>>117373734 I watched a dubbed episode of Madoka Magica (livestream on NicoNico) and it was horrendous. Part of the issue is that Japanese honorifics don't really translate adequately. "Kaname-san" was translated as "Miss Kaname", but that's way too formal in English.
>>117373673 Because the way their made is practically designed to bring out sub-par performances and they pay VAs so little they often have to use a pseudonym to avoid issues with it being less than the minimum allowed by the SAG.
I felt like the dub for pic related had better voices in the English dub, but missed the mark in a few places. Mind you I watched the subbed episodes first and then the dub after so I might be a little biased.
Dub VAs are almost always bottom of the barrel. And also, the actors don't typically all work together in the same studio and record their lines together like they do in Japan. This makes the dialogue sound strange, unnatural and plain bad.
>>117374060 >Because the women try to hard to sound like the Japanese seiyuu and its just come off as ears iritating. >Sorry western women but you can't into moe voice. If dubs were done by Japanese voice actors who spoke English, I guess they *would* be much better.
>>117374615 No it's shit. And not only that, having met the english and Japanese voice actor for Kyouko in person, her English voice actor is an obnoxious bitch who sounds like a slut in person, while Ai is a sweethart who sounds almost like Fuuko in person.
english voice actor: >doesn't even watch the show they star in >can't remember any of their lines >just a job for some quick cash >doesn't care about respecting the fans
seiyuu: >geniune interest in their character and the story >takes their role very seriously as a career >does their best to make their fans feel welcome
>>117374991 To be fair, Dub VAs probably make pennies and really have no incentive to care much about what they are doing. Not that Japanese VAs are making bank, but I'm sure they get paid at least a decent wage.
>>117374835 This, unless it's Ghibli or something. Also different styles of acting and Americans can't deliver the silly dialogue in 80% of the stuff airing, while stuff like Cowboy Bebop and Big O or whatever is more suited to them.
While I completely agree with you, I can't help but feel bad for english VAs because they don't really get critically acclaimed unless they work in major movies or series. They also make nothing because being a VA does not pay well at all, at least compared to what being a VA pays in nipland.
>>117375400 I'm not going to look down on Dub VAs for half-assing a lot of things because they probably get paid in pennies. I don't think it's fair to expect somebody to do a good job if they don't get reasonable compensation for it.
>>117375400 They dont' care because they have no reason to care. They record their lines alone in the recording both and don't interact much with the rest of the cast. Sometimes not at all. In Japan, and on higher budget western cartoons, they record their lines with the VAs for all the characters in a scene together. The VAs have more interaction with each other and develop a feeling of camaraderie. This also leads to more lively performances as they can work off of each other's vocal cues.
>>117373673 Because low casting budget and small pool of dub actors to choose from. This is why, in comparison, the Disney dubs of the Ghibli movies are so remarkably better than the common dub. Disney has the cash, talent, and experience to create a high quality dub the same way they produce the voices for their other movies.
>>117375500 >they probably get paid in pennies I assure you they don't. They just don't have consistent work available.
They might not make as much as Japanese celebrities, but they aren't making slave wages either.
>I don't think it's fair to expect somebody to do a good job if they don't get reasonable compensation
And regardless, people don't do a shit job because they're making 50,000 a year instead of 200,000. Giving them the extra money isn't going to motivate them to actually try or suddenly get better skills. They do a shit job because they either don't have passion for what they're doing or don't have the talent/experience. And if you do a shit job on purpose because you don't think you're earning what you should be, guess what, you're never gonna go anywhere in life.
I think the only good dub that came these recent years was Tiger & Bunny but it would be better if Agnes had French accent and the TIGER & BUNNY - OVER AND OUT was left untouched or dubbed like the Japanese version.
>>117375693 That's nice and all, but people generally need more than that. Nip VAs are at least part of the process, while Murrican VAs are just accommodating this work for a foreign audience. An audience that largely prefers watching the original anyway.
Dubs with big female casts like Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon and Girls und Panzer tend to highlight the worst problems of English dubs. There's not a lot of female English voice actors doing anime, a lot of the ones they have don't have a very good range and if they do there's a decent chance they'll get bad voice directing anyway.
>>117376160 Most people aren't passionate about their jobs and many of them do an excellent job without such passion. I don't know what world you live in, but money is an excellent factor for motivating people.
>>117373673 while i dislike english subs as much as the next guy
while in the majority of the NHK english dub misaki sounds autistic this fucking part right here in the english dub still tore me to fucking pieces when I heard it It's bad in Japanese but here, It was just Misakis tone and her crying after, tore my heart right out of my fucking chest https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q68zuC6IlKs#t=61
>>117376314 I was / have been making about 20-30 cents over minimum wage for the past few years and have been able to make enough to pay my bills, rent, and college expenses without loans without any problems. Whatever they're making should be plenty, not counting passion.
>>117376248 The big problem there is that 40 year old Japanese women can still sound like squeaky 10 year olds, while 25 year old American women struggle to even sound 15 again. They need to use actual children/teenagers for those roles.
>>117376851 That's some really twisted logic you have going on there.
For the record, I am positive that most dub actors just flat out suck, but like I said, I don't fault them for doing a bad job if they are getting paid shit. Just like I don't expect fast food workers to cater to my every need.
>>117376477 She sounded pretty cute if you ask me. Dub haters can't really say shit when half of japanese voice acting for girls is annoying as fuck with how how pitched they are >OOOONNNIII-CHHAAAAANNnnnnNNnn BAAAAKKAA!!
ITT: spoiled manchild weeaboo Americans who still live with their parents try to talk about what's "fair wages" and "fair effort"
holy shit this is embarrassing.
You want to talk about people who work their fucking asses of and get paid shit? Look at Japanese animators. Dudes fucking working 600 hours of overtime in a month straight into suicide all so you can see little girls spreading their buttcheeks atop a robot.
>>117377164 >Improving and working hard is the only way to actually get paid more. That's not how reality generally works. You get paid more by making connections with the higher ups and climbing the ladder.
>>117377121 You know it's true. Don't tell me you've never been annoyed by soem genki girl fucking screaming like a fucking retard. Most dubs are shitty, but there are a lot of good ones that /a/ pretends don't exist. You guys act like all japanese voice acting is flawless when it's clearly not. You guys can't even fairly judge the quality of jap voice acting when it's jibberish to most people on /a/
>>117377184 My point is just because you're not making as much as you'd like to be doesn't mean you get to be a lazy fuckup and not try and tell yourself "oh I'll give a shit when I get another 10 grand next year".
Because there are plenty of people worse off than you who give a lot more effort than you do, and if you think that extra money is going to suddenly make you forget your lazy attitude you're delusional.
>>117377103 I think the sadder part is that 99% of these people want to be animators, but sooner rather than later as well no matter how hard they work. They will be replaced with 3D animators.
The day where more than 50% of anime are 3DCG is the day I drop it. Unless they amazingly improve and doesn't feel like 2 frames a second. I never see myself liking them in a Japanese style of animation.
>>117376851 You are hilariously naive and should have a job in management selling spew like that. Unless there is a guarantee that their hard work to be compensated, you can't reasonably expect an excellent job; maybe an okay job. That's how people operate. It's not a matter of lack of self-interest, but self-interest.
And in the end, the reality is that dubs will be passed over in favor of subs regardless.
>>117377391 You're dangerously close to projecting here.
I don't see why the existence of workaholic Japs that do a great job for shit pay means that everyone else with shit pay should also do a great job. Trust me, I am very grateful to those animators, but I would never ever want to be one of those guys even if I had the skill.
Dubs never work in any kind of medium, everything from movies to literature lose something along the way when translated, subs in watchable shit decrease the chance of degrading the material. It just doesn't work.
On the other hand, I think there are some shows where it is possible to pull it of somehow, pic related, I came across it by mistake from the underwater BD release, and it turned out to be pretty decent.
>>117378227 How bad are you at reading if not having to read subs really makes that much of a difference? Hell, I'm not even a native English speaker and I never have this problem. It's just an excuse.
>>117374991 >doesn't even watch the show they star in >can't remember any of their lines >doesn't care about respecting the fans Fuckin' really man? That kinda annoys me since I met the english dub va for Homura and she was pretty nice and at least remembered a line when my bro asked her to do one, and she at least she seemed genuinely appreciative when I complimented on her performances on some of the roles she had done.
>>117378680 >>117378755 Whether or not the story is true is irrelevant, the statement in general is nothing more than a statement that lands somewhere between speculation and anecdote.
>She was pretty nice In relation to fans? Just in general? Who cares if she was a saint or a complete cunt, doesn't really address the complaints raised.
>At least remembered a line when my bro asked her to do one I still remember a poem that I needed to recite two or so years ago and I had only really read it a handful of times while practising it, though I suppose that does address the statement "can't remember any of their lines" as an over-generalization. I'd like to expand on >>117374991 and say that it's not that they can't remember any of their lines but instead that they don't necessarily understand the significance of their lines, recognize the context of their lines, or that they simply take too many creative liberties, whether or not these liberties are authorised, and end up losing sight of the original intent.
>She seemed genuinely appreciative when I complimented on her performances on some of the roles she had done. Who the hell wouldn't be flattered? There's a difference between respecting the fans and simply accepting compliments when given and nothing else.
I'm sure you had a great chat, and I've nothing against any specific voice actors, but instead I've got issues with the system in general and how it is handled as a whole
>>117375902 The majority of dub studios are centered in Cali, which to my knowledge is a rather expensive place to live, and many dub VAs have stated that their pay from voicing dubs is pretty shit unless they go union, and even then unioners are limited on where they can find work, so ya.
>>117379183 I did, it was a somewhat short chat, but good none the less. Just kinda surprises me though that some dub VAs are like that since I met more western cartoon oriented VAs like Rob Paulsen and Phil LaMarr who imo were some really cool and down to earth guys that seem to genuinely love what they're doing. >but instead I've got issues with the system in general and how it is handled as a whole So what do you suppose can be done about it then? What needs to be changed?
Almost all dubs sound so hideous to me that I'd honestly rather watch it raw and not know what the fuck they're saying than try and stomach them. And anyone who think's it's something caused by being a 'weeaboo' is retarded, I have no trouble with voice acting in western cartoons or other media. It's just always fucking anime.
>>117381557 No they don't. Meatspace actors are worse VA's than amateurs. They've been trained to act completely differently and it shows. But you can't have real VA's in a Ghibli film, oh no, Disney wants "real actors" instead.
>>117379183 about Madoka specifically, this series of interviews with the English VAs essentially confirms what most people in this thread have been saying. It's pretty obvious that these guys don't understand or care about the series given their responses. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DhMzOA9l8c
Honestly, if the directors could've given them clear enough instructions on how to act out each scene and they followed it properly, I still wouldn't complain, but the translation was terrible and all the actresses spoke with this bullshit whisper tone in their voice bc they didn't know what they were doing.
All trolling aside, I actually think there are a few things playing against dubs being good. Almost always, the voice actors are separated from the production in a way that the original cast were not. In a decent shop, the original cast should have a clear understanding of how the character is being conveyed in the entire story arc, in the animation, and with more (and arguably more skilled) people seeing to the overall integrity of the work (like a director), they just have more support. The flip-side is that whether you straight translate/interpret the text or "localize" it (like fuck with the jokes and cultural references), I think dubbing probably takes too much responsibility for conveying what's happening, who the characters are deep down, what the subtext is... hell, i'd imagine this is just as much their arrogance, thinking their job is just soooooo important.
How much do you think you would understand of an anime if you just watched it with the volume off? How much actually needs to be said in order to give your audience that understanding?
Granted, this is partly a cultural problem too... western tv/movies just loooove to spell everything out textually, as if their audiences were morons, where, in Japan, anyhow, they seem to love leaving things unsaid... like... all the time. But to be honest, I think a japanese dub of something like Avatar would be similarly cringeworthy, if for slightly different reasons.
>Baccano >GTO >Golden Boy >Ghost Stories >Cowboy Bebop >Samurai Champloo >Afro Samurai >Space Dandy >Mushishi >Mobile Suit Gundam 08th MS Team >Black Lagoon >Abenobashi Magical Shopping Arcade >Beck >Full Metal Panic >Anything by Studio Ghibli >Summer Wars >The Girl Who Leapt Through Time >Steam Boy >Memories >Evangelion >Ouran Host Club >Shuffle >Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya >Wolf Children >FLCL >Gurren Lagann >Ghost in the Shell >Black Cat >Death Note >Monster
>>117383040 good list. Makes sense, too. Most of those series had dubs produced by large distributors and ended up being really successful in the west. I think those guys take their jobs really seriously and it shows in the product. plus Shinji and Misato made eva. Everyone else was kinda so-so in that one
Why are people saying they liked the Haruhi dub? It was god awful. Crisp Freeman as Kyon isn't THAT good, it was tolerable at best, Kozomi doesn't even sound like a human being and both Haruhi and Mikuru were TERRIBLE. Jesus christ, get the fuck out if you like that piece of shit excuse of voice acting.
This was the only character I enjoyed dubbed. He sounded like an actual crazy, psychotic person who was hellbent on killing everyone. Cagalli was alright too, but she was my highschool 2D crush back then, so I'm somewhat bias towards the quality of the VA.
Rest were terrible, especially Lacus, alongside the rest of the show itself. Never again.
>>117385107 There are some shows (like Evangelion) where you will definitely take in less information if you watch it subbed. Having two simultaneous conversations being subtitled as well as on-screen text translation at the same time is just too much to handle for a first time viewer, and that's before you can even consider looking at the visuals.
This all very opinion based but anyhow I like dubs but I am strongly in the camp of subs for shorter anime but if its an anime that has like over 100 episodes I'd rather watch it in English because its just easier to follow
>>117374119 Bebop was good for it's time, in the sense that it wasn't as awful as anything before it. But it's still shit. The english VAs still have to meet the timing of the Jap VAs so a lot of delivery sound very unnatural. Voices themselves are good, everything else is terrible.
>>117383040 I'd put Planetes on that list myself, as well as the Patlabor 1 redub. Patlabor 1's wasn't outstanding, but actually does the job and is miles better than the '90s dub. The Patlabor 2 dub used the same cast but I think the director was asleep, and the TV/OVA dubs still give me nightmares. Central Park Media, not even once.
>>117391305 Eh, I didn't really like JYB whenever he tried to come off as evil. When he was calm, he fit perfectly, but his zero voice was just...I didn't like it. Also, his nero voice in DMC4 was the best.
>>117374201 Kill la Kill wasn't too bad. The voices all pretty much fit with their Japanese counterparts, Satuski's VA was good at being Satsuki. Ryuko is edgy as fuck, but she was always edgy as fuck. The only one I have a problem with is Mako, and even then, you can tell it was just an English actor trying her best at capturing that Japanese autistic energetic girl spirit.
>Mfw the average dub VAs story of getting their first role is always reading like, 4 lines as an audition after a friend of their car washers niece or something recommends they get into voice acting and introduces them to And they always reuse the fuck out of VAs
ITT: >not wanting to read = can't read >listening to a language you don't understand for months/years = qualified and worthy opinion of its voice acting >how can people like what I don't like >guessing VA wages without credible sources >all dubs are wrong on principle because muh loss in translation
>>117374201 >Kill la Kill ... was just bad. The dub being shit was just a cherry on top. All characters in the anime are angry or confused 99% of the time, there's too much fanservice, etc. Fuck i hate kill la kill so much
I thought that Sword Art Online would've been much better if they went the Ghost Stories way or maybe put in a bunch of pop-culture references, one-liners and celebrity impressions like one of those dubs for kids shows
Hell I was surprised to hear Kyubey's english VA say she wanted to fuck her brother
>>117391367 I guess it's because I haven't seen more than a handful of contemporary dubs, so my point of reference is smaller in scope, but I thought JYB managed to adapt quite well to the role by the end of Code Geass despite some hesitation earlier on.
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