Soon, we will all have to be streamfags. The only source of shows will be some over-compressed artifacted '1080p' stream from CR or Netflix. What do?
>I hope this pushes anime creators to make more content that doesn’t have to follow the norm in Japan,”
Holy shit, NO. Fuck you. God damnit normalfags ruin everything. How can normalfags even be surprised when mass shootings happen?
Just boycot all the netflix and any streaming hub bullshit around
Thanks to those platforms many fags have dumb ideias about digging graves of shows that have been over years ago and now it's just an excuse to milk the fuck up every single penny
It is too bad for Japan milking with Toei's dead horses and random shows for no reason (FMP3, Saber Marionette J) being dug up when the storylines are finished and there is no more story to continue
With that imagine about a good anime show that has a perfetly tied up finished story and now for the sake of more money and profit they will dig up dead corpses
fuck those tactics for ruining legit good shows
>“I hope this pushes anime creators to make more content that doesn’t have to follow the norm in Japan,”
Dumbass, they don't care about the western money and never will, it's just a bonus and the reason why anime still follow 100% japanese trends, and thanks fuck for that.
That also mean I feel absolutely no obligation to pay for it if they don't care though.
Once again another article with a blatant lie in its headline. Streaming isn't keeping the industry afloat. The industry is still overwhelmingly supported by TV, with movies, merchandising, and even overseas licensing making up the bulk of the remainder. The numbers for 2015 still haven't been summarized but I don't expect streaming to have suddenly increased its revenue by 1000% to overtake everything else.
Even on /a/, you have thousands of faggots who whine about fanservice, haremshit, moeshit, LN adaptations, etc. I imagine these types of people are even louder on other sites. Do you actually want these people to have a real influence on the anime industry? Because that's what's going to happen if overseas profits became high enough for Japan to start caring about international market.
>using "neckbeards" as an insult
Oh look a retard. It was a huge confluence of a couple major distributors going under and the rise of CrunchyRoll to legitimacy. January 2009 is when they acquired the rights to distribute Naruto Shippuden on their site. And it has remained their most popular title for 7 years now.
Not gonna happen in our lifetimes, or probably ever so long as Telecom companies remain as shitty as they are. The bitrate on BD sources is simply too much to fit through a broadband pipe. Not even HD TV channels can handle it.
The limitations in the network are what hold back the quality of streams and TV broadcasts. And fixing those limitations is prohibitively expensive.
Still, there is going to be some drop in quality, however small. HEVC and whatever AOM is cooking up are steps in the right direction, but there's a reason digital versions of movie files as presented at movie theaters are hundreds of gigabytes in size. There will always be purists where the "good enough" that is delivered by streaming services just isn't good enough. Hell, Netflix and its ilk are that "good enough" right now. I personally want better, but I can accept that my viewpoint is different from the vast majority of other media consumers.
Plus I'm a cheap asshole who doesn't want to pay for shit
Yeah, I find myself using /a/ less and less these days, and I've forced myself to stop using other boards before (which believe me, was like chopping off a limb). The main problem is that an alternative hasn't come up yet and I have no idea what it will be, no one does really.
There's no sense in fighting a losing battle.
Yes, obviously. Buying shit helps the industry. If you want to help studios as an ordinary western fan, the hierarchy of purchasing goes like this:
imported Japanese BDs > imported Japanese merch > localized BDs > localized merch > power gap > CR subscription
Most of the money studios make is from TV anime deals, which unless you are a multi millionaire is outside your price range to contribute to.
The average consumer doesn't concerns us then, if something they are probably going to hold back streaming services because they are "good" now in comparison to past experiences for them, thus never meeting our quota to acquire of them if it continues like this.
Naruto is still anime/manga, I don't really care about the show or the manga continuation, but considering it's going to be active for quite awhile and anything WSJ has been popular here, I really find quite amusing that /a/ shunned down the title for some years prior the "ending".
Well you'd be wrong. Studios make more money from BDs than any other secondary source of profit. Because that has the fewest hands in the pot, they mostly just split that with the main distributor. Because home video sales are one of the very few things "reserved" for the studio to make money on. They do get a cut of the character licensing royalties but not much compared to the IP owner. They do get a cut of various merch sales (so long as its stuff based off their anime production) but again they have to split it with too many people to get much out of it.
The reason secondary profit sources are important is because the largest sum of money they get paid gets dumped into production and only manages to cover production if they spread it very thin. If they are banking on high sales they might go over budget on purpose and make the thing at a loss hoping to more than make it back in sales. This doesn't always bear out, and that's when you hear about studios going bankrupt.
Narutards are possibly the worst anime fanbase in existence. They've been terrible for nigh on a decade. It's not a coincidence that /a/ lost its sense of humor and became far more insular not long after narutardism spread all over North America.
If Western Influences means more shows like Stand Alone Complex, WataMote, etc. get made. Ten I'm all up for it. Regardless of what /a/ thinks.
At least SnK fags are keeping it in 1 thread. OPM is /v/ incarnate, though.
Because Naruto and SNK posters are tumblr posters who pretty much only watch that anime. These people actually sneer at One Piece and think it's stupid because of it's goofy art and no boys to ship.
And Oda can actually write a more fun story.
Sorry for not specifying my point, but as a western fan sometimes it's difficult to acquire full BD series than single merchandise from different titles, I'm not saying you make them more (I honestly don't care that much about that, I honestly can't spend that much on Japanese imports in the first place) but instead you end up consuming merchandise more than BD titles from my experience.
To be honest most of my favorite anime had either a kinda western style to some degree or were just untypical like Pingpong and stuff. So it could be nice but nice things barely ever happen so I guess it will just turn into some American action shit or stuff like that. The stream shit annoys me more though, CR's quality is already bad as shit.
anon how do you expect me to get people to stop streaming if i cant back up my reasons
The discs cost more and the studios still get a big enough cut even factoring in the licensing company's share that it's more profitable than the pennies they see from each CR subscription. CR can only make substantial support for the industry through sheer numbers. However, if they personally make enough money this way, they could then turn around and then invest that money into anime production if they wanted. Basically taking the money they kept from the industry for themselves, then joining a funding consortium to pay for anime production.
So far they've shown zero inclination to do this though.
I don't understand why people are so afraid of more streaming content... How does that affect your enjoyment? You all are way overreacting, even if there are a few more western-aimed shows, it isn't going to affect the vast majority of content which is adapted from already existing manga/LNs. And fuck off with the SJW boogeyman, they've barely affected the video game industry even with all the internet activism, anime creators have a huge culture and language gap, nothing will happen. The current business model isn't sustainable in the long term, the industry needs to diversify and tap into other markets like China, the US, and Europe to grow. Now if Universal Studios or MGM or Disney start buying anime producers, then we will be in deep shit.
>written by Roland Kelts
Nice, I'm glad he's still writing about the industry, pic related was a very good read.
>muh hurr Japan Times meme
You actually ever read the thing? (This is rhetorical since this is 4chan.) Do you know who Roland Kelts is? (Also rhetorical.)
Fuck off. (Literal, not rhetorical.)
What the article is pointing out is that anime is part of the larger overall trend to streaming for multiple reasons - reminder that Netflix was originally a DVD distribution subscription service. Because of convenience and the spread of better broadband, people are buying less physical media. The "supporting our company on disc sales" model is archaic and will be as dead as selling VHS tapes in 10 years. Even fans won't buy them because the current generation will be used to getting the content as an on-demand stream.
THAT's your problem with the post?
Hey, come on, at least Japan is not shitting out things like this
you cannot say it's going the way of hollywood
>the industry needs to diversify and tap into other markets
China already has its own animation industry. So does the US and Europe.
The reason anime fits a niche and has a huge fanbase is because it is distinctly Japanese. Japan has tried countless times to produce Western-appealing content in the 2000s and in the early 2010s. They have all ended in failure, because Western fans don't buy into it because it is too similar to cartoons/animation already available in their countries, streaming services don't provide really good money compared to the previous model, and the Japanese model is still the largest producer of profits for the Japanese industry and the Japanese fans HATE it.
>And fuck off with the SJW boogeyman, they've barely affected the video game industry even with all the internet activism
Ignoring the fact that this is wrong, the main problem is that they'll turn every new show into a political issue and try to influence the market economy. Sites like ANN and all those Twitter/Tumblr activists will try to control the decisions of studios by boycotting shows that don't align with their politics, viral marketing for shows that do, Japan will have to listen since now it affects their coverage and bottom line, and you'll have to pick a side. Americans and their culture war shit up everything.
Jesus fucking christ, just buy the cheap over priced merch. If don't speak jap, don't buy BD, buy a $40 Keychain, or pick up the source material. But don't think a studio who bought the rights to dub and reproduce are saving anime. It's dead jim.
>I hope this pushes anime creators to make more content that doesn’t have to follow the norm in Japan,”
So, Japanese people should shy away from making anime that follow their own norm and cater to their own people?
Just how fucking ignorant and self-centered are these "hurrrr anime is ded cuz of moeshit pandering durrr" faggots?
What a fucking retard. Nobody used Netflix for Sidonia because they wanted to. They used it because they HAD to because Netflix bought exclusivity for it.
Using a service for exclusive media doesn't mean I like that service, it just makes me a realist.
>they've barely affected the video game industry
>there will be no official release of Dead or Alive Extreme 3 in NA and EU
>game producers are being forced to explain white male characters in games and female characters are getting more ugly in newer games
It's like 1950s prudes are becoming the ruling class again, stopping the Free Love movement of the 1960/70s.
I'd not like to see creativity killed in the name of Political Correctness, thanks.
>“I hope this pushes anime creators to make more content that doesn’t have to follow the norm in Japan,”
That's pretty fucking racist. Japanese people shouldn't enjoy Japanese things? Disgusting racist.
>there will be no official release of Dead or Alive Extreme 3 in NA and EU
No KoeiTemco are cowards at heart,they did not want to release the game same with Capcom because of mainstream money attention they wanted instead doing things what they wanted to do.
it's not SJW's,it's corporate stupidity 101
Normalfags of the newer generation often believe this anti-piracy bullshit. They think they'll go to jail if they download a Chinese cartoon or they just don't know how to download in the first place.
This is no joke. I barely know people in RL who understand how torrents work.
In three different instances, they intimated that it was because of cultural differences (meaning libtard whining scum that are worse than 1950s puritan Republicans). In one of them, they really said it point blank.
They don't give a fuck that you watch for free the anime "X" they produced.
The thing they care the most is you liking X, advertise X for free by talking about it on the internet, and you buying merchandise of X's characters. And of course, they will expect you to come back and do it again for the season 2. This is what they care about the most.
Sounds like the only 'anime' company being kept afloat by streaming is the one that made Sidonia aka purveyors of 3DCGPD.
Sidonia is good despite its animation style, but I still don't like it.
They deleted it after the controversial outrage.I don't wanna grasps my straws about this but I still believe they will release NA version not EU version somewhat in the future until we fix this whole mess completely with localization.
Someone asked to for an episode once so I linked him the torrent file but he was too fucking stupid to use it. Later I explained that he needs a programm for torrent files but neither did he understand that nor was he able to find any torrent program later. You would think a person just googles when they load a file they can't open but nope.
I guess i am wrong about that. I was more referring to a complete takeover, like when Disney bought Pixar and Lucasfilm and drastically changed those companies' direction
Do you know any Chinese people? Anime/manga is huge there. Date a Live was literally massive. Their domestic industry is very derivative and chinks know the difference. Plus they fucking love gunpla (so do pinoys). I can't find the article but there was one about assclass's production costs being paid for by overseas licensing. As for the US, anime fills a special niche, and it IS popular and continues to grow. Why do cons post bigger and bigger numbers year after year? Why are companies like Funimation and Crunchyroll doing well? Why are Netflix and Hulu aggressively pursuing anime for their streaming services? Why is manga the only section of print publishing that is experiencing growth? Why is Barnes and Noble carrying gunpla in their brick and mortar stores? Why do movies like madoka 3, AoT live action, all naruto movies, kizu, and more get (limited) theatrical releases? Why are so many VNs getting official releases? Why did Toonami come back? Why does Chicago (where I live) have a gunpla group that has build nights every Saturday at different hobby shops that all carry the latest kits, a group called AnimeChicago that has monthly anime and manga discussions, a new store called nakama toys that sells only weeb shit? I could go on, but the answer is that anime is getting bigger here and you bet your ass big companies smell the dollar signs.
I'll admit I don't follow vidya very much, but it seems like mainstream AAA titles haven't changed much, violent edgy games sell. That sucks about DOA. Still not convinced that it will carry over to anime, maybe a bit but video games have a gigantic cultural presence many orders of magnitude higher than anime that anime will never reach.
>I could go on, but the answer is that anime is getting bigger here and you bet your ass big companies smell the dollar signs.
And that's the point. Other markets already have their own things producing things that have Western/Chinese values.
But the main consumer of Japanese anime like Japanese anime because they are JAPANESE anime.
If the Chinese, Americans, Europeans wanted Chinese and Western values on their cartoons, they wouldn't buy Japanese works.
I don't get why using netflix is a bad thing
Saves HD space, and I can watch an episode or two to get a taste of the show.
That being said a lot of the shows are bad.
As for ANN, I wouldn't worry about them becoming the anime version of Kotaku/Polygon. The people who read that site like the same stuff /a/ does and they write glowing reviews for CGDCT and harems all the time. Plus, they are literally the bitch of Funimation/Crunchyroll/Discotech/Viz/Vertical/etc, many of the licensing companies do major advertising through them. They wouldn't do anything to hurt business.
We're on the same page, I don't mean to come off combative but sometimes it feels like people here live in an /a/ bubble and don't pay attention to larger trends in the fandom. International anime fans like it PRECISELY because it is Japanese, I don't think the vast majority of the fandom wants change. Even "manime" people love shounen to death, and shounen is very Japanese. Women love fujo-bait stuff like Free, Haikyuu, and Kuroko no Basket. Every time there is a thread about streaming getting bigger /a/ likes to stay in denial and feel threatened by other people when in reality the users of /a/ are not that much different from anime fans in general, you have a huge variety of tastes here.
>Do you know any Chinese people?
Here's the rub. It's definitely true that overseas markets play a factor in money. That much is true, but the problem isn't so much that it happens, but that the growth of foreign sales is going to change the structure of the industry to eliminate a lot of the Japaneseness that goes into these shows. That the Anime Industry is going to go the way of Hollywood.
There's nothing inherently wrong with there being varied anime content or even varied influences on anime work. But there's a fear in some that foreign sales are going to do the same thing to anime that foreign sales (specifically China and India) did to Hollywood.
If you're not familiar with the problem with Holly wood and foreign sales, it is this: Multinational entertainment corporations seek to maximize profits by appealing to diverse demographics across the WORLD with single releases. A big reason why Transformers movies do so well is because they are so stupid and devoid of meaningful writing that foreign audiences aren't missing anything in translation and giant explosions and VFX wizardry is all that matters to them. Further, studies show that known series perform better than new titles because of familiarity. This means that less and less Hollywood is really bothering to put out new or fresh content in favor of sequels and that these sequels are increasingly catered towards dumbing down for international pallatability. As a result, some national identity is lost.
Now, not all Hollywood movies were good to begin with, and the same goes for anime, but if the market operated the same way, there's a fear of loss of some of that japaneseness and possibly of "generalized" writing. That's not necessarily my own conclusion of what will happen, but I'm very aware of why some people complain.
This is a good thing. We'll see a lot more experimental anime. A lot more of the GOOD STUFF we used to see in the heyday of the 80s and 90s, especially as far as OVAs were concerned. Smaller studios will be able to make what they want, not what fucking moefag Otaku want. We will see less watered down shit that serves as BD ads. The hell is wrong with all of you?
Streaming is the future. Cable is dead
>Plus, they are literally the bitch of Funimation/Crunchyroll/Discotech/Viz/Vertical/etc, many of the licensing companies do major advertising through them. They wouldn't do anything to hurt business.
ANN reviews give plenty of flack on some of those companies' titles, and they still do business with them.
Because you know nothing about the industry that led to the production of OVAs in the first place. Pro-tip: it was the historical version of the domestic (read japanese, not international) BD market that spurred OVA sales. Since it's obvious you don't know what an OVA is they're those animations that were released on VHS and Laserdisk exclusively back in the day, and the production companies relied on sales for it to work.
And another retarded nostalgiafag who probably didn't even live during that era.
> International anime fans like it PRECISELY because it is Japanese
Yet most entry level and popular anime have similarities to Western entertainment, hence why they're easily accessible to casuals. These people are deluded into thinking they like Japanese culture.
>I hope this pushes anime creators to make more content that doesn’t have to follow the norm in Japan
But that's literally the only positive side to this. No more floods of highschool settings, battle harems and generic shonen selfinsert wish fulfillment fantasy shit every single fucking season.
Idolshit-the-nation doesn't like creative premises all that much, Japanese otaku are what's forcing anime as a medium down the moeshit spiral as they're the only demographic with any leverage on the industry.
The only reason why anime is called anime is because there is a distinct difference in themes and style between them and what you'd call a cartoon.
If western influence seriously gets into anime, it won't even be anime anymore. It will just be shitty cartoons.
At least manga is still untouched.
You must be literally retarded.
Even when good anime comes out, it's because Japan has complete freedom of themes and of creative choice.
If Western influence really permeated anime, every season would be a collection of cookie-cutter bottom-tier cartoons like you'd see on nowadays cartoon network.
>people think that having western influence anime we'll have more "manime"
We'd have shit like Adventure Time or Steven Universe.
>there are people on /a/ that probably enjoy that shit
> highschool settings, battle harems and generic shonen selfinsert wish fulfillment fantasy shit
That's exactly the sort of shit that kids in the West like. Hell, self-insert wish fulfillment is what makes Hollywood go round. Have you SEEN the recent Fast and the Furiouses?
I'm glad you had to defend yourself by stating your age rather than, you know, actually addressing the relevant point of you not understanding how entertainment worked back then or now. Because your age has actually nothing to do with it, and it was just a Zinger so that you'd respond by taking the low-hanging fruit instead of actually saying something substantive.
I love these threads because /a/ always seems so relatively well-adjusted(RELATIVELY) up until you bring up the topic of alternative sources of revenue for an industry dependent on a small group of people buying expensive shit.
As far as it goes, all I can see "international influence" doing is basically Japan adapting series that are more palatable to international audiences since that's what Netflix tends to aim for.
Which as far it goes just tends to be action series with adult protagonists(see recent normalfag darling One Punch Man), more of which is hardly the worse thing in the world when every season we have to decide which of a half dozen LNs is adapting the same plot better.
And you can do that for each episode
So instead of having the entire series on your HD, you'll only have a fraction of that at any given time.
You still have HD space
I would have never thought that there are still so many young people watching so much tv.
I stopped around 2002 and most others I knew don't watch more than one or two shows a week.
That's only a problem if you have no internet.
What you're saying is pointless, that's how memory works.
By simply having a website open, you temporarily cached it into you memory.
By streaming a video on netflix, you temporarily cached it into your memory.
By downloading the series, you've put it into your memory as well.
You are arguing a non-issue for anyone who had the internet access to download the series in the first place.
>every season would be a collection of cookie-cutter bottom-tier cartoons
It pretty much is without western influence. I'm not saying the average taste of the western fanbases is gonna improve what's produced. Opening the market to a broader range of tastes is bound to make it more diverse, probably not better, but more diverse.
A lot of people liked Space Dandy.
Yeah, but if Hollywood starts milking anime it's going to be by making shitty, watered down movie adaptations of already established names like the upcoming Ghost in the Shell film or the perpetually stalled out Akira. Same thing with Gojira 2014 (although that wasn't 100% irredeemably, just not great). Those films are easy money for them. You can see the western response to anime in cartoons like Avatar, SU, and Adventure Time where the industry responded by making their own creations rather than trying to work with the Japanese (which is both cheaper and easier). I think the difference between anime being influenced and, say, Hollywood is scope. Anime is not mainstream in the sense that TV dramas are. I'd be really interested to see the view data from Netflix or Hulu though.
It's a reviewer's job to review shows good or bad, but I can't see ANN leading a campaign against a show being localized. Like look at the comment thread for this article about some Tokyo commission looking to see if Yosuga no Sora violates some ordinance, incest defenders jumping out of the woodwork left and right. Hardly a hub of SJWs. http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1059503&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0
Series with the biggest popular exposure/profits (educated guesses)
>various shojo (clamp, etc)
Only ones that are similar to western entertainment is maybe SnK (haven't seen/read it, but it was also massively huge in Japan) and Gundam. Stuff like Bebop and KLK are not as popular among the uber casuals. If anything western companies will target the shounen audience with original material.
Despite the retarded people, normalfags just don't care about for whatever they consume enough. Regarding to anime, they watch just for the sake of doing so and to shit on it, so the feedback coming from them is always "the worst outcome".
Why bother with technishit of something you don't value?
No one reads the ann forums though. Look at how many shit reviewers they have.
>there are people on the internet who legitimately think that 10 YEARS CR subscription gives more money to anime studios than buyfagging something they love
This is the same argument people made when movies started getting bigger budgets, this is the same argument people used when videogames were getting to be mainstream, and again this is the argument you're using to say it's a good thing for anime to go mainstream.
Going mainstream won't do SHIT for variety. What will happen, like it has already happened with any other kind of media to go mainstream, will be a complete death of creativity, where everyone is afraid of doing anything that goes even slightly outside of the lines, where nothing will have any direction, but will try to please all audiences at once, and where nothing will have any substance because it's constantly trying to cater to the lowest common denominator.
"Widening the audience" is NEVER a good thing in NO FIELD WHATSOEVER.
The only reason why a person gets into a hobby is because that hobby caters to their interests. If the hobby is watered down and made to cater to ANYONE BUT THEM, it's ruined.
Were these people named by Tomino?
But here's the thing, anon: one can pay for a CR sub and not look like a degenerate turboweeb. It makes it easy to discretely hide powerlevel. If you've got your own apartment/house/whatever you can't be a buyfag and have guests over at all unless they're also turboweebs (or worse, one of those idiots who proudly proclaims themselves to be an otaku after seeing 2 shows).
Bottom line is there needs to be more ways of supporting the industry that aren't weapons of mass destruction against one's social life.
>book reviewers are pretentious, full of themselves, and write shitty reviews
>movie reviewers are pretentious, full of themselves, and write shitty reviews
>anime reviewers are pretentious, full of themselves, and write shitty reviews
Nothing to see here
That said Masamune Shirowe was kidnapped by lizard people and replaced with a double during the 1995 Kobe earthquake, I didn't check out that show but I wouldn't really expect it to be good.
You're talking like the only kind of merchandise in existence is dakimakuras.
Manga volumes, keychains, booklets, they're all things that have no negative connotations and still support the author.
CR doesn't do anything to support the industry. Nothing.
You might as well just send a letter of thanks to the author. It will make them earn precisely as much money as your CR subscription made them get, with the difference that at least they will feel good about it.
If you really want to support the industry, you can always just donate a bit of money every couple of months to a random anime studio of your choice? You'd probably support the anime industry more by donating one random studio ten bucks than you would by having a year long CR subscription.
But there's still good movies being made outside of Hollywood. And there's still good video games outside of Call of Duty and FIFA. Your hobby not being muh sekrit club anymore doesn't make it inherently shit as a whole.
I'm trying not to be nostalgic or a hipster, but I can't stop feeling like anime used to be better in the 90s and early 00s. None of your arguments are gonna stop me from blaming the ridiculously narrow target audience. Somewhat like inbreeding.
I never use streamings but this is kinda true.
Maybe I would watch them IF they had actual HD quality for once and no unblockable ad shit and are free of course.
Saving series makes little sense for me since I never rewatch anything anyway.
You don't have to display BDs, LNs, manga and tons of other merch. They can sit in wardrobes, book shelves and shit, out of sight.
Or you can not care too much what others will think of you and let them know you like anime but not act like a degenerate turbo weeb.
Fuck, I took most of my travel documents to Japan in a Nate clear file and when the customs guy saw it while doing a bag search he said "ah, bishoujo" and that was it.
Basically, if you aren't an obnoxious faggot you are allowed to enjoy things and people don't really care.
No, fuck you. I want watch shit that caters to Japanese otaku, not fucking normies. If i wanted to watch stuff that's designed for a audiences outside of Japan, I'd just watch shit like cartoon network.
I didn't say Westerners were. I refuted someone else saying that power fantasy shit would be less in anime with Western influences by pointing out that power fantasy shit is status quo in the Hollywood industry, and is precisely what appeals to mainstream Western fandoms.
The point is that if studios become increasingly dependent upon streaming revenue from foreign markets, there will be a bigger incentive to "generalize" most produced content, which is not inherently bad but if it turns out LIKE Hollywood, will be very bad. You may want to reread the post. I'm not equating Hollywood with anime nor indicating a relationship between the two at all. I'm talking about market incentives as they have worked in the past.
Yes, this drives me nuts. Would really like to see a financial high in the industry again so studios would be willing to take risks and and spend more than beer money on art and animation.
>Even on /a/, you have thousands of faggots who whine about fanservice, haremshit, moeshit, LN adaptations, etc.
The fuck are you talking about, it's normalfags that make this trash popular.
The best anime's the stuff that's appealed to a wider audience than a bunch of smelly NEET pedos who wish they were still in high school.
You want to be part of THAT crowd? Pic related.
Supporting CR allows them to expand, promote themselves, and bring in more subscribers, ultimately supporting the industry more than if you privately donate or import BDs. It's inefficient to rely on individuals supporting and promoting how to support on their own, which is of course why the business exists.
You do realize that the creators are often times otaku themselves otherwise they wouldn't become anime/manga writers in the first place. If you mean editors and CEO's then you are right, they hate creators trying to create risky shows.
I'd argue most animators wouldn't be able to work in the conditions they do if they didn't like drawing cute girls and panty shots.
That's hardly a last few years thing ad some would probably argue that things are actually getting better. We've had shit being made before this board even existed.
Firstly, the 90s and the aughts (especially the aughts) were full of garbage anime just like now. They were also part of that same period where merch and home video sales were a studio's main sources of income. That had been going on since the 80s.
Further, in terms of gaming, there exists indie developers, in terms of movies, there exist indie movies and smaller production companies, and in terms of animation there exist indie animations, but those things existing does not change the fact that the major industry producers appeal to audiences to the detriment of the "art." If anything, indie films existing proves that appealing to niches rather than mass appeal leads to greater artistry. Most smaller productions aren't aiming to be for everyone, but rather those who appreciate the genre or the higher brow audience.
But normalfags are the most vocal ones about how otaku stuff is "killing the industry" and "taking away precious space that could be filled with 'good' shows".
Hopefully Japan will never listen to those people. Thanks for being so xenophobic, Nipponland.
I never understood what's wrong with people who turn a simple hobby into an identity anyway.
I mean I watch anime and play tons of games for more than 20 years and I watch a ton of anime each year but I just love it as pure enjoyment during my free time or timekiller - it's fun, there is nothing more to it. No deeper meaning or philosophy or some shit.
Gunbuster, Daicon IV, Otaku no Video, Evangelion, TTGL, Hanamaru, Appleseed are all very much otaku works. Just because it doesn't have a highschool dork with a harem doesn't mean its not otaku shit.
By the way most of you talk, you'd think the only thing that appeals to otaku is highschool harem shit and that for the past decade and a half, only highschool harem shit is the only stuff made. This could not be further from the truth.
Of course CR as a company supports the industry more than a solitary buyfag does, but by directly giving money to companies and/or buyfagging, you as an individual are supporting the industry a lot more than you would if you were giving money to a middleman like CR.
A single subscriber to CR isn't going to allow them to maintain and expand their business any more than a single donation from a gaijin would allow the anime studios to stay in business.
Right, so we should just let normalfags take control of anime remove all otaku pandering, remove all heavy Japanese references and change everything so its either over the top action or bland unoffensive romance.
Just because some people have a hobby they really enjoy and you don't doesn't mean that you should take it away from them. The whole secret club exist to keep people who aren't interested out. Its like football fans inviting their gfs to the bar, all they do is whine and ruin the game because they don't like it and want it to focus on there needs. Why anyone wants people who hate there hobby to have any hand its direction confuses me.
Do you honestly think LN shit is "niche"? It's usually made to get a piece of the pie of an already well selling book. Usually sold well to retard teens (though not always) who are not usually all otaku. It's young adult fiction like twilight and hunger games.
>You may want to reread the post
Sorry, I was multitasking and I completely misinterpreted that. You have a good point that definitely could be a factor when creating original anime. I think it's also important to take into consideration how connected the anime industry is to publishing of LNs and manga. I can't really sale I'm knowledgeable about trends in those industries besides the fact that manga is slowing down due to smartphones/internet/video games/etc. Whereas an original anime is made by a team that can be more easily targeted at western audiences, manga and LNs still are probably going to be making most of their money from domestic sales. Since those are generally created by a single person (with influence of editors) I would think they will maintain their "Japanese-ness" better than original anime, and I doubt publishers will stop promoting their items through anime anytime soon. The other interesting aspect about US influence on the anime market is netflix moving into Japan and saying that they are going to eventually produce original anime content, I'm fairly excited for that given how some of Netflix's original shows have turned out.
Your movie analogy breaks down a bit in a few ways, first because there are probably more good films being made today than at any point in history thanks to digital technology (note that I said good, not great). It really depends on what you are watching. Second, Hollywood has always made bad movies, I'm not sure exactly what decline in cinema you are talking about with budgets getting bigger.
>their best stuff barely touched on that shit.
What planet do you live on, the only one of their best pieces that is true for is Honey Mayonnaise. FLCL I'm on the fence about because it plays on tropes more than directly pulls from and references other anime, minus the daicon bit in brittle bullet, the south park part, the matrix scene... hm... nevermind.
Netflix seem willing to work with studios more at the moment, and are possibly putting some money into the production pot.
Considering they are active in japan now, it's probably a matter of time before they stop being part of a production committee and start full on producing the shows.
Ajin and 7 deadly sins s2 coming to netflix are pretty inevitable.
Yeah because all Western cartoons are 100% unoffensive for faggots and politically correct. Stop believing in the boogeyman. South Park or Rick and Morty wouldn't exist if everything but bland, innocent comedy and romance was forbidden.
You do realize that almost all of western cartoons are either capeshit or comedy right? You also can't tell me that cartoons aren't being heavily controlled by political correctness when every popular cartoon(I don't watch shitty western cartoons) is pandering to the tumblr demographic.
This was the news article about netflix producing anime, the link I have is broken but here is the translated text of it pertaining to anime
>Netflix is proceeding on plans to produce multiple anime works, but the works themselves have not been decided yet. Outside of Japan, in France, NA etc. Japanese anime is exceedingly popular, so it seems Netflix wants to produce large amounts of Japanese anime targeted at the entire world. Alongside series, feature films are also being considered. Everything is being produced in 4K. The movies will be given huge budgets. Everything will be available worldwide on Netflix. Aside from the US, Netflix Japan will be the only original Netflix content producer.
This. People only see the top 20 monthly rankings. Most LNs sell a few thousand, series that are popular here like HakoMari sell only a few hundreds. The top sellers consists of a bunch of LN series like SAO, Overlord other titles everyone here has heard of.
Let's set the fucking record straight, CR does not give money back to individual studios i.e the people who actually need it that we are always going "hurr durr everything is doomed" when we hear how little they make and how hard they work.
CR pays into the publishers, the companies who are already fucking swimming in money and literally the people who push all these stupid battle harem LNs onto the studios because they want to shill some LN's sales. The vast majority of the shows we see are merely licensed for the studio to make and they don't get money out of it. This fits along with the general scheme of how TV anime is in Japan, that is, studios don't get ad revenue and in fact pay the broadcasters to air the shows (this partially plays into why so many air late night.. cheapest slots and they know people will stay up to watch it or record it anyway).
People going "hurr I'm supporting the industry with my crunchyshit account" are naive morons. Want to support a studio? Buy BDs. Want to support the fucking oligarchs who keep greenlighting the shit most of us find mediocre fap bait at best and usually just an utter waste of time/talent otherwise? Go with CR. In pirating, at least you are not giving Kadokawa a fucking dime and that's just fine by me.
>anime drawn in 4K
that actually sounds glorious. maybe we'll get back to film-level detail in anime. either way it has to be better than the majority of shows that are produced somewhere at somewhere between 720p and 860p right now.
This post is criminally underrated and /v/ is deluding themselves if they think they'd get shows from the 90s that they like (which were already a minority even at the height of their popularity) rather than /co/ 2.0.
I'd agree that more good movies are being made, but not necessarily more than ever, and they aren't the major releases coming out of major studios. If it comes out of a major studio its probably from a smaller subsidiary or its a secondary type release. Movies that have high VFX budgets are not necessarily good movies. The Lost World (1925) is an impressive film for its VFX but it is not a good movie, similarly movies like Wrath of the Titans have massive VFX budgets but are still garbage. If anything, the only possible renaissance taking place in modern filmmaking is with increasingly inexpensive digital equipment, much like the renaissance from the advent of portable 8 and 16 mm film cameras. Tangerine at Sundance was produced on an iphone. But these things happen DESPITE the power of mainstream appeal. They exist to appeal to niches.
Does every LN get an adaptation? No? Then where's your argument? I wasn't saying all LNs aren't niche, I was saying LNs in general do not necessitate otaku pandering. It's all money and publishers and studios try to follow it.
Aniplex gets some of it but because the BD itself is explicitly the studio's work they get to keep more of it than they get from anything else.
If you buy figures, dakis or other random merchandise from a franchise, unless the studio owns the license because it's original (such as Shaft with Madoka), the studios usually get either a tiny cut or basically none of the revenue from all that other tangential merch. They get the most by far from BDs.
Furthermore the way it goes with licensing is that the license holder/publisher approaches the studio and bids for them to take a job to adapt ______. Studios usually get paid a sum up-front to do it although that basically is meant just to cover production costs rather than be an actual pay-out, hence, they rely on the BDs on top of that to keep things afloat. This is how some studios can just keep putting out failure after failure and yet still be alive after all this time; if it's not their license they already got something just to make it in the first place.
Fucking pachinko is the real cancer on the industry.
It does make money, but it produces jack shit that we can enjoy and is just legalized anime-themed gambling for nips. It's so very sleazy for them to have to stoop to using those machines. Haruhi going on pachinko is how we know the series was officially dead.
>>Even on /a/, you have thousands of faggots who whine about fanservice, haremshit, moeshit, LN adaptations, etc.
>The fuck are you talking about, it's normalfags that make this trash popular.
>>Normalfags don't watch niche anime. Otaku do.
>>Do you honestly think LN shit is "niche"?
>>Yes. Light novels are still fucking niche.
One anon talks about trash like moeshit, haremshit, fanservice and light novel adaptions, another anon replies that normalfags don't watch niche anime, another anon asks if light novels are niche, and the other anon replies that they are.
Right, which is entirely my point because I'm refuting the idea that only otaku read LN garbage. There are way more shit LNs than get adaptations, and the ones that do are generally (not always) ones that are following the smell of money because the LN is either being advertised or has already sold well enough. Certain LNs may be niche, but LNs as a group are not. Not all young adult fiction catches on, but some does.
Again, if everything panders tumblr explain stuff like Archer and similar series. Also, the typical "tumblr series" like Steven Universe aren't like that because some jewish agenda urged them to do that cartoon, it was just the free will of the creators who enjoy working on their cartoon. Other people do different cartoons, depending on whom they are in real life. And further, KlK was one of the most popular cartoons/anime on tumblr in years and that series showed titts and asses in the viewers face from beginning till the end.
The Western world doesn't consists of retards like Anita.
This posts only partially right. Even hollywood goes through periods of relative free wheeling.
The other things to go mainstream like video games just haven't had the events that have driven swings back toward creative freedom that more mature mediums have gone through.
But this posts fundamentally right about one thing, widening the audience doesn't really lead to more diverse offerings, rather it changes what's in vogue.
You are right about major studios. I was referring to films from smaller studios or indie. It's hard for me to have perspective on it though, I'm in my twenties so I don't have a balanced look at what was coming out in the mid 90s, I pick movies that interest me so I can't really judge the major productions like I can today.
Thanks for clarifying that.
Nothing? cuz we aren't normie-faggots who scream and cry like bitches when everyone does it?
No one fucking said the Japanese references were going to go away. You need to learn some reading comprehension. The main point of the article was to get rid of the way the Japanese PRODUCE anime. The bureaucratic, rigid committee system. THAT'S what they're saying is going away with the age of streaming.
Why exactly is everyone sperging out about this ITT?
Am I missing something?
Most normies already stream all their anime.
But that doesn't mean that we're losing our high quality BD rip torrents.
Of course they're still going to continue to release blu-rays of their shit, it's easy money.
I have no idea what everyone is so up in arms about, this changes absolutely nothing.
Otaku money can't save the industry forever.
Besides generic battle shonen tripe is better than letting things like Sky Wizards Academy, Asterisk, Isuca, Denpa Kyoushi, etc run free
Because they're more relevant than you and the anime industry wants their money.
This applies to both nip normalfags and gaijin normalfags.
nip otaku > nip normalfags > gaijin normalfags > trash > shit > /r9k/ > gaijin otaku.
>People who don't give a shit about the industry are more important than people who already spend time on money on the industry.
>Lets pander to people who don't have an interest in buying our shit instead of the already dedicated fanbase.
Great idea man. Proud of you right now.
The version being sold in continental Asia has an English translation.
This is true of most games, for the same reason that Animax Asia does their own English dubs of questionable quality.
Once again /a/ posters are stupid as dirt.
There's a distinct difference between 'Japan will keep making anime' and 'I'll get to see it'
This is something I've been arguing on /a/ for years and you dumb fucks still don't understand. I've been an anime fan since the 1980s. I lived through the days when the only access we had to anime was US television and later video stores.
I know a truth you guys just can't get through your fucking skulls no matter how often I repeat it.
"Fansub groups cannot support the industry alone"
There are countless examples of shows from the 90s and 2000s in the early days of the internet in the days before CR took over a chunk of the market where shows were picked up and dropped just as quickly never to see the light of day again because someone got bored. You're living in fairy land if you think we can rely only on unpaid translators. I've lived through those days and I know we can't. You won't fool me with more of your bullshit. So someone has to support the localizers or we're all screwed.
Next. Importing Japanese BDs and merchandise may let you feel good about yourself and your love for anime but unless you buy BDs and merchandise from EVERY FUCKING SHOW YOU EVER SAW, you're going to have to admit that the greatest bulk of anime you never pay for. Sifting through the shows to find the gems you'll remember a lifetime still means you're forced to sift through it and god knows you guys only buy merchandise for the rare show that grabs you leaving the greater bulk of what you watch unpaid for.
This is all fine and good if somehow studios know the 2% that'll find you amazed but they don't. All the wishing 'why don't studios only focus on the good shows I like and stop making crap' sounds good but again that's living in fairy land. A few bucks from CR sounds a whole hell of a lot better to them than 0 and those 800,000 subscriptions add up.
So pirating is fine, just know it has consequences.
The near entirety of the fandom has been piracy until like two years ago.
I also remember the 90s. Out of six bookshelves worth of tapes at the rental shop probably two shelves worth of content were legit and that's overinflating it because of the mainstream long running crap like dragonball or inuyasha eating up whole rows for the licensed releases.
If you wanted anything mildly out of the mainstream it was fansubs or nothing (or a few weirdo companies that did ova's in the 80s and promptly died). The vast majority of the "industry" was fansubs and this was only more true in the internet era. We did just fine, certainly better than mangafags who truly suffered capricious treatment.
Yeah the plummeting DVD sales for things that aren't Love Live, U.C Gundam, Monogatari or whatever is pretty evident to anyone. It doesn't look like the production committees are disintegrating but definitely facing new challenges. Daisuki that partnership with the big producers like Bandai, Aniplex, Sunrise and Toei is an attempt to provide direct international streaming, but it's content is as hit or miss as anime in general itself so it's seeing a very slow build up. They also literally bought MAL.
Bandai isn't dead, there's just no de facto Western branch now, it's all handled internationally using that same shitty "import" method Aniplex and Pony Canyon use where they charge up the ass for everything.
There's something you don't seem to understand. Most fans, let's use this word, prefer to see their interest detrimented before watching it ruined forever by some things, like a greater public.
The one thing the article for sure gets wrong is that the production committee system isn't even that byzantine anymore. The generally rule is everything goes back to Aniplex and/or Bandai the closer you get to the top of the chain.
DeNA and ACJ Daisuki acquired MAL some time near the end of 2015. You haven't noticed it suddenly has Daisuki embeds and a bunch of "news articles" that look more like ads kind of like ANN?
Variety? Fuck that I'm on /a/ and I'm going to be a shitposter, that stuff needs to fuck off to reddit.
But seriously if it happens it can only be about fucking time, even Japan kind of seems to be getting sick of the same old stable of LN titles aside from the most popular of the popular now. When was the last time there was a brand new smash hit LN/anime anyway?
This is so stupid and such a terrible business model if they're seriously trying to make anime even a remotely international thing. It's the price gouging BD model that has basically turned anime into this niche thing for otaku these days anyway cause they're the only ones gullible enough to actually think paying those prices for that kind of content is a good idea. Other shows not aimed at otaku bomb on BD because the people they are aimed at likely know better and just PVR it or catch the HD streams.
There are only two kind of anime. Anime that are supposed to make money with BD sales and anime that are supposed to make money with merchandising. There are no other kind of anime.
I know Japan has a tendency to lag behind the times of virtually every other industrialized country when it comes to their media by as much as a decade but I'm still surprised it's taking them this long, especially as it's evident overall disc sales have cratered in the last couple years. 2015 was especially bad, it wasn't even that long ago where you could expect to have multiple shows do over 10K in a given season with the top shows clearly the 30K mark reasonably often. Now it's considered an amazing feat if even the first volume of something clears the 10K mark without an event ticket or a major tie-in to some legacy otaku franchise like Fate or U.C Gundam. Like it was a big fucking deal when Shirobako managed it a couple years back. Also Love Live doesn't count cause that's backed by idol fans and main streamers and is a major anomaly. I give it till the end of this year before we start to see some major changes, 2016 has been the year a lot of industry insiders have been pointing to as the year the production committee system of yore finally collapses in it's current form, but I think it'll be a soft collapse forcing change in the business model if anything.
>there is no good reason to stream
You can watch videos instantly via streaming, something that isn't always doable with torrents. I have a script to download my torrent packets sequentially, and even then more likely than not the video stutters 5 seconds in. I also stream to "check out" series that I'm not sure if I like it or not because it's easier, I only download the ones I like.
Sunrise Studio 8 fans?
No, it's not. It's just scapegoating otaku for the industry's ills, since apparently Japan doesn't treat them badly enough as it is. There are some people out there who are very outraged at the thought of otaku being happy and having an escape from this shit world, and just want to tear that down out of spite.
K-on was the poster child for boring SoL moeshit... and a colossal hit with Japan's normalfag community. I want interesting, unique, and innovative anime too - but I know if it's any good it'll be the otaku who flock to it.
Nearly 90% of the time you are making the copyright holder of the show money. Not the studio, unless the studio IS the copyright holder, which is super rare.
For instance: If you bought K-on, TBS got that money. If you wanted to license K-on, you had to send your lawyer to TBS. Kyoani got paid by TBS to adapt it for them.
This is why Sunrise/Bandai Namco Pictures is so comically rich and has like 12 divisions. Right now they pretty much seem to be subsisting off of revenue and royalties from Love Live and Gundam deals.
>Trying to get new fans is bad, let's just keep catering to the same people until they stop buying shit and/or die off then our industry is fucked. No new fans, demographics or ideas ever!
Sounds like a winning model to me.
Yeah I remember those days too. I also remember not having people buy R2's and then be pretentious twats about it on the internet like it makes them extra fucking special flowers or something.
>implying they will
Otaku are loyal as fuck, and new fans become fans because they like the material - i.e. they have similar taste.
Hence the web's biggest english-speaking anime forum being horrified at the thought of anime pandering to western audiences.
>This is why Sunrise/Bandai Namco Pictures is so comically rich and has like 12 divisions.
If they have so much money why did Cross Ange have horrendous production values? And where is Horizon S3?
That article was written by a moron who does not understand how the industry works, and doesn't even understand that in an interview, most Japanese would say what the interviewer wants to hear. Streaming is NOT keeping the anime alive. Maybe just the the US.
I don't think it's currently there but I can see the amount of money from legal western streaming becoming a major part of the cash flow.
If 1 million people subscribe to Crunchyroll(it's nearly at that number) that works out to about 60 million dollars a year. Obviously there's massive overheads that'll brutalise that fairly quickly but the thing with such streaming services is they're global which gives them a massive pool of people to subscribe so if it continues to grow (and it will continue to grow, even if it's not CR another service will take its place at this point, It's not 2011 anymore) that's just more cash on the table.
It's not going to, overnight, reduce the reliance on merch to make money but it does provide a safety net. Anime is produced and can be paid for without shifting bricks because it gets paid anyway.
You can talk about 'muh traditional means of support' and 'muh streaming makes no money' but there's a fairly large global market for Anime and it's becoming clearer by the day that isn't going to be ignored by the Japanese, there's only so long you can milk otaku before realising it's significantly easier to just have a critical mass of people worldwide paying a fiver a month.
It would therefore be in the interests of the studios and the streaming providers to have content made that grows the subscriber base so that everyone gets more money which I believe CR have announced they're actually doing.
So CR information known so far.
Long time ago CR fuck the anime subbing community and goes Full Jew.
Feb, 2008 $4.05M / Series A
May 27, 2008 $ 7.8M "with of that 1.75M Convertible security" D form
Mar, 2010 $750k / Venture
2013 $100M by Chernin Group
Jun. 2014 Unknown Acquisition/ Asset Sale
Jan 13, 2015 $28,749,421 / Venture
Aug. 2015 Unknown Acquisition
Nov, 2015 $22M / Venture D form
$500M Last Round in 2014 "Dont know what this implies"
Who the fuck are these guys.
Anime isn't going to be some big thing in the states again. Sure there's a market, but unless you're some delusional toonami autist who is fixated on how cool it is to be able to watch shows that aired years ago on TV then you probably know that it's top foreign to truly permeate and that productions intended solely for us don't work.
>I'll admit I don't follow vidya very much, but it seems like mainstream AAA titles haven't changed much
It's already started to change and it will keep going down that route, even the violent games have gotten more politically correct. See: Halo 5, Assassin's Creed: Syndicate, Dragon Age: Inquisition, etc. as recent examples. In the indie market it's even worse, just like what happened to film. They've also managed to affect Japanese releases..
>maybe a bit but video games have a gigantic cultural presence many orders of magnitude higher than anime that anime will never reach.
If anything, niche media is even easier to subvert since the fact that it's smaller and niche makes it easier for vocal minorities to have a significant proportional impact on the market and community. Comic books have it really bad for that reason. It's almost a dead medium, and because of that it's been almost completely hijacked by that vocal minority.
Anime/manga are also attractive because it would allow them to impose their Western values on other countries. If they can manage to get the Japanese to change how they create media down to development, they think it will allow them to affect social change even in Japan, which they think is a country that sorely needs it.
>As for ANN, I wouldn't worry about them becoming the anime version of Kotaku/Polygon
Last I heard, it had gotten almost as bad. These sites also always get worse when they start realizing they can significantly change the market too.