Why was everyone acting like such a retard in this route? Sakura doesn't tell about her situation, Shirou blinds himself to what's going on, Rin's tsun is at it's worse, Iiya keeps vital information to herself despite there being some very good times to spill the beans. What the fuck is this route? Rider's character is even more boring because she really is nothing but a big boobed pity fanatic for Sakura and it's not even implied those two are close.
Maybe because the world is going to hell in a handbasket? Shirou blinds himself as a defense mechanism to avoid facing his own tremendous internal hypocrisy. Sakura doesn't talk about her situation because she doesn't want to ruin her life with her beloved. Rin has to lock down her heart because her duties as a magus are supposed to come foremost over her emotions. Illyasviel never wanted things to come to this, and was hiding behind Berserker for nine days anyway.
>Rin has to lock down her heart because her duties as a magus are supposed to come foremost
The thing is that she broke that code many,many times in the first two routes yet all of sudden she's alot more hard laced in this route for the sake of onflict? I don't understand.
Because it wasn't easy for her to admit her father was a piece of shit. HF comes and slaps Shirou and Rin that the ideals Kiritsugu and Tokiomi fed them and expected them to follow destroyed the lives of their sisters (Illya and Sakura).
Rin is faced with her family skeletons and she can't make convenient bad guys anymore, like Kirei. Same for Shirou. That's why HF is so good because it destroys their unrealistic illusions and fantasies with a dose of sour bitter reality and make them really struggle for it.
Rin goes insane as Kirei hinted, Shirou becomes Kiritsugu and will eliminate her and Illya. It's a bad end, but yes it's all thematic.
HF theme is more like "family", even if romance and ideals play a big role, the focus is entirely on the families. Sakura is Shirou's romantic partner but she is more than just a GF, she's more like a wife, she acted as his family for a year now.
The fact the Servants are eaten so early or are 'darkened' is also symbolic, it means that ideals and past glories can't exist when facing the real world. The True Assassin appearance vs Fake One (beyond the fact Kojiro is better than Hassan as a character, pay attention to the label) and the discovery of the Real Grail, all is a wake up call for Shirou and Rin. This is the real nature of the world.
Fate and UBW deal more with ideals. HF brings them to struggle against reality.
I hate this route because the servants who all get eaten by the shadow can never rest in peace. Especially Saber, She's alive thus when she gets eaten that means she can never die for real and will be agony and pain for eternity. They better change that in the movie.
One of Tokiomi's proud future ideas was Rin and Sakura fighting to death for the Grail. What Rin did at fucking last was to reject her father completely.
Rin never really struggled against her real magus ideals in other routes, when she did it wasn't about things that contradicted her father's wishes or conflicted with how he envisioned it. Same with Shirou.
In HF both realized those ideals destroyed their lives and families. Many forget Shirou questioned his ideals very early not because of muh Sakura. It was after he was infodumped about Kerry and he discovered Illya's real nature.
>Rin never really struggled against her real magus ideals in other routes
I disagree, UBW had a conflict with her based on following what she wants, and what her father desires. She sees the discrepancies between her father and Shirou's, and grows to question if following the rigid path her father wanted for her is right. I mean she straight up falls in love with a heretic, something her father never would have condoned.
I don't know about that. You have scenes that directly put her in conflict with what she perceives as how a proper magus should be, and what Shirou is and how he learned.
I have to give Ufotable credit for this, because they made it a lot more obvious that she struggles to put up that "perfect" image of herself with that extra scene of her studying as a kid when she and Shirou had that discussion over how he learned magic.
And really you see it throughout the route. She becomes fascinated with Shirou and starts to avoid a lot of the more rigid "logical decisions", like working with Caster, because of him. Deep down she has a strong moral compass, which creates a conflict with being a real mage; Shirou brings that sort of idealism out in her.
Wow, with all the shitposting because of the anime it's been a while since we had an interesting FSN thread, thank you guys
There was a bait thread earlier, it got like 500 post in an hour. It was shitposting at its finest.
To further elaborate, Shirou is a major catalyst for her development in UBW. Because she gets close to him, she really learns some things about herself. I mean she's under the impression that mages need to be tough, rigid, secretive, and willing to fight dirty, yet here comes this guy who's kind, loyal, always honest, and so willing to help that he'll put his life on the line for you. And he's a mage.
It fucked her perceptions and starts to make her question a lot of things. You can see it as early as her fight with him at the school. Honestly like several fights in UBW, Shirou wins not through brute force, but by beating his opponent mentally.
I need to ask this somewhere so i'll just ask here : I'm about to start playing Fate/Extra for the first time. Should i go with Saber Nero for my first playtrough or can i just go with Archer since he's my favorite?
no kidding. Kariya, Tokiomi,Kirsugu and Kirei's bullshit from the last war really fucked over their children. Hmph when you think about it all traces back to Gilgamesch. he's the one who convinced Kirei to abandon morals and just try to be happy even if it means someone has to die. The dude was such a snake in Zero but Kirei was very very happy to buy what he was selling.
Gil did nothing wrong because at the time Tokiomi died Sakura was already with the Matou's.Kiritsugu would have ended the same and Kariya would have still lost. This shit goes back to the making of the Holy grail, the corruption of the grail, and the dumb dads of the 4th war.
>I don't know about that. You have scenes that directly put her in conflict with what she perceives as how a proper magus should be, and what Shirou is and how he learned.
There's no introspection from her side about this or an inner conflict aside of acting very generic and tsundere. Her development in UBW was rushed and trashed.
Yet she rarely reflects over this. The only moment she has about this was when he talked about her dad and we knew she wasn't rigid or scummy because of her reaction to the boundary field, Caster's actions and saving Shirou in the beginning.
She never thought of him or labelled him as heretic to make some actual growth as she did with Sakura.
If she's this cute in UBW, how cute is she going to be in the HF movie?
This very episode showed the conflict between how she should act as a mage and how she wants to act as a person; Archer directly derided her because she continued to trust Shirou instead of going for the more "logical" route of teaming up with Caster. And you can see it in past events as well, particularly the school fight, where she's becomes conflicted due to Shirou's pure willingness to help going against everything she should expect to see from a mage.
Rin as a person is not rigid or scummy, but she's held down by the fact she's essentially expected to be. It wasn't a "smart" choice to heal Shirou, it wasn't a "smart" choice to team up with him, but she's too good of a person deep down to not help, and interacting with Shirou helps her learn that those feelings aren't ones she should hide away.
Rin is developed in UBW, you're simply choosing to deny it. I mean stuff like HA shows the benefits of her being with Shirou; she's happier, more laid back, and not entirely at the whims of following her lineage.
Another point: She saves Shinji. Shinji, a total scumbag worth practically less than dirt, but after coming to understand Shirou and his ideal, she willingly helps save him as well, because despite there being the easier, "logical" path of just Excaliblasting him, she and Shirou both knew it was wrong to just out and out murder him.
Interesting point, this is a distinctive difference between Fate Shirou and UBW Shirou: UBW Shirou still tries to help Shinji despite his actions.
Fate/stay night Realta Nua 2012 openings
Fate/hollow ataraxia 2014 openings
Fate Shirou likely would have tried to save Shinji in that situation too really, Fate Shirou tried to off Shinji because it was the only way he knew how to save all the students who were in danger of dying within minutes. If Shinji's just sitting there and the only one being put at risk to save him is Shirou, he's going to do it.
How much of a faggot one should be to call HF shit?
I hope they expand on HF and add some new original scenes.
I really wouldn't expect that to happen. I mean if anything they're gonna truncate stuff with the movies.
I have no doubt Ufotable will do their best, but movies definitely don't give you as much room to breath as shows.
>there are people who believe this will happen
I'm more worried about NLBW. That legitimately could get fucked up because most of it consists of internal monologue stuff. Real time it's a 10 second fight basically.
And you know like, if they need to save time...
>And you know like, if they need to save time...
I'll be so mad you won't even imagine the rage I'll feel if it gets fucked up.
Heaven's Feel: The third and final route, focused on Shirou's childhood friend Sakura Matou, the dark machinations of her grandfather, and the secrets behind the creation of the Heaven's Feel ritual.
>I still want to be a superhero, but this time I want to be a superhero for sakura.
It's good to know that shirou wanted to protected this smile.
>A route that is hugely dependent on the two before it
>The good servants retire early in a anti-climatic fashion
>The shadow is a boring plot device
>Focuses on the dumbest heroine
>It doesn't get Interesting until the end
Remind me why this trash is good again?
There's nothing in this thread. I guess you have this guy>>118451577 but he is just spouting pretentious crap to fill in the blanks.
>it means that ideals and past glories can't exist when facing the real world.
Is he serious?
I love how she is so happy here. It will make the twist so much better.
Sakura: It's so bright... The light is so bright...
It's so bright that everything looks black...
Everything looks like a dark and shadowy picture.
Everyone looks like thin paper dolls tottering back and forth.
It doesn't really matter whether they exist or not, does it? They're all just worthless scrap paper, after all.
I can't stand to look at them anymore. I guess I'll just have to crumple them up.
Halfway through the story:
Kotomine: You are on the verge of collapse, aren't you? It appears that you are still in there somewhere though, Sakura Matou.
Sakura: Hmm... Ah, that's my name, right? Of course I'm close, Father. I've been broken since the beginning.
Kotomine: Even the elders of the Matou family never really lived that long. They know how to raise their young well, but the training looks too harsh. Look at you... You have no concern for pain.
Sakura: Good point. Grandfather never believed I would last this long. But it was him who didn't last long. Thanks to me...
Kotomine: Are you saying that Zouken Matou is no more? Splendid. Now all that is left is to wait for the Holy Grail to form. However, to do that...
Sakura: You need to remove my consciousness, right? Your wish won't be able to come true if my consciousness remains within the Grail.
Kotomine: Impressive. You are a much quicker study than your old self. It appears that the grace of the Grail even affects intelligence.
Sakura: I really hate when you say things like that. This doesn't have anything to do with the grace of the Grail. Simply put... You're in my way, and I won't stand for it!
*After The Fight*
Sakura: Foolish human... Did you believe you could defeat me? Don't worry though, OK? I'm going to realize your plans in your place.
Sakura 1:Welcome back. It looks like you found everything you were looking for.
Sakura 2:Yeah... But I did get kind of lost on the way back because I was really tired from playing so much. It was nice to have such fresh food though.
Sakura 1: I'm so jealous. I just stayed here in the cellar watching over the cooking fire. But I guess it's OK. Those memories are going to be mine anyway.
Sakura 2: Are you sure? It could be your memories could that end up fusing with me. ...So, are you ready?
Sakura 1: Of course... All that's left is to throw the ingredients on the fire. Then I, the Holy Grail, will be complete. But before that...
Sakura 2: Yes. Before that, let's fight to the death. Since we're both the same, there's really no point for there to be two of us.
Sakura 1: The strongest of I will become the Grail, and then complete the transformation. Then become the host that gives birth to "All the World's Evil".
Sakura 2: So then let's get started, me. This'll be the most fun I'll ever have. Since the person I hate the most...
Sakura 1 & 2: ...is myself, right?
Sakura: ...Soon... Soon I'll be able to get to the outer world.
Heh heh... And then I'll be able to get away from this blinding black light...
Wait for me, Senpai... I'll be reborn soon enough...
Just like when a pupa becomes a butterfly... Even bugs have their time in the sun...
Hmmm, but... Who's Sempai, again?
That's really strange... Who was I waiting for? And what was I trying to do?
I guess it doesn't really matter.
...Soon... Soon... I can get to the outer world. I've wanted to for so long now.
What was your initial impressions of Zouken and what are your thoughts on him now?
Jesus, is this what Sakura's mindset becomes after the grail influence? It sounds like a incoherent,fragmented version of everything about her. I feel lied to. I was told Sakura knew who she was, what she did, why she did it and that it was bad and wore the dark sakura mask as a poor excuse to admonish her self from any responsiblity for the sins she committed.
So the route having servants retire in a lame way is not a bad thing? The Shadow being the most boring plot device imaginable is also nothing? Sakura doing the dumbest things a person could do is acceptable?
Theoretically,zero berserker would look like a female alter because alter came out first. Besides, all grail taints have a black and red theme.
That's not the original design, this is the original design. She even has a visor that comes with the armor.
Shame only Fate has a 1080p rip, UBW and HF look like upscaled 480p.
The site which ripped them even acknowledges that they are shit quality in comparison, but they can't do better right now due to ripping tech.
>post yfw "can you keep up with me" while EMIYA is playing
> So the route having servants retire in a lame way is not a bad thing?
Think about why in not one of the three routes does anyone one win the holy grail war, because the war isn't the focus of the series. Everything is pretty straight forward.
Fate establishes the theme that you're ideals will betray you. Evidence in the back stories of Saber Kiristugu, and Shirou's frustration for how they weren't compensate for their hard work.
UBW, perusing your although they might betray you. Evidence in Shirou's confrontation with Archer, Rin's dreams of archer who was betrayed in spite of becoming his ideal, and her fascination with Shirou, who continues to follow his belief that everyone should be saved, even though he is a magus and magus should be selfish.
HF, abandoning your ideal for something important to you; in this case family. Shirou casts away his dream, that he inherited from his father, of wanting to protect everyone and instead chooses to protect the girl he loves and considers family. The same for Rin she abandons her duty as a magus because when the time came she couldn't kill her sister. Also, Sakura is no longer jealous of the sister who had everything she didn't or fearful that she'll lose Shirou to her.
>The Shadow being the most boring plot device imaginable is also nothing?
This tells me absolutely nothing. What are your complaints about the shadow? As far as I'm concerned it served it's purpose. Although she does want to hurt anyone Sakura unconsciously watches the shadow attack people because she want them to understand her pain.
You accuse the shadow of being arbitrary plot device but, have no complaints w/ "Final Boss Gil" which isn't even that bad.
>Sakura doing the dumbest things a person could do is acceptable?
Which of her actions where dumb? If you give me examples I could explain them to you or I might actually agree with you.
Instead of being so closed minded, it might benefit you try and understand what you're reading and connections other anons make.
You might even discover something you never realized and deepen your understanding of a series you're into. Like >>118451577 , His thought on the symbolism of the blacked servants is pretty interesting.
I forgot most of HF and posts like these help me out.
Most people tend to forget that Heaven's feel was 60% cooking, fate route suffered from it too. Though Heaven's feel is pretty much, a lot of stuff happens at the start and at the end with a whole lot of nothing in the middle. day 8 and on is really when the story starts picking up for it.
Heaven's feel also had penis worms, I know we were supposed to be horrified, but the entire thing was just too funny. Sakura's back story as a whole almost felt like it was trying too hard to make us feel sorry for her. With that said I actually like Sakura in Hollow A, and she's not even my least favorite girl (Rin takes that prize)
Hell the only route that seemed to have decent pacing was UBW.
They should but they probably won't.
I liked how they made it seem like Rider was actually on par with Saber alter when we know she was basically nothing more than a pest that could be killed if Saber alter wasn't playing with her.
>Which of her actions where dumb? If you give me examples I could explain them to you or I might actually agree with you.
Not that anon but this is one has been hunting me.
>I just have to look at him, like I do every night at dinner, and shake my head.
>And that old man's scheme will end.
Because sakura is such a wormslut and a piece of shit