>>135573908 and on the topic of owari the episode where they talk for a whole episode at the shrine was bad yes gaen always takes too long to talk imo then they transition to shinobu and monkey girl for the rest
what was said, could have been said in 1/8 the time
Monogatari is a masterpiece in and the weakest parts of it are only 7/10 at worst. If you have ADHD and can't stand anime that focuses on entertaining character interactions instead of shounen action scenes every second you might have a problem with it though.
>>135573568 >Remember when Araragi wasn't a hopeless idiot being talked down to by everyone all the time? Not really, no.
Who talks down to him? Gaen, who does that to everyone. Ougi, who is some sort of manifestation of the psychological shit he has to work out (whether she's part of the problem or the solution remains to be seen) and Hanekawa, who can see he's being played but, for whatever reason, can't say anything explicit yet.
>Remember when he was an alpha harem protag who literally GF'd the first girl he met? No, I remember when Araragi was a vaguely believable person who was asked out by someone he got along well with.
Shinobu mail was the worst Monogatari thing I have seen I believe. Even Nise and its outrageous fan service was more entertaining. Just for that Owari isn't worth putting on the same list as the other shows. Fuck Gaen.
>>135581231 There was one episode that dealt with the main story, where it answered why Araragi became an edgy faggot. The rest was the Sodachi show- which was pretty interesting in its own right and Marina Inoue did a hell of a job selling the character. However, it doesn't have the far-reaching consequences and information of Shinobu Mail, which also let up on everyone being so super fucking serious all the time even though the situation was more dire.
Fucking kek. Yeah, they should let the explanation of things to the characters that fight each other and leave 90% of the logic behind like in shonenshit. Get the fuck out. Fact of the matter is that you guys suffer of ADD and that you can't follow when someone talks for more than 2 minutes. Go back to watching One Punch Man. Monogatari is for people who likes story telling, not shitty meaningless combats and ass pull super powers.
Gaen is best girl and best onee-chan of the season. Deal with it, bitch.
>>135581602 Then what you mean is not investment in the characters but investment on the "main plot". The actual amount of Sodachi in Owari 1 is around 2 full episodes out of 7, not much more than Gaen in Owari 2 comparatively, and there was also Seishirou. Not to mention you can't say that of Tsuki, in which Tadatsuru is barely present.
>>135581921 Why is she a turd? Because she knows more than the MC in which you self insert hard into? You wish the be the ultimate star of your own show? Hilarious. You're hilarious and pathetic at the same damn time.
>>135582114 Tsuki was also good, but it was still more of a setup arc. Shinobu Mail was a lynchpin arc that explains a bunch of mysteries from the rest of the series and then throws in even more information about the characters. Plus, Seishirou has been known as an important figure in Shinobu's past since Kizu while Sodachi was shoehorned in. Sodachi's arcs didn't make me want to re-examine the entire series to see how the information I got there fit in with everything else while Shinobu Mail did.
>>135582346 She doesn't even talk down people you dumb shit. Most of the time, she explains or give additional information to the MC. You still didn't explain why is she a "turd".
>>135582326 You talk like she's been used countless times already. The story telling is already very good without her. Her purpose is to fill the holes in the story with additional missing information. And how is she shitty? She hasn't done anything wrong and she's a great onee-sama.
>>135574497 I find Hachikuji horrendous, glad she's fucking gone. Also I'm tired of Araragi thinking only with his dick. He's 18 not 13. They should have make Kaiki or Oshino the MC; the only characters along Suruga I don't want to punch.
>>135582467 So you're just agreeing with me that you're invested in the plot and not in the characters particularly.
I found Owari 1 much better because it was focused on people's problems like many monogatari arcs, and I can accept new characters even if late in the game if they are interesting, while Owari 2 was mostly about filling the plot, which was mostly done through info dumps this time.
>>135582656 If I liked femdom (which I do), I'd notice the talking down part, so I don't get your point. I think you're too busy being a little bitch and taking offense from a great girl like Gaen having more information than the character in which you self insert into.
>>135582696 These people just seem to be baiting, but it's true that Gaen monologuing about the past is a lazy way to dump exposition. She's fine when she's setting up duels and challenging the other characters with tough questions, etc.
>>135582467 >Sodachi's arcs didn't make me want to re-examine the entire series to see how the information I got there fit in with everything else while Shinobu Mail did. And how is that bad, exactly? You'd rather them leave you in the dark the entire time? I find it good that now we know what the fuck happened to Araragi during the entire Tsubasa Tiger arc and why he wasn't there to help Tsubasa with her problems. It's interesting because, you know, it's part of the main plot. Whereas Sodachi seems like a fucking filler arc to me.
>>135583129 Sorry but that's the only conclusion I get from someone hating on a character because she's an strong onee-san figure that knows a lot and that, apparently, talks down to people. Clearly insecurity.
>>135583138 Because Gaen was preparing a secondary plan in case Araragi failed. She was going to send a vampire hunter to take on a vampire using the fact Oshino saved Episode's life in Kizumonogatari as leverage to get him to take the job.
>>135582780 There was one info dump and it was bad. However, the high points were much higher than anything in Owari 1 and outside the ifo dump the pacing is a hell of a lot better with the good old banter that so many people know and love the series for making a comeback after being gone for six episodes.
Being invested in the main plot = being invested in the characters since the main plot is just about their personal growth. That's the only thing to get invested in. Nobody was on the edge of their seat to find out if Seishirou was going to get vanquished, they were on the edge of their seats to see what he meant to Shinobu and how his appearance would impact her relationship with Araragi.
>>135583657 But you still didn't explain why she was a turd. All you do is keep repeating "turd" so you're not any better than me. At least I have the decency to explain why you're so insecure, but you can't explain for shit. No wonder you don't like Gaen. Top kaka.
>>135583787 the fact you're getting so awfully defensive over the shittiest oneesama of any season she appears in just exposes you as a buttblasted femdomfag who has no better arguments than some armchair psychology about "insecurity" of the people who call you out for your bullshit
>make a lesbian character >then make all her interactions be centered around male MC >make her many times tease him how much she wants to fuck him >don't get any gf as a token lesbian >isn't shown to be attracted to more girls than one loli and sempai with so many cute girls around >her only role is to be fanservice joke for male MC >is a complete fujoshi Seriously why Nishio wrote Kanbaru as a lesbian?
Wouldn't it be more normal to make her bisexual as her coming out gone?
>>135583736 Well, she knows her place. It's not like she goes around randomly and spilling out knowledge to then boast off about it. She's thereonly when Araragi needs her and when she's asked about it, she tells them she knows everything (which is, up until this point, true). I see nothing wrong with that and knowledge is power so yes, she's strong.
>>135583996 >turd turd turd turd And your argument is better? Fuck outta here. >shittiest oneesama Fuck you, I'm done with you. Tired of arguing with an insecure self insert faggot.
>>135583680 >the high points were much higher than anything in Owari 1 That's debatable, for me the highest point was Lost part 2.
>Being invested in the main plot = being invested in the characters since the main plot is just about their personal growth. The "main plot" I meant the supernatural/shinobu plot. Owari 1 is part of the main plot as well, including being focused on the main antagonist and her relationship with both the Araragi and Hanekawa, and the main character background and part of his development. And while Sodachi wasn't properly foreshadowed, she is a part of the story as well since Nisio added her.
>they were on the edge of their seats to see what he meant to Shinobu and how his appearance would impact her relationship with Araragi. You're really overselling this arc.
Regardless, for me being informative isn't the same as being good. Just reading a summary/bio could provide all these points, but it wouldn't entertain me as much.
>>135584339 >focused on the main antagonist and her relationship It was setting it up, which is fine, but still inferior to dramatic revelations about a previously established relationship.
If you're more interested in new characters than the "it's complicated" between Araragi, Senjougahara, Hanekawa, Shinobu, and Kanbaru then I don't see how you can say you're invested in the characters.
>Just reading a summary/bio could provide all these points Except I literally read summaries of both arcs years before they were animated and Owari 2 was the one that stuck out as woefully inadequate because the meat was in the small, nuances and debatable points. Whereas Ougi's relationship with Araragi is literally perfectly summed up as: Ougi is Araragi's self-criticism. What exactly that looks like is interesting, but it doesn't provoke the same level of thought as knowing that Araragi copied the rejection Shinobu gave to Seishirou to use on Hanekawa.
>>135586684 Sometime it does require 10 minutes to explain an in-depth backstory and her information are most of the time very informative. Like I said, if you don't want in-depth story telling, go watch One Punch Man or something. This show is not for you kids.
It's easily the best season, but a lot of people get used to the visual style(which is less stylish after Bake) and dialog afterwards which makes them love SS the most, especially after watching the last arc which is actually as good as Bake and the highlight of the series for a lot of people
also if you watch for the ecchiness, everyone-wanting-MC's-dick harem, and characters being a lot more exaggerated(e.g. Araragi being an incest pedo pervert), you'll like the rest of the series more
So I blame Nishio on shitty bait writing her as lesbian where he doesn't understand the meaning of it, similiar like many tags on various hentai japanese or western sites use hetero or group sex or threesome content as "yuri/lesbian" tagged too...
Or more likely wanting to play with conversion fetish where a lesbian becomes bi cause harem MC is a guy trope going.
>>135574219 >>didn't finish the most interesting one so far i hope you don't mean owari. unless your idea of interesting is being talked at by gaen for two episodes and listening to overdramatic monologues/dialogues full of just exposition for the rest of shinobu mail
>>135586998 God damn it every time someone tries to discuss monogatari it just reminds me how absolutely retarded everyone is. I rather you faggots just argue about best girl or some shit. It's not like you idiots even pay attention to the show anyway.
They're not very entertaining a lot of the time though. The voice cast sounds board out of its skull most of the time and like they're just trying to grind through their monologues and shit, get their pay and get the latest dry season over with. It's a no effort cash cow show top to bottom
That's what Monogatari fans do. It seems like all the trolls, douchebags and shitposters love it the most which kind of makes sense. I've certainly never seen anybody that isn't a dumb teenager or douchebag advocate for this franchise at length.
You've never seen the commentaries or atogari have you? It's pretty obvious they enjoy their roles.
I especially like how Hanekawa is really the behind the scenes onee-san for pretty much everyone. I loved how in one short story even when Ougi is dissing Hanekawa left and right, she admits she wants her to smile her way just once, but won't get it because they always fight. People really go gay for Cat sometimes
>>135591907 Some people are upset that Monogatari has moved away from how Bakemonogatari was presented and cannot come to terms with the fact that as the books/seasons go further and further on, the magic they felt watching Bakemonogatari is getting more and more diluted.
>>135592005 Bake will always be one of the best, but the monogatari series has been overall improving as the years go by. Disregarding whatever novel they happen to be adapting, Shaft has just gotten so fucking good at this shit
the loli sodachi mystery with the fucking blank letter being dumb as shit, or Sodachi herself being a retarded character pic related with overly dramatic bullshit? or do you mean the entire second arc which was utter garbage and easily the worst in the series with out of character Kanbaru/haremshit pandering, more idiotic otaku comedy and "2deep4u" vague sentences from the swaglord
You really need to be extra dumb to believe Bake, which is by far the best in the series, is anywhere close to being worse than fucking Owari get some taste holy shit
As someone who marathoned all of it in time when Owari was over, I thought the first 6 episodes were really poor. The rest of the episodes I enjoyed. Hana was probably my least favourite and not engaging at all. Nise pacing and ridiculous amount of fanservice was quite annoying too. Glad I finally got into the series as I really enjoyed all the other seasons.
>>135594928 Funnily enough, not even the author liked Nise all that much. He really just wrote for shits n giggles... and was really horny (probably), which explains the more fetish scenes. It was decent fap material at least.
>>135594928 I agree Nise struggled under the weight of its fanservice. This produced some memorable scenes but it also slowed the story to a crawl in an arc that wasn't all that interesting to begin with.
>>135584147 If I remember correctly, when she first tells araragi, she just uses the word yuri. I'm not sure if yuri has the connotation of"exclusively lesbian" or if it was more like she said "I'm into girls" without necessarily excluding guys.
>>135594084 so instead of just simply saying that wasn't you and explaining why Owari isn't garbage, you're calling someone an idiot and calling it impressive that he assumed the one replying to him was the one he replied to which happens every fucking minute on 4chan because there's no way to know since it's an anonymous imageboard, you complete fucking retard
this is the most blatant way to change a subject I've ever seen here, somewhat pathetic too Is it that hard to admit you have no idea what you're talking about?
>>135595187 >If I remember correctly, when she first tells araragi, she just uses the word yuri She first says "lesbian", then "yuri", and Araragi says "That's the same thing". Going by the subs of course
>>135595041 >>135595242 there's a difference between "subtle" visual fanservice while the storyline moves forward(you know, camera being focused on arousing things and all that) and having scenes dedicated solely for fanservice that Nise is plagued with
>>135595640 Your subtle fanservice is literal shit. If you want to put it into your work fucking own it. Just like every single time it's used in the entire series. Not some cheap shitty up-skirt shot that has no reason for existing.
There is nothing with even an entire scene of fanservice other than prudes like you refusing to enjoy it because of psuedo-intellectual reasons trying to justify your built in cultural prejudices that say art and sex can't exist at the same time.
>>135595876 >There is nothing with even an entire scene of fanservice other than prudes like you refusing to enjoy it because of psuedo-intellectual reasons trying to justify your built in cultural prejudices that say art and sex can't exist at the same time.
>>135584147 Because nothing Kanbaru says should ever be taken at face value, and aside from the direct possibility that she's fucking with Araragi when she says stuff, there's also just the basic fact that she's a ridiculously horny teenage girl who doesn't know what the fuck she is or wants.
>>135595151 I found the fanservice in Monogatari much hotter than normal porn, I think it's because they actually build up interactions with the characters first. It's like emotional foreplay. I don't actually fap to the show itself, but it sure as hell makes me go find a good doujin after finishing one of those scenes.
>>135592297 I can't rank them in order, it's too hard, so I'll do this:
>Best girl to pump and dump Snake
>Best casual short/mid term girlfriend Monkey
>Best wife Cat
>Best girl to devote eternity to in a relationship that is both more and less than love and romance Bat
>>135597267 I'm sure she could, and she'd definitely be the most fun to be with, and probably the best in bed too.
I just find Hanekawa more suitable as somebody to settle down with. That's entirely from my own perspective where I think that she and I would match well, and she's probably not right for most anons, and sure as hell not right for Araragi.
>>135597213 by being sexually overexaggerated scenes about doing mundane shit irrelevant to the storyline you could remove all of those scenes and you wouldn't miss anything
maybe the towel scene had some relationship development I don't remember, but for every case like that there's Crab's house scene in the first arc as an example skin is showing, but the actual plot doesn't stop to make an ecchi scene out of it, it's fucking obnoxious
>>135598082 You would miss a ton of shit. Monogatari deals with characterization by showing not telling. Just because there is skin on the screen does not mean there is nothing else. The fact is it's you who can't understand this.
>>135598082 Even I admit that this is sort of a stretch, but I feel like the show purposely uses the ecchi stuff to get you attached to the characters.
It also fits with the overall impression I have that the whole purpose of Monogatari is to get you to see things as Araragi perceives them. He can't separate the straight plot stuff out from his desires to fuck the girls, and so by mixing plot and ecchi it gets the viewer to feel the same way.
>>135598381 >It also fits with the overall impression I have that the whole purpose of Monogatari is to get you to see things as Araragi perceives them. He can't separate the straight plot stuff out from his desires to fuck the girls, and so by mixing plot and ecchi it gets the viewer to feel the same way. that means he sees Kanbaru as walking estrogen
>>135599771 >and infinite stratos sells way more than my dick >how is that relevant to anything there's nothing wrong with the sexualization of the girls unless you're on some r9k trip right now. The lewdness doesn't detract from anything, in fact it makes it more fun. What is your problem? Go watch mushishi if it's so superior
>>135599771 >go on and prove me wrong with an example Fine. That towel scene you keep harping on about. It shows just how much Karen trusts Koyomi, how much he cares about her and is willing to put up with her shit. But all you got out of it is a sweaty girl being rubbed with a towel. And who's fault is that?
>>135599859 >The lewdness doesn't detract from anything except it does exactly that, and blatantly >>135595640 >there's a difference between "subtle" visual fanservice while the storyline moves forward(you know, camera being focused on arousing things and all that) and having scenes dedicated solely for fanservice that Nise is plagued with
sure the point of your post it >I like the out of place fanservice because I like fanservice fine whatever, it still makes monogatari shittier than it should be
>>135599874 >maybe the towel scene had some relationship development I don't remember, but for every case like that there's Crab's house scene in the first arc as an example skin is showing, but the actual plot doesn't stop to make an ecchi scene out of it, it's fucking obnoxious so your post >>135598261 was actually pretentious dogshit as this scene can be exactly as I said, not ecchi pandering nonsense
>>135600329 Nise is largely about Ragi playing with his sisters. There are not-so-hidden incestual feelings between them, so of course there'll be fanservice. Damn, you must not watch much anime at all if you consider that gratuitous. You're acting like it's Queen's Blade for fucks sake
>>135600329 What the fuck are you talking about your retard? The fucking plot is character development. The fucking plot is Karen is too sick to go after Kaiki. The plot is Araragi is mad that Kaiki has hurt his sister. You are absolutely fucking retarded. Like I fucking said >>135596125
>>135601091 for some reason I thought you were >>135598381, but you being the underage newfag instead who talks like your usual underage newfag and thinks Monogatari is deep like your usual underage newfag explains everything
and holy shit do you continue being fucking stupid, I don't know where to start
where did I ever ask what is plot where did I ever say Monogatari doesn't have plot
since when does having pointless pandering ecchi scenes remove plot from a series which you're implying by listing plot points in Nise for no fucking reason whatsoever?
>It shows just how much Karen trusts Koyomi, how much he cares about her and is willing to put up with her shit. that doesn't require the scene to be ecchi retardation that it is to tell that, even your undeveloped brain should comprehend that
I'm saying it could've been a scene similar to Bake's first episode, where there's a half naked girl but characters still behave believably enough not moaning like she's getting drilled with screen full of meat for minutes, it's dumb, out of place and obnoxious it's a scene which is mostly pointless pandering with some character development as opposed to being mostly character development with some fanservice like the ep1 example, but you actually made yourself believe it's deep how stupid you are
Well, I just finished marathoning the entire Monogatari series over a period of a few days. What a ride. Only a few mediocre parts, on the whole it was pretty damn sublime.
So, I hate to be that guy, but is there going to be more? It feels like it really isn't done yet. There's been some character progression but there's still easily room for another couple of seasons. Also, who/what is Ougi? Did I miss something? I've been kind of thinking she's a product of Araragi's brain, but she does seem to act upon the world even when he isn't around.
>>135603722 There is still Kizumonogatari movies (prequel about Araragi becoming a vampire), Koyomimonogatari (shorts SoL episodes), Owarimonogatari third book and Zokuowarimonogatari to close the story.
After that there are some side stories, like Sodachi in her new school but those aren't guaranteed to be adapted.
Why do people think Snake's body is attractive? She has none of the charm of a lithe loli, but none of the perks of a curvatious titty monster either. She's the worst of both worlds. Just mediocre. ALL the other girls have better bodies.
Is it weird I enjoy Bake the least? I'm rewatching the entire series in preparation for kizu and it felt too formulaic and rushed compared to the others. I know it's mainly an introduction into characters but because the story acrs are just used as transitions to bigger plotlines none of them feel impactful to me
>>135573264 You're just a pleb, Owari is by a considerable margin the best installment of the series since Bake. It recaptures the tone and style of the original in a way none of the others have since. Ougi Formula could have almost been a Bake arc.
>>135589561 Anyone who isn't retarded beyond measure knows that Bake was the height of the series by leaps and bounds, that isn't even up for debate. It was a masterpiece of integrating dialogue, story, and animation to create a package that was more than the sum of it's parts, which is the ideal goal for animation. The only reason Nisio likes the other two more is because he unironically thinks his silly writing is deep.
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