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So, to recap...
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So, to recap...

Enuma Elish destroys worlds

Excalibur is equal to Enuma Elish

Solomon's Ars Almadel Salomonis is billions of times more powerful than Excalibur and Solomon himself transcends spacetime and has the power to destroy history itself

Solomon is one of seven grand servants, and being the grand caster is probably the weakest or second weakest

Together, the seven grand servants are strong enough to stand up to... Arcueid's sister's pet dog

Wait what?
>>
>Excalibur is equal to Enuma Elish

I don't know about that.
>>
>>>/fgog/
>>
>>135926329
>Excalibur is equal to Enuma Elish
Since when?
>>
>>135926329
Enuma Elish is like a step above Excalibur.
But Solomon is probably the strongest nuke wise since he's caster.
>>
>>135926329
>Excalibur is equal to Enuma Elish
>>
>>135926329
I thought it was seven counter guardians that are needed to control Primate Murder (which has a type advantage thanks to being conceptually empowered to kill any human), not Grand Servants?
>>
>>135926329
>Solomon is one of seven grand servants, and being the grand caster is probably the weakest or second weakest
Not if musasho mijamoto is the grand saber.
Or holmes the grand assasin
Houyi is probably grand archer.
>>
>>135926329
Excalibur is higher than Ea.
>>
>>135928020
Grand Saber is Arturia. It's all but confirmed.
>>
How does it compare to CCC?
>>
>>135928448
Nope.
>>
>>135928470
All we've gotten is that it's voiced by Kawasumi, lots of VAs voice multiple characters in tihs.

Solomon indicated that the grand servants are probably unique ones that could never be summoned as regular servants, because they're too powerful.
>>
How much damage can a billion Excalibur lasers do to the Earth?
>>
>>135929276
>that it's voiced by Kawasumi
Please don´t tell me musashi is not a saber clone.
>>
>>135929276
But really, what are the odds it will not be a version of Arturia from Avalon? I'd say pretty slim.
>>
>>135929216
Yes. In FSN, Ea is only slightly better in output, but Excalibur has a seal bullshit, when it was forged by Gaia as its finest weapon to deal with planetary threats.

Excalibur is indeed better than Ea.
>>
>>135929276
>Solomon indicated that the grand servants are probably unique ones that could never be summoned as regular servants, because they're too powerful.

And you can't summon Arturia unless she strikes a deal with Alaya to be summoned.

Takeuchi art. Kawasumi VA. Do you even think there's somebody more famous than King Arthur to be Grand Saber? Arturia's already the best Lancer and Rider in the game too gameplay wise, as a fucking 4*.
>>
>>135929276
>Solomon indicated that the grand servants are probably unique ones that could never be summoned as regular servants, because they're too powerful.
Yeah, like full power Arturia.
>>
>>135929862
>when it was forged by Gaia as its finest weapon to deal with planetary threats.
Atilla the Hun's sword is still stronger though because it was forged by Mars and she's Type: Mars
>>
>>135929324
Planetery explosion
>>
>>135929904
but shes not best lancer or rider, even in that game. Lancer and rider wise, shes having an okayish np (lancer) and a good np (rider) while her buffs and stats arent that strong, being a weaker version of her saber alter (saber). They cant compete with karna on aoe/mass damage, or scathach on single/boss mobs on lancers as well as drake as way better in atats, crits, star generation and has an equal to better np, while mary and anne are way better on crit amd single hit. Shes good, but not a best in these classes. Shes the strongest saber thozght, but only okita as a saberface, not arthur, who only is good
>>
Isn't Arthur with Avalon and her Dragon Core obviously going to be Grand Saber?
>>
>>135929862
>but Excalibur has a seal bullshit, when it was forged by Gaia as its finest weapon to deal with planetary threats
But I thought Gaia/planet hate humans.Why would she create/give such weapons to them?.Heck she even created primate murder and even called the Types to cleanse the planet of humans.
>>
>>135930552
>implying aliens will not attack Earth
>>
>>135930661
Humans are more of a threat to her than alien though...
>>
>>135926329
>Excalibur is equal to Enuma Elish
Where did you hear this bullshit.
Source or GTFO
>Together, the seven grand servants are strong enough to stand up to... Arcueid's sister's pet dog

Correction. Grand servants playing with the apostles would be like a chiuaua slightly entertaining a pitbull enough to keep it's attention.
>>
>>135929862
Gil wasn't using EA at 100% in FSN
Also,Excalibur can't do this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eJM-ppLPTs
>>
>excalibur A++ NP
>enuma elish EX NP
You wot m8
>>
>>135930923
NP ranks are hardly relevant.
Ranks are only good indicators for other servant stats
>>
>Seriously thinking that Escalibur = EA.
Fuck off Seibafag.
>>
>>135926329
There's absolutely no mention of Primate Murder
>>
>>135931125
I mean, status screen did say that Ea damage is comparable to that of Excalibur. It higher, of course, but they are still on the same level. I'd argue that full Rho Aias could've equalize them.
>>
>>135926329
http://fategrandorder.wikia.com/wiki/Solomon
Shit stats. He can be speed blitzed
>>
>>135930447
Her NP as Lancer is the fucking Lance of Longinus that will DESTROY reality as we know it.
>>
>>135930329
Doubt it.
>>
>>135930433
Nah not even close. It's only an anti-humanity NP.
>>
>>135930552
Arturia's family is connected to Gaia and the land of Britain. Arturia herself is a dragon too, and maybe fae. Her sister turned into a full faery and her uncle became a dragon.

They lived in an age there was still balance between nature and humans, it only got to shit after Arturia's death. Her kingdom was an utopia where humans and magical beings lived sided by sided in a rather harmonious way.
>>
>>135930756
>Correction. Grand servants playing with the apostles would be like a chiuaua slightly entertaining a pitbull enough to keep it's attention

ORT and PM are stated by Nasu to be on a league of their own when compared to Servants. And he stated the fuyuki Grail Servants are based on the real system which is the one required to fight threats to humanity (i.e Primate Murder).
>>
>>135930756
Are you a secondary? Nasu stated Ea (in FSN) is Excalibur equal, if only with a "slightly" superior output.

This was before he wanked Excalibur into being Gaia's finest weapon that deals with threats against the planet in its final form.

In prototype, EXcalibur would BTFO Ea. It BTFO easily Enki which is far more powerful in its full powermode (it can effectively WIPED OUT ALL LIFE ON EARTH - once it charges of course).
>>
>>135931645
>He can be speed blitzed

Anon, he as Clairvoyance EX (he can see the future) and he can resurrect himself. Also he can drain all magic and make your Servant go bye bye.
>>
>>135926329
>Together, the seven grand servants are strong enough to stand up to... Arcueid's sister's pet dog
>
>Wait what?
Tsukihime wankers everyone.
>>
>>135931973
Ssh, don't upset them. It's still sad that Nasu no longer gives a fuck about a dead franchise. ;_;
>>
>>135931164
Yeah but he said that 7 grand servants are needed to fight "deterring force of the planet" that has an "absolute power to kill mankind". Nasu also mention somthing like that about PM, he could just change CG to grand servants now. So not confirmed but very possible
>>
>>135926329
I still don't understand how Fate/Stay Night can generate so much shit side content.

What the hell is it this time? Another mediocre PSP game?
>>
>>135932337
>not knowing Grand Order
You weren't around for the UBW livewatches?
>>
>>135932337
Worse. "Free" mobile game with garbage gameplay
>>
>>135932179
A deterring force to the planet is humanity and PM is there to deal with it. CG are there to deal with him to protect humanity. Grand Servants' role is something more like that of Type's.
>>135932380
The Japanese don't advertise their mobile games as free, that's a Western thing. The only mobile thing on TM's part that's advertised as free is the Fate route for mobile. Which it is.
>>
>>135931871
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eJM-ppLPTs
>>
>>135926329
>This pasta again
>>
>>135930756
>Correction. Grand servants playing with the apostles would be like a chiuaua slightly entertaining a pitbull enough to keep it's attention.

>>Andersen: The summoning of Heroic Spirits is the summoning of the Counter Force, and the Counter Force is what ensures that mankind continues. They appear in seven vessels to strike down a single foe. Who is this foe you ask? Could it be more obvious? A disaster that threatens our world, humanity’s world! An avatar of the end that will destroy not the planet but humanity, destroy the civilization that we have built! Born from civilization but a devourer of civilization, it’s none other than an apotheosis of our own doing. And summoned to defeat it are those who stand at the pinnacle of all Heroic Spirits.

>Solomon: Yes, the seven Heroic Spirits are heavenly emissaries sent to destroy a certain evil. The seven greatest knights of that era who protect the foundations of humanity. The original seven at the pinnacle of heroic spirits. The invocation ritual of Heroic Spirit summoning was originally magic used in a decisive battle to save the world of humanity. The thing that depreciated it so it could be used at human convenience is your summoning system, the Holy Grail War.

>Mordred: You’re telling me we’re second fiddles to you!?

>Andersen: Don’t let him goad you, Mordred. It’s not a matter of rank. It’s the vessel, the authority that he’s given. He’s nothing more than a Heroic Spirit in a greater vessel than ours. If we’re weapons used against individuals, he’s a weapon used against the world. He’s at the peak of Heroic Spirits having the same attribute. In other words, he’s a Servant with a Grand vessel.

>Solomon: Yes, I must commend you for arriving at the truth! I am indeed the king of kings, the Caster of Caster! Thus I grant you the right to hail me as Grand Caster, Solomon the King of Magic!
>>
>>135932419
It was said the Grand Servants are required to fight an enemy that would threaten not the planet, but mankind. And what do you think is the greatest threat against mankind? Primate Murder, even ORT comes not second, but third.

Dark Six is even more threatening to mankind than ORT.
>>
>>135932692
>Q: About the power comparison between Arc and Servants, would the Arc being compared be the 30% one or the full one?
>A: That would be the 30% Arc. It takes 7 Counter Guardians to control the Primate Murder and the Servants of the Grail War are based on these.
>>
>>135932725
Angry Manjew says the Dog and the Spider are above him when it comes to the ability of killing humans.

ORT is the spider.
>>
>>135929276
>It's a Saber
>Voiced by Kawasumi
>She never voices actual clones
Who the fuck else do you think it would be?
>>
>>135932692
>Born from civilization but a devourer of civilization, it’s none other than an apotheosis of our own doing
>Yes, the seven Heroic Spirits are heavenly emissaries sent to destroy a certain evil.

Seems like this would refer to multi-Avenger. Of course, PM > Avenger by Avenger's own admission. So it could apply to PM as well.
>>
>>135932379
I played the game, UBW was the second route.
Why would I watch some anime adaptation of it?
>>
>>135932725
>>135932757
>>135932726
Nobody cares.
>>
>>135932692
>destroy the civilization that we have built! Born from civilization but a devourer of civilization
This sounds more like Attila.
>>
>>135932832
Sounds like Grand Avenger
>>
>>135932827
you cared enough to reply shitposter-kun :^)
>>
>>135926329
Ea=>the output of Excalibur, as in the beam.
The actual amount of energy and the destruction it causes far surpass it. Now assuming ARS can shoot as a focused beam, it should be able to overpower Ea's beam. But as with super Excalibur, we now know that living Gil's Ea > Servant Gil's Ea, so expect that to get a boost as well.
>>
>>135932935
>Solomon
>In terms of scale, it is hundreds of millions of times greater than King Arthur's holy sword. Quite simply, it is an anti-Humanity Noble Phantasm.

He's like F/SN Gil but even worse
>>
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>type moon power levels

Remember how, excluding buffs from the grail, a servant can never be as strong as the hero it's based on?
>>
>>135932935
Ea is a city buster at best.

Gilfags posting their fanfiction as usual.
>>
>>135933006
His character is shit so far, yes.
>>
>>135933101
Ea is the tool used to render the old world into the current world. That's what it does. Defrags the world and reformats it.
>>
>>135933017
>Remember how, excluding buffs from the grail, a servant can never be as strong as the hero it's based on?
Nope, source?
>>
>>135933101

>>135932478
>>
>>135933017
Avenger is stronger than he was in life.
Still shit but it's something
>>
>>135933147
なお、この補正とは「英雄としての元の強さを再現出来る」と言う意味である。マスターからの魔力供給・令呪によるブースト・聖杯から与えられる知識とクラススキル、各自の伝承によって後天的に付加される固有スキルを除けば、知名度の補正によって英霊が元となった英雄より強くなる事はない。
>>
>>135933101
Saberfags truly are delusional.
>>
>>135933200
Yeah and that is still a city buster at best and your link only proves it because Gaia instantly reformed itself when Gil used Ea at full power in F/HA.

And what is funny is that the Moon Cell reformed even faster than Gaia.
>>
>>135933245
Says the underaged Gilfag who never played F/HA and just watches youtube videos of a game he never played himself.
>>
>>135932832
It's going to be Altera

1) Gods fear her.
2) Everyone wanks her.
3) They refuse to make a NP interlude even if she needs it.
4) She's shrouded in mystery.
5) Sakurai wrote Prototype Fragments and there is an account of a male Attila there. Who is she?

Solomon is obviously pretending to make MC and Mashu power up to stop Attila.
>>
>>135933271
Mooncell > Gaia.
>>
>>135933302
Attila is only a tool.
The true Mastermind is Kriemhild
>>
>>135933271
Notice how he doesn't rip the world in hollow?
>>
>>135933141
Yet there is no evidence normal Servant Gil can do this.
>>
>>135933101
>"The Sword That Cut the World Apart"
>Only city buster
>>
>>135932935
http://forums.nrvnqsr.com/showthread.php/6031-Fate-Grand-Order-Story-and-Lore?p=2212337&viewfull=1#post2212337
>>
>>135933377
That's exactly what he does in Zero, and exactly what he starts to do in strange fake before Enkidu's EE counters his EE.
>>
>>135933416
>Gilfags still think Ea is antiplanet

As expected of newfags.

Guess what Excalibur is the sword of promised victory but Saber doesn't win all her battles.

The fact you even take the nickname of a NP seriously just makes you even more of pathetic joke.
>>
Doesn't Arjuna have a weapon that can destroy the Universe? How does Nasu handle this in Fate?
>>
>>135933101
When Gil use Ea against Enkidu in F/SF, the World itself is sucked into the Void created by the sword
>>
>>135933345
Arc > Moon Cell.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wl8U-_IlLdw
>>
>>135933377
Which is why the original guy in the reply chain said that real life Gil(who we'll likely see in the Babylon stage) is probably stronger than Servant Gil.

Just like how Saber doesn't has have Avalon or her Dragon Core as a Servant and how if Solomon were summoned in a Grail War he would likely be limited by his master's mana sully regardless of who his master would be.
>>
>>135933200
>>135933245
I fucking hate Arturia and it's disturbing when people try to shove Takeuchi's shit taste to others. Also, stop spouting your head canon.
>>
>>135933424
I mentioned AAS having to be focused to beat him because we don't know how it functions. If it's raining down Excalibur-like beams like the Human Extinction Attack, then it's not going to overpower Enuma Elish because its destruction is spread over the entire world. If it's just a giant beam cannon with the power of hundreds of millions, then it overpowers it by far.
>>
>>135933432
>in Zero

Reality Marbles are explicitly weaker than the real world

>and exactly what he starts to do in strange fake

Post quotes of it destroying the entire world.
>>
>>135933465
More like Gil applies a temporary wallpaper and the world is never gone.

Primordial Earth is still there and modern Earth quickly comes back afterwards.
>>
>>135933456
>Guess what Excalibur is the sword of promised victory but Saber doesn't win all her battles.
Because that's a NP created by grail-kun, not the real one
>>
>>135933456
Except for it, you know, being the sword that performed genesis and all that.
>>
>>135933456
Wasnt EA made by the gods?
I doubt that is just a city buster.
>>
>>135933498
Yes but delusional Gilfags claim normal Servant Gil can destroy the world. And that Original Heroic Spirit Gil can do better.
>>
>>135933526
>More like Gil applies a temporary wallpaper and the world is never gone.
Doesn't Gil actually do the opposite? Where an RM would be what you describe but EE takes off the wallpaper that is the world before the world puts it back on again?
>>
>>135933548
>you know, being the sword that performed genesis and all that.

Gilfags actually believe this.
>>
>>135933519
A world is a world. Are you that guy who thinks Gaia is going to be magically resistant to Ea despite Ea being the very thing that created its current form?
>>
>>135933432
>>135933519
>Zero

In Zero he kills half of Rider's army, he doesn't destroy the RM. Also destroying a shitty RM, destroying all of Gaia's RM.

At best he can do what Shiki does when he kills Gaia.
>>
>>135933588
Yes, all the times it is mentioned to have done that must be pure hyperbole. Surly, it's just the original dildo or something rocking the world with the power of the original orgasm.
>>
>>135933498
>if Solomon were summoned in a Grail War
He doesn't exist in the seat of servants because he turned himself into a heroic spirit.

>mfw stupid fuckers who never played the games try to discuss them
>>
>>135933632
He's destroying the world, but then the RM naturally fades beforehand due to the soldiers dying.
>>
>>135933599
Thanks for proving your are the samefagging Gilfag who keeps posting his fanfiction in this thread.

A world isn't a planet in the Nasuverse. And Gaia resists Ea pretty fine. Ea doesn't cause permanent effects and Ea did not create Gaia.
>>
>>135933468
Near Side battle Holy grail program isn't Mooncell. It's only 0.2% of its power or something.
>>
>>135933663
Solomon is still a Heroic Spirit. He just summoned the "main body", which is now the Grand classes, himself. There's no reason he cannot be summoned as a normal Servant.
>>
>>135933632
>Shiki
>Killing Gaia

This is hilarious, shikifags are retarded.
>>
Kingprotea.

She's a Galaxy buster at least. That's why she doesn't appear outside of fanservice bullshit.
>>
>>135933734
He totally did that in the visual novel Tsukihime
>>
>>135933734
Is this bait?
>>
>>135933644
Funny because in the youtube videos you pathetically watched since you can't even install a VN, Gil says the mother earth goddess is even more ancient than his own mythology with an entirely different creation myth,

The fact you actually can't distinguish hyperbole in a setting that clashes different myths together just adds another point to the case that Gilfags are just newfag secondaries.
>>
>>135930866
>>135932478
>>135933200
Do you seriously think this is all it takes to prove your point
>>
>>135933549
In CCC it's said that Gilgamesh himself was created by Gaia's deterring power to bring humans under control and keep the age of gods alive.

「人間を諌め地上に繋ぎ止めるための楔」として星の抑止力によって生み出された存在であったことが明かされる。
しかし神でも人でもない独立した存在であった彼は、生まれながらに神ですら理解できないほど広く遠い視野を有しており、結果として抑止力の意思を無視、神を廃して人を憎み、人と星の未来を守護し見定める道を選んだ。
楔として生み出された筈が、神を旧時代のものと一蹴しとどめを刺す存在となってしまったのである。
>>
>>135933699
>It was absolute power — the power to destroy the World itself.
>It was enough to delude one into thinking that Gaia/Counter Force of the planet was opposing Gilgamesh’s power to destroy the World.

And since when is anyone arguing that Gil can planet bust?
>>
>>135933599
Dude, just reread the story again like right now. You're confuse your own headcanon with the actual story.
>>
>>135933715
Except that he outright says himself that he can't, retard.
>>
>>135933700
>It's only 0.2% of its power or something

Did you asspull this number? No, near side > far side. It was stated if BB were to leave the far side the Moon Cell would delete her in a second. The Moon Cell oversees all the near side, but not the far side.
>>
>>135933878
Except he doesn't.
>>
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>>135933734
Not whole Gaia you moron but part of it.
>>
>>135933838
So?
Again,Wasnt EA made by the gods?
I doubt that is just a city buster.
>>
>>135933838
Gaia always loses.

She's the biggest jobber of the entire TM history. Look at Arc in her route, she loses to everyone. Pathetic.
>>
>>135933942
>I doubt that is just a city buster.
Flawless argument
>>
>>135933859
There is nothing saying that refers to the entire world. Do I need to mention all the times an anti-unit NP has failed to kill a person?
>>
>>135933897
>I didn't play the mobage, and I am a filthy EOP. Let me shit up the thread.
Fatefags everyone.
>>
>>135933897
yes he does you fucking retard
>>
>>135933975
>Called by this name, the Sword of Rupture was the primordial sword present at the creation of the world in the Age of Gods. The role the blade of the beginning accomplished - it was nothing short of that which had cut apart what had been shapeless into Heaven and Earth, what had given a definitive shape to that distinction.
Again, that's its entire point. Take world A, destroy it, and create world B.
>>
>>135933942
>The god, Ea, is believed to be the quasi-deification of the power of the planet which turned, smashed, and stabilized the surface of the earth when it was still covered in gas and seas of magma, during the primordial stage of the earth. Many gods began building nations after the the primordial earth was stabilized into a world where living creatures could live, but Ea is a god who performed the act of building of planet before that.
>Gilgamesh's sword, which is crowned with Ea's name, changes space itself by agitating space-time through the rotation of three layers of giant power fields. Its true power is not something to be used against a single living creature but against the world. Even among the many Noble Phantasms possessed by Servants, it is one considered to be at the top, the sword "which tore apart the world."

From CCC.
>>
>>135934007
>>135934023
Then post the line instead of trying to win your argument through name calling. Except you can't, so you won't.
>>
>>135933954
>Gaia
>She
>>
>>135934079
Read
>>135934007
>>
>>135934026
And yet you have no proof normal Gil can do this shit. The whole point of Servants is that they are limited by the container they are in.
>>
>>135934079
I am not name calling, but joining the argument with empty information/knowledge will just poison the well. It is the same as claiming that Akira Toriyama is the guy who made Fate series. Also you are over 18 years old already, why should anyone here spoonfeed me?
If you post the pic of your disability on here I will spoonfeed you immediately.
>>
Would Gil be a useless jobber (even more so) if he was summoned by Shirou, or is he mana-efficient enough for it not to really matter?
>>
>>135934092
Text says it can destroy the word. Text says Gil can make it stronger than its max output with his treasury.

You say he cannot do that. Guess who needs to prove their case?
>>
>>135934138
Gil is pretty ridiculously mana-efficient. Independent Action A.

A bigger concern is compatibility.
>>
>>135934137
>>135934090
Good job in proving your case. There is not one line in the translated segment that says "he is not a regular Heroic Spirit." He says several times that he is a Heroic Spirit, but the whole point is that he got the Ferrari while everyone else has the Yugo containers.
>>
>>135934171
>Text says it can destroy the word

The world is effectively destroyed in the area Ea targets. The area is limited, only 1000 targets. The burden of proof is on you to prove it can affect the entirety of the world.
>>
>>135934221
>trying to use maximum targets, a measurement that has absolutely no explanation at all, as a means of arguing
>>
>>135934290
Uh, anon, I think you're calling the wrong person a moron. The post you're replying to has nothing to do with that argument.
>>
>>135934290
That's just him saying he did it all himself, dumbass. When he's saying Heroic Spirit, he's talking about "summoning" himself as Grand Caster. That's what the Grand classes are, Heroic Spirits.
>>
>>135934220
>There is not one line in the translated segment
are you retarded

>that says "he is not a regular Heroic Spirit."
He doesn't say that you fucking retard, he says HE NEVER WENT TO THE SEAT AND CAN'T BE SUMMONED BECAUSE HE TURNED HIMSELF INTO A HEROIC SPIRIT AND THAT'S WHY HE'S A GRAND

fucking moron
>>
>>135934349
>heroic spirits in the grail war are copies of the heroes in the seat of servants

>solomon never went to the seat and can't be summoned

>Therefore he can be summoned! He summoned himself!
>>
>>135934394
He doesn't say he never went to the throne. He's responding to Mordred's statement that he was summoned by a human and is then using this time to wreck shit.
>>
>>135934171
Yes, Ea is one of the most powerful NP and it was so powerful that it can harm the world but it can not destroy it.

Nasu did not shove this 'anti-planet' class NP for nothing, you see?
>>
>>135933302
>Sakurai wrote Prototype Fragments and there is an account of a male Attila there. Who is she?
What? At what point and in what context is Attila referenced in Fragments?
>>
>>135934259
It's certainly better than your shitty headcanon and totally valid. It has the same range as Excalibur whether you like it or not.
>>
>>135934438
>He doesn't say he never went to the throne
Yes he does.
>>
>>135934478
And it clearly extends beyond that range because it then proceeds to suck the entire area into nothingness. Unless you think it only sucks in the area in the beamzone, in which case you have never looked at any image of IH.
>>
>>135934537
Your point is Gil as a servant can destroy the world via EA, correct?
>>
>>135934508
Solomon
Don't place me on the same level as you incompetent fools. After I died, I resurrected myself and sublimed into a Heroic Spirit by my own power.

>I resurrected myself
brought myself back into the world without needing to be summoned by a human

>sublimed into a Heroic Spirit by my own power.
into the Grand vessel, a living Heroic Spirit, also referred to as the "main body" in CM3 or somewhere else

That does not imply he went directly from dying --> Grand. By nature, a Heroic Spirit is someone on the Throne anyway, and the Grand classes are made for the top 7 Heroic Spirits, which he claims to be part of.
>>
>>135934438

>>135934090
>>
>>135934608
If he uses Enuma Elish and does not get countered by something equal or greater, the end result is that the world will be divided and reformed.
>>
>>135934638
>the Grand classes are made for the top 7 Heroic Spirits
but that's wrong, retard

what the fuck kind of shit translations are you using
>>
>>135934677
>equal or greater

Or, you know, he just doesn't go all out.
>>
>>135934685

Andersen
And. The ones summoned to defeat it are those who stand at the pinnacle of all Heroic Spirits.

Solomon
The seven greatest knights of that era, who protect humanity's foundations. The first seven who stand at the pinnacle of Heroic Spirits.
???
My name is Solomon. Know me, one of the seven standing at the summit of the Heroic Spirits.


What is wrong in all of these?
>>
>>135926329
I wanna know who Grand Lancer is at this point. I always just assumed it would be Odin but then I remembered you can't summon gods.
>>
>>135934774
not there dumbfuck
>>
>>135934774
Are you retarded? There's a long explanation of how the grand servants have nothing to do with the regular servants/heroic spirits and aren't bound by the same rules WHICH IS WHAT MAKES THEM GRAND SERVANTS because the grail war's summoning ritual is a shitty copy of the original, and the grand servants ARE ONLY AVAILABLE FOR THE ORIGINAL SUMMONING RITUAL.
>>
>>135934790
>I remembered you can't summon gods.
There are so many exceptions to that rule you might as well ignore it.
>>
>>135934677
I'm not sure of how stupidly op Ea would be when Gil was alive but as a servant he can not do that.

I think you will get a better picture of how Ea works if you read Hollow Ataraxia.
>>
>>135934861
Nowhere does it say that. It says the ritual uses the top seven HSs. Nowhere does it say those HSs are unique to that ritual. I think you're forgetting that Saber is going to be summoned as Grand Saber.
>>
>>135934923
>Nowhere does it say that
Yes it does in the fucking game, what kind of shit translations are you using?
>>
>>135934902
All he does is open a void in hollow. He doesn't do the world sucky thing that happens in Zero and strange fake.
>>
>>135934867
In that case, I'd probably still place my bets for Odin being the Grand Lancer.
I can't think of any other particularly special Lances in history aside from Gungnir which would really be "The Strongest Lance"
Odin just being powerful is a bonus
>>
Aren't Reality Marbles weaker than Gaia because Gaia is constantly trying to unmake them?
>>
>>135934677
If he intends it to do so, maybe.

Are you fuckers forgetting how CCC and its side materials established how Gil's been holding back with Enuma Elish all this time? Up till now he was using Enuma Elish on a power level he calls the "law of the earth" while in CCC he switches to the "law of the heavens".
>>
>>135934943
Then post your own translation. Because the only translations we have do not imply that in the least.
>>
>>135934956
Different writers. He did use Ea at full power in Hollow. Actually it's stated every time he utters Enuma Elish Ea is at full power.
>>
>>135935019
I played the fucking game, retard.

>>135934007
>>
>>135935004
>Are you fuckers forgetting how CCC and its side materials established how Gil's been holding back with Enuma Elish all this time?
He went all out in Stay Night. EA is trash tier, deal with it.
>>
>>135934956
Huh? it's not a world sucking in any version. Still, Yeah, it's stupidly op.
>>
>>135935054
Not him but if there are discrepancies I'll go with Nasu.
>>
>>135935063
Then you're probably just bad at reading Japanese. I don't know they're level of expertise, but neither of the two translations done by two people (who at least seem to have a high level of expertise) even come close to implying that.
>>
>>135935107
In Zero, it sucks in the entire RM including the sky as if it were actually a thing that can be broken, and it starts to do the same exact thing in strange fake before Enkidu counters him. Just chalk it up to powercreep.
>>
>>135935134
>who at least seem to have a high level of expertise
Yes I'm sure you can tell despite not understanding the language at all.

And yes I'm sure they have really high levels of expertise even though they can't even figure out basic fucking grammar
>Angel of Four Pillars
>>
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>no one can agree on how Ea works because it's presented differently in every iteration, is always described in hyperbolic myth format, and is stated to be "full power" every time it's used
This man is a menace, and he needs to be stopped.
>>
>>135935175
Yeah, that also happened in Hollow. It oppened a hole in space time. That's nothing new.
>>
>>135935203
Why are you bringing up something neither of those two translated from what I can tell?

The other guy used "[Battle: vs Emissary's Four Pillars]"
>>
>>135935134
>my fan subbers understand japanese better than you stupid japs!

>>>/int/53374254
>>
>>135935276
How the fuck are we supposed to tell which retarded translations you're using when all you're posting is snippets that are also completely unrelated to what we're discussing, dumbfuck?
>>
>>135935250
In hollow, it just opens up a hole, but it doesn't start sucking in the entire dreamworld. In strange fake, the first thing it does is start sucking in everything in the same exact way as Zero. So either he can stabilize it or just chalk it up to different writers.
>>
>>135935326
Of two translations, one partial translation has been posted in this thread and the full scene translation has been linked in this thread. What other translation would I be using?
>>
>>135935134
>>135935019
>>135934923
>i don't understand japanese and never played the game but i read these fan translations which are 100% correct by the bestest japanese translators ever

fuck off
>>
So are we going to discuss how Fou-kun is actually Merlin and is going around groping all the girls or what?
>>
>>135935439
>I don't actually have an argument, but I'm going to pretend my likely subpar grasp of the language inherently makes me correct.
>>
>>135935502

>>135935289
>>
>>135935233

Seems more like the fandom tries to make things as they see fit because Nasu likes to use colorful metaphors rather than nail down specifics. It's a give and take relationship, since it enables us to wank, and for him to retool the mechanics as he sees fit.

For instance, people say Sakura's abilties are just shadow tendrils that drain, yet in Hollow it's clearly shown that she opens a void and takes things into a seperate dimension. Meaning all the powers the Shadow used are powers she can use, because they were her powers. But people can't seem to agree what her powers exactly are for some reason.
>>
>>135935518
I do trust people who have been translating this shit for years over a couple anon on a message board who could be in their first year of a beginners Japanese course for all I know.

It's not like I'm even demanding "well, you translate the entire scene!" Just post the two sentences that show for certain "Solomon never died, he became a living Heroic Spirit completely on his own despite that making no sense because Heroic Spirits are inherently beings that exist on the Throne and that the entire purpose of the world being able to summon them is that it's summoning the full heroes from the throne rather than a mere degraded copy like the HGW system."
>>
>>135935641
you find me a transcript then because I'm sure as fuck not booting up the game, going to the scene, and replaying it all over again just to copy the text to satisfy some dumbass who has no idea what he's talking about

also
>>135935518
>>
>>135935703
So then you're probably just misremembering because not once has that been implied anywhere.
>>
>>135935803
wrong
>>
>>135934790
Lugh.
>>
>you're wrong
>no, you are
>fuck you
>FUCK YOU
Real enlightening debate you got going here guys
>>
>>135935918
Then I guess you're just superior to all the other Japanese speaking users of everywhere because in all the discussion of Solomon, that's never been brought up.
>>
>>135935963
It's hard to debate untranslated shit
>>
>>135935233
He just retcons it whenever it gets stronger. Mordred used to be a guy, after all.
>>
>>135935989
Every single person on 2chan uses my interpretation.

>other Japanese speaking users
Population of the entire fucking planet's Japanese speakers: Me and your two shitty fansubbers, okay.
>>
I'll just post the scene where he explains it. I'm neither of the two people arguing.
>>
>>135936146
There's a scene with Modred saying nani but I'm not wasting a minute just to post that.
>>
>>135936146
>I may be a heroic spirit but could never be summoned by a human

Bam. Thank you.
>>
It honestly would not surprise me is one of the Grand Servants is Gilgamesh in a different role.

Grand Servants were meant to fight apostles.
>>
>>135936204
Then there's a scene with Roman tripping over his own words because he can't believe what he's hearing but I won't post it because he literally just repeats what Solomon said.
>>
>>135936265
>>135936146
Shitty translation says
>While I'm certainly a Heroic Spirit, no human summoned me.
THAT'S WRONG YOU FUCKING RETARDS

He says 人間に召喚される事はない
He CANNOT be summoned by humans
>>
>>135936146
>>135936204
>>135936307
Takeuchi should be legally prohibited from working as an artist.
>>
tl;dr

>>135934394
>>
>>135936333
What the hell, that game is filled with much, much worse designs and art and you complain about Takeuchi?
>>
I'm ready for Saber to be summoned as a Grand Servant to BTFO of this thread.

Gilgamesh will be a Grand Servant too.
>>
>>135933715
>There's no reason he cannot be summoned as a normal Servant.

>>135936146
>>135936265
>>I may be a heroic spirit but could never be summoned by a human
>>
Anyone else think Grand Order is fucking retarded?
>>
>>135936424
>>>I may be a heroic spirit but could never be summoned by a human

Could just mean he can't be summoned in his grand form aka Caster.

Need to see who the other 6 servants turn out to be.
>>
>>135936398
Yes, because Takeuchi's shit is what's currently being posted. I'd be happy to call other bad designs shit if you posted them instead.
>>
>>135936484
>I'd be happy to call other bad designs shit if you posted them instead.
Why? are your bored?
>>
>>135936464
no
>>135936307

He's an individual.
>>
>>135936441
I haven't played it, it sounds like the epitome of retarded cashgrab though
>>
>>135936519
Yes. And Takeuchi's designs are shit.
>>
>>135936522
Except we already know we're getting Grand Saber Artoria. If he can't be summoned, that's something unrelated to the state of being Grand.
>>
>>135936484

Lurk more then, fucking Takeuchi is an almighty god compared with the beyond embarrasing shit GO got.
>>
>>135936441
I'm genuinely impressed that there's an actual story. The cash grabbing and the story are completely separate too.
>>
>>135936277

Not all the apostles are Primate Murder tier though. From 4th place down most notable Heroic Spirits can fight them or outright beat them.
>>
>>135936584
That doesn't actually make his art good.
>>
>>135936416
> yfw Grand Saber has the power to summon all Saber clones

Do you have enough seibas in stock?
>>
>>135936582
>implying Grand Saber isn't going to be Anne Bonnie
>>
>>135936582
>already know we're getting Grand Saber Artoria
We don´t.
Retard.
>>
>>135936594
Yeah, it's actually piss easy to follow the story given how they throw items at you that basically let you cheat at battles, reviving all your characters at 100% meter, that you can use unlimited times (as long as you have them left).
>>
>>135936657
And?
>>
>>135936714
And?
>>
>>135936584

But we have been getting quite awesome designs too.

I'm just glad Takeuchi is doing other characters than Saber decently these days. Maybe he is kept satisfied by the sheer amount of new Saber stuff he can make up.
>>
>>135936657
No, but it's the lesser evil by far. If anything he should have made most if not all the GO designs, "should be legally prohibited from working" my ass.
>>
>>135936678
Grand Saber in the files listed same voice actress as Saber. Saber is hyped to have an Excalibur to save the world. Grands are supposed to save humanity. You'd have to go full retard denial mode to think it'll be anything other than Saber.
>>
>>135936582
>Except we already know we're getting Grand Saber Artoria
wrong
>>
>>135936780
>>135936678
>voice actress for Grand Saber is Ayako Kawasumi
>Saber's voice actress is Ayako

Hm, I wonder who Grand Saber could possibly be.
Miyamoto Musashi by any chance?
>>
>>135936764
I wish I could see Takeuchi's room, it must be the greatest seibah sanctuary ever.
>>
>>135936441
It was create for the sake of milking money and cash grab after all.
>>
>>135936634
>From 4th place down

Fucking ORT is #5 dude. No, all the top 5 DAA are ultimate-class monsters far beyond normal Servants.
>>
>>135937062
To be fair, ORT is only #5 because it killed the previous #5. It could actually be stronger.
>>
>>135936775
What if it was Saber Lili? A Saber that retained her Lili form throughout and became a queen better than regular Arturia.
>>
>>135936634
>From 4th place down most notable Heroic Spirits can fight them or outright beat them.

ORT is 5th and their rank =/= their power.
>>
>>135936146
>>135936204
>That is where you are mistaken o' Londinium knight. It is true that I am a heroic spirit but I have never been summoned by a human. Do not think for a moment that you incompetents are of equal stature to myself. After my death, I arose by my own power and sublimated myself as a heroic spirit.
Without context that's as close as I'm sure it can be. Don't usually check in on these threads. What's this about grand servants and what's Nasu doing with them?
>>
>>135937787
Missed the 3rd screen.

>>135936307
>A living person and at the same time a heroic spirit. That is what I am. Consequently, I have no master presiding over me.
>>
>>135937787
They are the original 7 servants chosen as the basis for the Holy Grail servant system.
>>
>>135937963
I got that much from the thread but what is their relevance to GO's plot?
>>
>>135937963
Do we know any of the Grand versions besides Solomon yet?
>>
>>135938027
As of now it's just Solomon showing off and using his status as a grand Servant to shit on everybody else.

Since there's a grand Ascension mechanic it's strongly suspected you'll be able to make your own Servants into Grand Servants later on.
>>
>>135938027
Solomon appears to be the big bad of the story. He's called the Grand Caster and they talk a bit about what Grand classes mean. That's pretty much the gist of how they're relevant so far.
>>
>>135937559
>nd their rank =/= their power

Rank has some correlation to power. After all, they are all top threats against humanity.
>>
>>135926329
>Enuma Elish destroys worlds
Enuma Elish destroy worlds in the sense of "worlds" being Reality Marbles. It's not actually a planetbuster.
>>
>>135938059
Not yet. Saber is in the game files though.
>>
>>135930552
>Gaia hates humans

>The planet loved all of its children

There is literally no reason to think that Gaia dislikes humans. It dislikes the idea that they outlive her.
>>
>>135938202
Their rank = their threat to humanity otherwise the jobber like Nrvnqsr would never rank#10 and a hack like Ortenrosse and Blackmoa would be one of the top 10.
>>
>>135938484
No you moron that isn't how it works
>>
>>135937787
>but I have never been summoned by a human
wrong, retard
>>
>>135926329
Enuma Elish reveals the world prior to Gaia's RM also known as the 'Truth'
>>
>>135938582
But it is? As an Anti-World NP the most Ea can do is damage Gaia's RM. It's strong either way, but doesn't have anywhere near the necessary output to actually destroy a planet.
>>
I just realized Ultimate Ones are comparable to vampires.
>>
>>135933942
Gods are shit-tier in the Nasuverse.
>>
>>135938867
No. If only because of their authority.
>>
>>135938867
In the Moon Cell, they're god tier.
>>
>>135938867
They're not. Gods summoned as servants are weaker than they were when alive.
>>
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>>135938557
True that.
>>
>>135938911
They don't really have much authority anymore in the modern era. Most gods have just degraded into nature spirits.
>>
>>135938911
>>135938924
>>135938931
Gods don't have much authority in the Nasuverse because they're only beings that exist thanks to human belief. Types and Elementals are way above them.
>>
>>135934790
Bet Grand Lancer will be second coming of Jesus Christ/Isa Al-Masih. In one version, it said that he will kill the Antichrist/Al-Masih Ad Dajjal by himself with a spear.
>>
>>135938589
Literally it would be "There has never been an event where I have been summoned to a human" but that was too stiff even for this guy.
>>
>>135938172
But he's Lawful Good.
>>
>>135939107
Wrong, retard.
>>
>>135939019
>and Elementals

Make that True Ancestors. Most elementals are below Gods.
>>
Who are they going to get for the grand versions of the other classes?

They've already ran through like all the notable historical warriors haven't they?
>>
How likely is it that full power Gilgamesh is Grand Archer?
>>
>>135939160
Aren't TA's basically just elementals with that were created by Gaia with Crimson Moon as a template anyway?
>>
>>135939019
Just to give you an idea, neither of the gorgon sisters are Casters and they both have EX rank magic and luck. And not all the gods are due to human belief since they existed before humans in Nasuverse.
>>
>>135939123
Then break it down for me. I'd love some insight if you have any to give.
>>
>>135939204
I can't really imagine anyone else being a stronger candidate at the moment. King of Heroes is pretty high up there. Personality's a bit of a problem but if someone as big of a dick as Solomon can be a Grand, then I don't see why Gil can't.
>>
>>135939267
Nobody has EX rank luck except that one Rider whose name I forgot. EX rank stats outside of noble phantasms are rare as fuck.
>>
>>135939317
Choke on a dick and die, shitposter.
>>
>>135939377
>True Archer from Fate/Strange Fake
>>
>>135939245
No, they are stated to be"characteristically close to elementals". They are above the elmental hierarchy since they are stated to be higher ranked than Gods who were in turn stated to be the higher class of elementals.
>>
>>135939117
Whoever said killing everyone is not good was probably evil.
>>
>>135939317
Are you retarded?
>>135936265
>>135936322
>>
>>135939417
Not in the game and not on the leak list.
>>
>>135939377
>>135939204
I don't see why he would need to be Archer.

Doesn't Archer naturally hold him back?
>>
>>135939417
Eh. Nasu tends to use primarily Servants that he himself created. Plus, we don't know how True Archer would fare against a serious Gilgamesh. I doubt he can tank Ea.
>>
>>135939493
What would be the best class for him to be in, then?
>>135939417
Do we even know what he's capable of?
>>
>>135939493
It's the class that suits him best. Besides, for Grands, classes are just a formality. They're backed up directly by the planet and the containers don't have the same limitations as the ones used by the Grail system.
>>
>>135939317
>>>/int/53379224
>>
>>135939523
>What would be the best class for him to be in, then?
Gilgamesh.
>>
>>135939383
幸運 is good luck.
>>
Would the Angra Manyuu at the end of Heavens Feel be Grand Avenger? He is technically a servant, after all.

>archer has seen at least shit as ugly as that in his time
>>
>>135939578
>GG.
>Grand Gilgamesh.
>>
>>135939621
Avenger's an irregular Servant invented by the Einzberns. There should only be seven Grand Servants.
>>
>>135926329
>E AGI
Achilles speedblitzes. Can't react to Lancelot bullets. Legend of Dracula Vlad also speedblitzes. Can't react to True Archer arrows.
So much for the strongest.
>>
>>135939600
I didn't know that, thanks.
Does it mean she has the same ability as Rider, where her luck is so high that she wins battles when the odds are against her/makes miracles happen?

>mana: EX
What does that entail?
>>
>>135939383
Taiga the Tiger has EX luck
>>
>>135939680
Read the thread.
>>
>>135939600
>ex rank luck
>die eaten by her sister

I'd rather have E-xellent rank luck and die heroically every time than this.
>>
>>135939680

His Agility is B, dude. Also, he can see the future, so he knows what move everyone is going to make before they make them.
>>
>>135939317
>>135939564
>It's basic grammar

Holy shit, why is this cocksucking tripfaggot pretending he can translate Japanese?
>>
>>135939600
>>135939383
Taiga has EX-rank Luck.
>>
>>135939741
Knowing a curtain of bullets is coming at you doesn't mean you can dodge them.
>>
>>135939685
>What does that entail?

Never runs out of mana. She's a goddess after all.

Also you fags need to read this

http://forums.nrvnqsr.com/showthread.php/6031-Fate-Grand-Order-Story-and-Lore/page491
>>
Who do you think the possible servant for Grand Berserker, Rider, and Assassin btw?
>>
>>135939819
Since when do non-servants have stats?

Also I'm curious to know, are there servants which are ranked EX in anything else than luck, NP or mana?
>>
>>135939789
She chose to get eaten. She could have avoided that fate, but her grief at what Medusa had become led her to sacrifice herself.

Luck only matters if you allow yourself to be led by it. If you go against that luck, then it won't do anything.

Unfortunately, luck does not extend beyond one's own self, so no matter how lucky she is, the fate of her own little sister becoming a monster couldn't have been avoided.
>>
>>135939833
He doesn't need to dodge them.
>>
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>>135939449
You can interpret it as either "never been summoned" or perhaps "does not mean I was summoned by humans" since 事 can refer to an event or a fact though the latter would normally be pair with では
. There isn't actually an explicit denial for the possibility of him not being summonable by humans, just it has never happened.

>>135939564
You see the first one right? I mean it's not like this trip doesn't have some creditibility to back up the translation quality.
>>
>>135939833

Are you stupid? He doesn't even need to lift a finger to block any attack he wants to.
>>
>>135939888
>Grand Berserker
It'll be a hero/deity who's naturally mad, for sure (as opposed to having the mad enhancement)
>Grand Rider
Pale Rider is pretty much the most powerful Rider of all so they'll have to top that in some way
>Grand Assassin
Hassan
>>
>>135939854
>Also you fags need to read this
Are you retarded? We've already established that the translation there is full of shit.
>>
>>135939888

Heracles could be Grand Rider since he's known as the one who 'tamed the wild world for mankind'. He could also be Berserker just by dint of being the strongest Servant who qualifies for that role, or Assassin for the same reason. It depends on who Nasu has in mind, though. I would be very sad if Heracles doesn't appear as at least one Grand.
>>
>>135939896
Spartacus has EX endurance,
>>
>>135939973
The Black Plague isn't a proper Heroic Spirit, so I don't think it'd get chosen.
>>
>>135939896
Spartacus with EX endurance, KP with EX strength and endurance, and BB with * everything. No EX agility yet, maybe Pale Rider will be the first.
>>
>>135939896
There's this Chinese one that who's NP(the EX rank) is to turn into a dragon. Although all her other stats are utter trash even as a Berserker.
>>
>>135939996
Heracles as Grand Archer, with original form of Nine Lives
>>
>>135939944
"The first one" being
>If someone says "私は負けることはない" it means "I will never lose", if they say "私は笑われることはない" it means "I will never be laughed yet". There are no cases in which it refers to past tense, it indicates that the thing being talked about is (to the speaker) impossible.

>There are no cases in which it refers to past tense
>the thing being talked about is impossible.

>>but I have never been summoned by a human
>indicates the thing never happened before in the past, does not indicate that it's impossible

You must be retarded.
>>
>>135939888
Achilles
Lancelot
King Hassan
>>
>>135940061

Unlikely, since Gilgamesh is almost guaranteed to be Grand Archer.
>>
>>135939896
>>135939896
Since Nasu himself said so.
Taigas wikipage has the sources. Look em up,shes a monster,cabable taking on Ryougi
>>
>>135939973
>Grand Berserker,
Beowolf?
>Assassin
Holmes
>Saber
Niten.
>>
>>135940096
>since Gilgamesh is almost guaranteed to be Grand Archer
>This is what Gilfags actually believe
True Archer will be Grand Archer. Gil a weak shit.
>>
What if the Grand Servants are all Heroic Spirits who are still alive somehow?

Caster is Solomon, the King of Magic who died and was able to bring himself back to life.
Saber is Artoria from the Fate route, the Once and Future King who resides in Avalon.

Shit like that.
>>
>>135940054
>EX endurance
Which means he's always at full power no matter how long he fights?
>EX strength
What's that mean?
>*
That just means "not applicable" right?

EX stats are supposed to give the servant a unique characteristic that's far above what can be measured, is that it?
>>
>>135940058
>Mad Enhancement rank up can't even get most of them above C

Jesus fuck that's horrifically shit.
>>
>>135939988
>Mcjon's translations
>full of shit
>>
>>135940129
Nasu rarely uses Servants that he, personally, hasn't created.
>>
>>135939888
I could see Cain being Grand Assassin
>>
>>135940174
>can't get basic grammar correct
>not full of shit
>>135939564

keep fapping to your shitty fansubbers, faggot
>>
>>135940222
Oh, yeah. And it would work with what >>135940149 was saying.
>>
Bringing Mcjon to this thread RIGHT NOW
>>
>>135940150
It means really really tanky. One Servant with BC may be able to survive a fatal wound for a bit, but Spartacus can be reduced to near mush and still keep going just fine. You need to vaporize him in one shot.

Kingprotea is at base 30 meters tall and can only get bigger, so it's just that she's big.

* is that it's outside the system of numbers, to show how crazy BB is.
>>
>>135940174
See:

>>135936146
>>135936322
>>135939564
>>
>>135940222
That's a pretty neat idea.
>>135940342
>it's just that she's big
How does that help against servants with physical abilities that far exceed humans'?
>it's outside the system of numbers
Why wouldn't they just put EX? It would make more sense since EX is already supposed to be beyond measure.
>>
>>135939973
>>135939996
>>135940088
>>135940222

It's stated that Berserker is Heracles's weakest possible class.
As for Rider, it's either Pestilence or some dragon rider. Saint Martha's Tarrasque doesn't looks like nasuverse impossible-to-tame-divine-beast.
Grand Assassin should be the strongest of Hassan, whoever he is.
I see Cain more as a Berserker rather than Assassin.
>>
>>135926329

Speaking of Ea, did Gil use it at 100% in FSN. I remember a dialogue (in fate against Avalon maybe) where it was stated that he unleashed its maximal output but I can't really tell if it was a way of speaking or a fact.
>>
>>135940222
I'm sorry, but Cain would be a shitty assassin. He may be the first murderer, but he definitely wasn't the best.

>Noble Phantasm: Rock
>Rank: E-
>He picks up a random rock and bludgeons his enemy in the head with it in the middle of an open field, hoping that no one sees him in the act.

>Class Skill: Presence Concealment
>Rank: E
>He's a fucking farmer, what the hell does he know about stealth?
>>
>>135940402
The Japanese on /int/ have this to say:

>>53379224
>If someone says they XXされる事はない does that mean that they
>1) Have never been XX before
>or
>2) Cannot be XX

>If someone says "私は負けることはない" it means "I will never lose", if they say "私は笑われることはない" it means "I will never be laughed yet". There are no cases in which it refers to past tense, it indicates that the thing being talked about is (to the speaker) impossible.

>2, this is basic grammar.
>>
>>135940452
>the strongest of Hassan
True Assassin in Strange Fake is probably the strongest Assassin, since his presence concealment skill is EX. The guy can literally stop himself from existing by merging with the world - that's as good as an assassin can get.
>>
>>135939973

Nah, Grand Assassin is the inventor of murder and the original killer, Cain himself.

Problem is, theoricaly he is still alive.

Grand Rider could be Santa Claus

>that sweet EX rank speed to deliver presents
>fame unequaled in todays age granting insane stats boost
>dat toy workshop reality marble
>dat Rudolph noble phantasm
>EX rank item creation
>ability to judge bad kids only rivaled by God

Absolutely overpowered, though I doubt he would indulge in such a folly as the grail war. Also theoricaly not dead.
>>
>>135940468
Basaka's weapon was a rock and he used it pretty well. Then again it was Heracles
>>135940516
>he is still alive
What? Explain
>>
>>135940468
It's like you have never played a fate game.
>>
>>135940468

Cain lived for at least 700 years according to Genesis, anon. Most of that as a king. That's more than enough time for him to master the art of stealth.
>>
>>135940342

Spartacus is indeed really tanky, but he got EX endurance more because he convert damage to prana. He's dead because his body can't contain shitton of prana, deformed, and exploded
>>
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>>135940450
Like that.

EX is outside the number chart. * is outside of numbers entirely.
>>
>>135940468
He might be shit at assassinating people but the Mark of Cain would be an insanely good NP.
>>
>>135939888
Grand Rider is obviously Noah, or the Mesopotamian guy they based him on, Ziusudra/Utnapishtim.
>>
>>135940559
Servants' abilities are all derived from their myths.

There is no story surrounding Cain that implies that he has any talent whatsoever as a killer beyond that a of a normal schmuck. He led his brother, who trusted him implicitly, during a time when the concept of murder did not even exist giving Abel absolutely no reason to be suspicious, into an open field and beat him over the head with a rock.
>>
>>135940645

Grand Rider could be Jesus, or Mohammed. Imagine the butthurt!
>>
>>135940129
They won't actually use True Archer before they've revealed who he is, and that'd spoil F/SF. So they won't use him at all.
>>
>>135940663

Nothing in the story of Medusa implied she had a Pegasus under her control, nor that she was an elite Rider on par with NASCAR's best. Nasu adds whatever the fuck he wants to the story.
>>
>>135940671
If they did Muhammad as a Caster, would their offices get bombed?
>>
>>135926329
>Together, the seven grand servants are strong enough to stand up to... Arcueid's sister's pet dog

Lolis are always to most powerful. No exceptions.
>>
>>135940671
would Jesus be riding the cross?
>>
>>135940663
>Servants' abilities are all derived from their myths.

Jesus Christ, stop being such a disgusting fanboy.
Seriously writing this shit is absolutely cringe worthy.
>>
>>135940694
The complete servant list has a "???" listed though and it's possibly that they add him in a later update after SF reveals him.

>>135940671
I wonder if adding Buddha and Amaterasu first was a way to cover their asses.

Martha is already talking about Jesus, wouldn't be too surprising to see him.
>>
If Grand Archer is Gil, then Grand Lancer has to be Enkidu.
>>
>>135940554

I'm no schollar, but as far as I remember he was damned to walk the Earth for eternity with his mark, and anyone wo would dare slay him would receive the wrath of god.
>>
>>135940663
>Arthur could shoot laser beams from his sword
i must of fallen asleep through that myth
>>
>>135940792

Nah, the Mark just declared that Cain could only die of natural causes, the story that Cain would never die and be forced to wander the world etc. is just bullshit that was made up to explain the existence of vampires
>>
>>135934007
>play the mobage
Anyone who actually play mobage shit deserve being purged
So it's a good thing he doesn't
>>
>>135940468
Who said he use rock to kill Able?

>>135940671

Jesus will be Grand Lancer. In Koran he will kill his Antichrist in apocalypse with a spear
>>
Shouldn't Cain be a berserker? Dude got mad enough at god favoring Abel's sacrifice over his, that he literally invented a concept of violence.

As for lancer, the options are literally just Odin and Jesus, there are no other spears that are even remotely well known or powerful enough for Grand other than Gungnir and Longinus.

Archer most likely Hou Yi, maybe Gil.
>>
How do you guys know all these things about PM and ORT and so on? Is it all from the Type Moon material books?

I wonder if there's ever gonna be some story, LN/VN or something, with them actually in it. Feels weird reading about that stuff on the wiki with it never being mentioned in any canon story. Wasted potential
>>
Grand Lancer will be Longinus
Grand Archer will be the first emperor of China that shoot down 9 suns.
>>
>>135940466
More like he use his all because if that's all Ea has then that's pretty shit for a so called Sword of Rupture.
>>
>>135940889
ORT and the other Types are from Notes.
>>
>>135940776
Enkidu's shtick is being made of mud and changing his stats to his whim
Hardly Grand material
>>
>>135940836

So as the guy who invented violence, God gave him the gift of being 100% immune and absolutely superior in all violence?

Sounds pretty Berserker-y to me. He'd be someone you literally can't fight head on because even if you wound him the damage would be negated, septupled, and dealt to you instead.
>>
>>135940874
There's always Scathach.
>>
>>135940280

>>135940402
>>135940490
>>
>>135940889
ORT is mentioned in F/SF and HA.
>>
>>135940918
Yeah, Hou Yi is almost definitely the Grand Archer.
>>
>Remember, Thor the God of Thunder appear as a servant card in Fate/Kaleid.
>>
MONKEY KING FOR GRAND LANCER
O
N
K
E
Y
>>
Hey what happened to all the philosophy bullshit? You know, Nasu's exploration of heroism, kingship, etc. At least that was interesting.
>>
>>135940776
>Grand Archer
>Gil
Gets wrecked once by Saber and another time by a teenage boy. Is he really the grand archer?
>>
>>135941028
Fate is only powerlevel shit now.
I hope you enjoy spending thousand of bucks gatcha-ing forever
>>
>>135940663
This. I loved Gilgamesh's pocket dimension in the myth, and Enkidu's limitless shapeshifter ability and androgynous aspect. I'm glad that who wrote the myth didn't make them just some manly wrestlers on adventure.

Based Fate series, always delivering the myths to otaku people.
>>
>>135941031
He never gets serious.

>As no proper Heroic Spirit can match this man, he could be called the “Servant Killer.” Without a doubt, he is the strongest existence amongst the Servants.
>Though he lost due to obsession against Saber…
>Though he lost due to pride against Shirou...
>Though he lost due to carelessness against XXXXX…
>…The fact of the matter is that if he actually gets serious, he is a Servant that cannot be rivaled.

>In the boy-meets-girl story of the original Fate/stay night he was forced to yield to the universal law of “love conquers all,” but in Fate/Zero he's free to show off his overwhelming, cheat-like strength without restraint. He could have ended the war in a single night if he truly desired to do so. But then, careless pride is the king's prerogative, and getting serious over something as frivolous as a wish-granter would be unbecoming. So, taking that into account, it sort of balances out the huge disparity in firepower… I guess?
>>
>>135941031
Gil will either be Grand Archer or simply Grand Gilgamesh. Anyone who thinks Nasu would leave him behind in the powerlevels is a moron. I would bet $1000 that we'll get to Babylon and Gil will mention something like "I could do that if I wanted, but it's too boring" or something.
>>
>>135941028

Shh...No philosophy, only power levels now.
>>
>>135941028

Nasu's philosophy crap was literally Naruto tier. It was never good.
>>
>>135941135
So what if he never gets serious if he never wins he's weak.
>>
Grand Assassin, the cow that cause the great fire of Chicago.
>>
>>135941002
"Exceptions" to that rule are so prevalent at this point, they might as well completely throw it out of the window.
>>
>>135941135
>>135941138

Gilfags everyone.
>>
For what it's worth, this "Grand" Servant thing was the natural progression of this fanfic-tier bullshit (I literally wrote this exact concept in 2010 with Solomon as the definitive Caster).

But it's way too late and too much fucking official fanfic like EXTRA and soforth exists to allow plausible Grand ____ for every other class.
>>
>>135941135
>killed by a slut
>killed by a school kid

Just fuck off.
>>
>>135941018
I would love to see Sun Wukong as a Servant.
>>
>>135941135
I wish every time I got wrecked a message popped up saying I wasn't being serious. Everyone would say,"That anon sure has potential to be the best if he was serious and didn't lose several times!"
>>
>>135941194
So you think it's a coincidence that the last stage of the known story will be Babylon in 3000 BC?
>>
>>135941228
Solomon is literally the only choice for a definitive Caster.
Saber should be Galahad
>>
>>135941194
>Nasu makes Gil the strongest
>Nasu continuously wanks Gil for over ten years, never once forgetting him
>Oh no, he sucks and he'll totally be forgotten by all these new Servants who are totally better despite the fact that we have a chapter set in his exact time period where he'll either be the helper or main antagonist
>>
>>135941298
We already have Galahad confirmed as Mash's spirit.
>>
>>135941194
Nasu's the biggest Gilfag of all though.

>>135941240
That was written by Nasu. If you have a problem with Gil being the so-called "strongest", you'll have to take it up with him.
>>
>>135941028
Nasu's philosophy is shit, anon. Only his power level Chuuni shit is interesting.
>>
>Nasu will use original character from the present/future like EMIYA to fill Grand Servants position with no proper legendary character available
>>
>>135941346
Yeah but there will be a twist and he will come in person as the true Saber, it's obvious.
There is literally no other choice, Galahad is the best knight ever confirmed by God and everyone who knew him
>>
>>135941382
Grand Saber is voiced by Kawasumi Ayako, Saber's voice actress.

So unless you're saying that Galahad was a girl and sounded exactly like Saber, this sounds unlikely.
>>
>>135941298
>Solomon is literally the only choice for a definitive Caster.
Merlin
Morgan Le Fey
Christ

>Saber should be Galahad
Every decent candidate for a Grand Saber has been mined already.
>>
I'm still wondering what the hell Emiya Alter and Cu Chulainn Alter and so on are going to turn out to be.
>>
>>135941382
Garden of Avalon however wanks Saber hard.
Also Takeuchi wouldn't have it any other way other than Saber to be Grand Saber.
>>
>>135941476
Possibly the goofy Prisma designs as Berserkers
>>
>>135941028
Fuck character depth and pseudo-philosophy. Type-Moon only wants the DBZ audience now.
>>
>>135941459
>Merlin
Merlin's still alive and is Fou-kun and Dr. Roman
>>
>>135941334
Gil will just pull Solomon's ring out of GoB. Presto.
>>
Or Grand Saber will be Archangel Michael, and for a not-so-surprise we will have Grand Avenger Lucifer
>>
>>135941528
The Prisma designs are "blackened" servants, not Alters.
>>
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>>135941028
Why can't there be room for both? Let the powerlevel fags have their Solomon circlejerks. We can discuss Heroes of Justice in the next thread.
>>
>>135941334
>the helper or main antagonist
100 percent helper, Nasu try to whitewash this guy to the point that you can called him one of the main good guy of the series already.

A-U-O cast-off
>>
>>135941459
Without talking about the Christ, you really think Merlin or Morgan approach Solomon.
Guy is a legendary kings who commanded an army of demon, not a glorified babysitter or jealous bitch.
>>
>>135941558
Wasn't Uriel the main fighter of the Heavenly Host? Or Raphael?
>>
>>135940149
Herakles was someone who was one three places at once.
As contelattion.
as god
and in the underground.
Plus he is the only one without a proper backstory.
>>
>>135941607
Nah. Uriel is the guy who killed the kids in Egypt (according to some people, there's at least 4 angels who have been said to have done that shit).
Strongest Angel is definitely Metatron, though.
>>
>>135941587
He was cruel and ruthless in F/SN but never outright evil. People seem to forget how he was in Fate route.
>>
>>135941163
>>135941354
Agreed, it was shit, but it's what made Shirou, Archer, Kotomine and the rest memorable. Now you only have guys that are only worth mentioning because they're powerful.
>>
>>135941539
But one day he won't be.
>>
>>135941635
>Metatron
He'll never be adapted as a servant unfortunately
>>
>>135941644
He was a pretty bland final boss in FATE
>>
>>135941459
>Every decent candidate for a Grand Saber has been mined already.
Musashi ,,greatest´´ swordsman in history?
>>
>>135941607
While there's no "official" mention of who is the Heaven General, I think it's Michael who is most often depicted as wielding a sword.
>>
>>135941354
I'll let you finish, but Nasu's deft exploration of religious philosophies and psychological concepts such as multiple personalities; the anima and animus; the nature of sin; life, death and reincarnation; and the paradoxical nature of the Taiji blew me away.

Attacking it is an insane act of vanity.
>>
>>135941730
He's more justifiable than the other Divine Spirits, since he was once Enoch.
>>
>>135941644
Nasu also retconned SN Gil to say that he was to some extent corrupted by the grail, AND he was disgusted with modern society, so that's not how he "really" is.
>>
>>135941755
Well Metatron's a scribe, right? The only thing Enoch could be summoned as would be Caster and that spot's taken
>>
>>135941599
>you really think Merlin or Morgan approach Solomon.
How much has actual myth used as the basis for a heroic spirit's ablities?
How much of Gil's backstory suggests shit like GoB or Enuma Elish?
>>
>>135941574
It's not about the threads but what TM has been busy milking these days.
>>
>>135941766
Well, yeah. Nigga had to hang around ten years. And then Kotomine paired him up with Shinji. I'd go genocidal too.
>>
>>135941766
When was this retconned?
>>
>>135941747
How? Because his sword is Glorious Superior Nippon Steel Folded Thousands Times, Gaijin Go Home?
>>
>>135941805
NOo him, but it's a matter of who works better as Grand Servant figure, and that's Solomon for sure.
>>
>>135941815
Hanging around Kirei would be fun, though.
>>135941850
>>135941747
I would've liked Sasaki Kojiro to come back as something else than an Assassin. Will never happen, unfortunately
>>
>>135941850
No because his technique was legandary.
He is a sword saint or kensai
>>
>>135941829
Multiple times

After Hollow he said kid Gil is the real Gil
After Zero he said Gil stuck around for ten years and got disgusted with society

Can't remember where the thing about him being corrupted was, but I do distinctly remember it being said that Gil himself said he managed to resist the corruption but was wrong.
>>
>>135941754
You know what else will blow you away? Motherfucking Solomon and his awesome magic.
>>
>>135941927
Sasaki Kojiro's Tsubame Gaeshi is also legendary technique. Look what we have.

That's right, Savior of France
>>
>>135942001
Kojiro was on a servant's level with pure skill alone, he didn't even have a noble phantasm. The dude was a monster
>>
>>135941972
The difference between Kid Gil and Gil is that Kid Gil is how he was before the events of his myth happened. I'd like to see some sources on "The grail didn't corrupt him was retconned".
>>
>>135942078
Why does Nasu hate him?
>>
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>>135942105
I don't think he does, he's just retarded and wants to keep wanking Gil and Seibah
>>
>>135941334

Yeah, he wanked him so hard he always got his ass kicked.
>>
>>135942001
>Gets killed twice so far in Kamen Rider Ghost
>>
Ok, guys.
Grand Assassin will be The Black Plague. Servant will look a Plague Doctor but underneath the uniform is just concentrated disease.
>>
What if grand ruler and grand avenger?
>>
>>135941882

Nope. Most people don't give a fuck about Salomon. Merlin is much more known.
>>
>>135941754
Whoa, calm down, If I make you feel offended then my bad, sorry did not intend to make you feel that way, anon.
>>
>>135942141
>Bitchu Aoe
>Isn't it obvious
Nasu you cheeky cunt.
>>
>>135942001
What´s your point?
Sasaki is inferior too musashi everbody knows that.
But Sasaki is still a bro.
>>
>>135942216
Go read Strange Fake
Or look up Pale Rider on the wiki
>>
Do all of you know Japanese or how do you catch the plot from Grand Order?
>>
>>135942222
>grand ruler
Gilgamesh
>grand saver
Christ

No grand Avenger though
>>
>>135942231
>Merlin is much more known.

And who fucking cares? It seems you can't get what I and that anon wrote.
>>
>>135941982
>Motherfucking Solomon and his awesome magic.
Solomon should be the epitome of a summoner, not a Caster.
He sealed away a gorillion demons in (Arabic) myth, and managed to buy all the arcane knowledge in the world with his gorillion shekels.
If anything, he should be a slightly weaker Gil who summons demons instead of swords.
>>
>>135942291
Have you been baiting all thread?
>>
>>135942252
Are you going biblical now?
Noah as Grand Rider. Gonna fucking ram you with his Ark and throw animal poop at you.
>>
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>>135942233
>>
>>135942359
Flooding the world while surfing on his ark. Perfect.
>>
>>135942326
He can summon demons though, 72 demon kings, each with the power of a top-tier Servant. He just couldn't care less to do this shit.
>>
>>135942260
I know Japanese. The stupid fucker arguing with me doesn't, and the retarded fan translator who made up a load of bullshit doesn't, which results in everyone talking out of their asses. Refer to >>135940969

It's infuriating.
>>
>>135942291
Grand Avenger Satan, or real Angra Mainyu
>>
>>135940086
The first example is "I don't lose" and the second is "I have never been laughed at". The former refers clearly to a fact he claims about himself and the latter can be about an event that happens to him i.e. being laughed at hence the われる. When 事 refers to an event it can be taken as a reference to occurrence of said event hence "presently no occurrence of xxx". Translate enough things and you'll find plenty of authors who like to be screwy with usage and context is the deciding factor. However, I'll concede that the line can be interpreted as "No human will ever summon me" since I didn't consider it from the fact angle.

Also, doesn't the translation for the second one there strike you as a little bit odd? Did he mean to type "at" or was he declaring the lack of occurrences?

>indicates the thing never happened before in the past, does not indicate that it's impossible
This is Nasu we're talking about. He sets up precedents(or lack of) just to take them down with his exceptions.

>>135942216
Aren't these grand classes supposed to be human at some point? Would Cain be a qualifier to that position, first murderer after all.
>>
>>135942411
Oh, great. Just win the HGW while he's at it.
>>
>>135942305

Even Semiramis would work better than Salomon. She killed gods and destroyed countries.
>>
>>135942454
He's not a participant of a HGW.
>>
>>135942411
>He just couldn't care less to do this shit.
Sounds familiar.
I used to think that Gil was designed from a combination of Solomon and Gilgamesh's myths, but I figured I was giving Nasu too much credit.
Solomon was known for his wealth, wisdom, and plethora of demons. He wasn't a god-tier sorcerer like Merlin.
>>
>>135942443
>I know Japanese better than the stupid Japs wahhh

fuck off shitposter
>>
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>>135940247
maybe he's kind of Commie but he knows his shit
>>
Doesn't solomon know spacetime alteration magic? Or have I been reading too much magi with their flashback arc
>>
Grand Ruler, the internet white knight, embodiment of 4chan.
>>
>>135942443
boards.4chan.org/int/thread/53380289#p53383613
>>
>>135942749
>4chan.
>white knight,
>Not a constipated contrarian.
>>
>>135942624
Talking of mahoyo. I just read the 12th chapter recently(in French) and I'm still somewhat confused as to why the CG didn't do anything to Aoko. They go after Magic users because unlike magecraft it isn't from Earth but then she uses it and seemingly the CG just backs off.
>>135942793
You should learn how to use 4chan, you can link between boards.
>>
>>135942443
wrong, dumbass
>>>/int/53383613
>>
>>135926329
>Enuma Elish destroys worlds
secondary master race
>>
I don't know what's going on in this thread.

What do I even read after Tsukihime / Fate VNs to familiarize myself with all this stuff? Or is it all untranslated content?
>>
>>135942822
Grand Ruler would be Tumblr's SJW
>>
>>135942916
Exactly.
>>
>>135942909
This thread is mostly Grand Order stuff, which has partial translations on Beasts Lair.
>>
I'm just waiting for F/GO to reveal the remaining Counter Guardians as it is impossible to think they are not going to show up with all the shit going on.
>>
>>135941354
It's the thing that makes him stand out, otherwise Fate would be as dumb as JoJo
>>
>>135943012
which are all bullshit because the translator can't understand basic Japanese grammar

>>135940969
>>135942897
>>
>>135942749
>embodiment of 4chan
>not Heroic Spirit Anonymous
>the collective sum of all anons, with the supreme personal skill 'Endless Arguing' EX, preventing it from doing anything since the voices inside his head prevent him from doing anything productive
>>
Who would make a better Grand Rider

Adam (Given control of creatures in the garden so he could easily ride and control any divine beast)
or
Noah (Created and road the only boat that survive the destruction of humanity and saved the lives of every non-human living creature)
>>
>>135942909
Tsukihime, Fate, Mahoyo(1/3 translated) and Kara no Kyoukai are the base.

For Tsukihime side of the things, there's Kagetsu Tohya and Melty Blood(both translated), that expand on it.

For Fate, there is Hollow Ataraxia (direct sequel) and Zero (not actually prequel but consider it that). Then there is Extra (translated) and Extra CCC(not translated) and Grand Order (part translated) which all majorly expand on that side of the setting if it interests you. That side is also what this thread is about.

There is also side stuff like Notes and Tsuki no Sango which expands on the setting. There are also Material books which have notes on stuff used in their respective works, often significant ones.
>>
>>135943257
Rider Nero on the Beast of Revelation.
>>
>>135943257
Neither.
Lu Bu.
>>
>>135943355
pls
Lu Bu got his shit beaten in Fate/Extra. No way he's the best Rider.
>>
>>135939117
That's the proof that he is evil.
>>
>>135943403
Something like how Heracles will go better as Archer since he will be able to use Nine Lives. Lu Bu as Rider will have his Red Hare.

But he won't be Grand Class, that's just bullshit
>>
>>135942863
Humanity is from Earth. True Magic is part of humanity's deal and purpose. The sorcerers are supposed to be interested in humanity's survival before Earth, but so far two of the three we have seen seem pretty reasonable and would care for the world as well. CGs should protect the sorcerers if anything.

The Fifth in particular is pretty much the only magic that seems really dangerous to the world. If you combine stuff from Mahoyo and Notes, you might come to the conclusion that there would logically be Sixth Magic eventually (there were only meant to be three to begin with), which would have apocalyptic nature, since "humanity has done everything it was meant for, so the last thing to do would be... yeah".
>>
>>135926329
Why casters in fate are evil bastards. Is there are good castors besides maniacs and murderers?
>>
>>135943845
Yes
>>
>>135943590
>like how Heracles will go better as Archer since he will be able to use Nine Lives.
Not realy the reason.
>Lu Bu as Rider will have his Red Hare.
Isn´t it his own heroic spirit?
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>>135943686
But is there a reason why the CG just let her do it? He was with her all the way as she was starting to use it. He even knows why she wants to use it and berates her for it.
>>
>>135944544
Because when she uses it reasonably it´s not a big deal.
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>>135945010
There is nothing reasonable about sending a dead person's death to the future and fucking up the universe's order in doing it.
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>>135945436
>and fucking up the universe's order in doing it.
Didn´t fuck it more up than the avarage human is fucking up the universe.
>>
We only have to guess who might going to be the Grand Archer, Lancer, Rider, Assassin, Berserker

GSaber - King Arthur (either Male Arthur or just Unsealed Excalibur)

GCaster - King Salomón
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>>135946719
>male

We know Grand Saber is voiced by Kawasumi Ayako, so no, it won't be a dude.
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>>135926329
Altrouges dog can kill servants. Discuss.
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So with all of this powercreep bullshit does it mean that Zelretch it's just a mere "Ok" magus now?
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>>135946997
There's nothing to discuss really.
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>>135947121
He is grand rider. Riding on gap between dimensions and doesn't afraid of anything.
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>>135946814
Then it will just be Full Powered, Avalon Altria with Unsealed Excalibur

Okay then

Remember that some GS might be still alive

Like Scathach... Scathach as Grand Lancer it's plausible, that is if there's No Longinus or Gugnir
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>>135947121
Yes
Salomón out classes him...
He is just an observer after all
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>>135947121
Dude solo'd Crimson Moon of all people and I'm pretty sure that not even Solomon and Gil can do that much.
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>>135947121
He's on par with Solomon if he corresponds to one of the Six Sisters in Notes.
Six Sisters = Grand Classes
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