due to her story getting stolen, both Kyosuke and Neko felt terribly inferior to Kirino, and despite that still decided to help fix her problem, and once they fixed her problem Kirino didn't know anything about it and just acted as if nothing happened and kept mocking Kyousuke, essentially adding salt to the wound. That's not really her fault since if she had known that it was thanks to him and her friend that her novel's rights returned to her she would've probably been a little thankful.
Anyway, if my memory serves correctly this was also kind of a "i did it for myself" kind of thing for both kyousuke and neko, it still doesn't mean Kirino shouldn't drown.
>>137187899 No she isnt. She is a deconstruction of the tsundere. She is tsun tsun but instead of becoming dere dere to shinji she just falls apart and turns out to be a sad pile of rubble instead of being a cute girl who cant chose between her love and her superiority complex
>>137188262 Then you are either retarded or a shitposter. I'm sorry but these are the only options left, you're actually saying that LN and anime Kirino are really similar. Volume 3 got completely butchered, same with volume 11 and huge parts of pretty much every single volume besides 1, 5 and 8. There's a reason people think the S2 OVAs with the sibling romance is a bullshit asspull, because the anime shit on Kyousuke's and Kirino's character development.
>>137188288 Yes, Kirino didn't know and she only mocked Kuroneko about not having published anything yet, which is just their regular banter.
>>137185872 No you couldn't be more off. While you're right in there having to be progression on becoming more dere, you're wrong about the tsun part. There needs to be a good balance of tsun and dere. And if Kirino loses her dere towards the end she's not a good example of a tsundere. Yes, as the story progresses you want her tsun side to tone down, but you don't want it completely gone. If she loses her tsun side she's not a fucking tsundere.
Eri is a perfect example. In the beginning shes extremely tsun towards Harima. But as the story progresses she becomes more dere towards him while still having a good amount of tsun to the point where it's not annoying. At the end Eri is still tsun toward Harima, but she's also a lot more dere towards him.
>>137188642 Depends on the definition and once a tsundere has opened up I don't really consider things like snarky comments, ignoring or little tantrums as actual tsun because you know they are together and openly love each other. I guess if you ask 10 people you'll get 10 different answers.
>>137185073 A good tsundere needs to have a valid reason for the way they act, but needs to slowly turn deredere in the end. Kirino is a great example. Off the top of my head, Emi from Devil is a Part-Timer is another.
A bad tsundere is someone who acts like a bitch for no reason at all and just stays abusive all the time. Erina from Shokugeki no Soma is a good example of that.
All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective parties. Images uploaded are the responsibility of the Poster. Comments are owned by the Poster.
This is a 4chan archive - all of the shown content originated from that site. This means that 4Archive shows their content, archived. If you need information for a Poster - contact them.
If a post contains personal/copyrighted/illegal content, then use the post's [Report] link! If a post is not removed within 24h contact me at firstname.lastname@example.org with the post's information.