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Sometimes I wonder if people really care...
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Sometimes I wonder if people really care all that much about typesetting.
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I do

Don't you want to show up Crunchy?
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>>111570766
Is 'showing up' crunchy really worth the amount of effort?
Isn't just reading the sign as floating text just as good as any other method?
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I'll use one group over another if their typesetting, especially for signs, is better than all the others.

Shit typesetting distracts me from the show. Good typesetting does the job of translating everything that's needed and keeping me in the show.

>>111570865
No, it's not. It's shitty and distracting.
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>>111570725
I don't, just translate the necessary stuff however you want.
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>>111570865
If I wanted floating signs I'd use Horriblesubs. What's the point of fansubbing if you aren't even going to make it look better than CR and their awful typesetting?
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>>111570901
So if a group has better TS but an inferior script, either editing-wise or translation-wise, you'd choose the TS over the script? Or does it not go that far.
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>>111571054
If the group with better typesetting has a script that is so incredibly shitty that it's obviously wrong or distracting then I'm not going to use them.

But if there are two groups whose scripts are both equally acceptable, I'll always choose the group that doesn't use CR-tier floating signs.
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>>111571142
Although,

>two groups

Who am I kidding, this day and age we're lucky to have one group working on a show. No one really cares anymore.
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>>111570865
No, it's totally worth it.

CR is supposedly a professional company, so they should be replacing text with text and not floating signs.

For many series they are the only legitimate method, and they should act like it if they want anyone's money.

People like you who are willing to accept their taking the easy road are why they don't improve themselves.
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>>111571247
I'm the guy that spends hours doing this kind of stuff.
I've never really understood how people can wait days just for a script that might have better TS, when an alternative exists that maybe has slightly worse TS.
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I don't give a shit about it. It's a minor issue that can easily be fixed by learning a couple moon runes.
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Sure, but good typesetting doesn't overcome a bad translation.
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>>111570865
It makes it feel like they put love into their releases
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>>111571365
If I was so impatient that I jumped on the first available thing regardless of quality I would stream.

But I don't. I want my chinese cartoons to look good and not have huge blocky letters covering half the screen while I'm trying to watch it just to inform me that some store on the side of the road is a bakery
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>>111571450
If by love you mean DAMNIT MOCHA STOP TAKING EIGHT HOURS.
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>>111571365
Back in my day we had to walk 15 miles uphill for a translated sign. Waiting a few days is nothing.
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I have no want of anything beyond subtitles.
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>>111571522
Maybe it doesn't matter because I'm one person you don't know, but I appreciate anyone in the fansubbing scene today still doing it and putting out quality releases. I'll wait if it means something not as shitty as CR.
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>>111570725
Care all that much? I guess not really. I just want to watch anime and understand the things I can't understand from the original because I'm not Japanese.

I really appreciate it when people do it though, but I'm not going to refuse to watch a good release because another one has better typesetting or something. I love when people typeset signs and shit like that though. It looks so much better than the hovering black text overtop of what was already there like this. this sort of thing is actually distracting and I'd rather they just put a TL note if they absolutely need to translate the signage than do something like this. Going all out and actually making it look like the sign was in English to begin with is definitely the best though.
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>>111571884
But when you can't just mask a sign and have to improv, what are your limits on 'creativity' on the part of the typesetter?
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>>111571522
Get a better CPU.
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>>111571952
As long and they make it look natural and non-distracting then they can do whatever they want. I'm not asking for monumental amounts of work, but just something that looks like it could belong in the scene, instead of shitty floating block letters.

If you ever watch the HS release of Haikyuu, you'll know what not to do. They have floating signs everywhere, and signs that float in the air long after the actual sign in the anime is gone.
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I'd love to learn more.
But I have a toaster and I don't think my computer can run AFX.
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>>111570725
>>111570865
>>111571054
>>111571365
>>111571522
I for one think it's worth it and I really really appreciate what you do. Really, thanks.
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I don't care about TS. I force all subs to yellow Arial anyway for that authentic bootleg feel (and because it's easier to read).
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>>111572161
I don't even have AFX downloaded, and I can run mocha on this really old dell.
And for a good amount of movement you don't even need it.
I've TS'd a good amount of shows when I had to work on a toaster. And while very annoying it's still very possible.
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>>111570725
>Sometimes I wonder if people really care all that much about typesetting
People care
a lot.

I chose Evetaku subs for archiving kyousougige exclusively because they had top-tier TS
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>>111572435
This is what I hate, subbing miscellaneous stuff that is not necessary. You should focus on e-mails or letters that can be centric to the plot or signs that indicate the direction they are going if traveling. It will save you so much time overall.
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>>111572435
>>111572754
THIS
While it's nice to have subs on everything, if it's too much you can skip the useless shit.
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>>111572754
>This is what I hate, subbing miscellaneous stuff that is not necessary.
It's possible that it is relevant.
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I don't really care all that much. But I'm learning moon anyway. All I want is an accurate translation that isn't overly liberal, to use as a visual queue and give me an idea of what an unknown word might mean. This usually means crunchy roll, sadly.
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>>111572941
>This usually means crunchy roll, sadly.
really now
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>>111573041
Sub groups edit the already existing CR script most of the time, localizing it and pretend they're writers and change entire sentences to something completely different because it "flows better".
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>>111572754
These sets of signs took zero effort, but the TL TL'd them so I figured I'd include them somehow.

Because I can't think of anything else to do with them in this case, do you think it'd be better to just not include this set?
If I had done this set it some way that made it much better (say magically masking it and placing it there) and it was just as zero effort, would you still not like misc signs TS'd?
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>>111573134
>Sub groups edit the already existing CR script most of the time, localizing it and pretend they're writers
I think you're grouping all of them unfairly.

>change entire sentences to something completely different because it "flows better"
If it can achieve the original meaning in a better way, as well as sounding natural by English standards, why not?
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>>111573134
I dislike when sub groups do an original TL over just editing CR.

Good example A-K's Barakamon. CR is perfectly strong enough, it's a waste to do an original for this.
Is being first before CR really that important?
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>>111573370
>Is being first before CR really that important?
For some, maybe. I doubt that's the case because not many groups do speed subs.
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>>111573370
Which is why if you don't care about typesetting, there's no reason to wait for fansubs and fansubs might as well just die.
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>>111573243
see >>111572823

>>111573498
>fansubs might as well just die
Don't say such things ;__;
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I timed Saki before, should've done that.
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>>111573243
I have no objections to any signs being TL'd if it doesn't overly slow down production and doesn't get in the way.

Using it as an example again, the HS release of Haikyuu has TONS of useless sign TLs, like translating the name of the school on Jerseys that are either background characters or have already been introduced. That's too much and gets in the way.

But things like the lamps, that looks fine, provides some translation that some people might appreciate, and you said it doesn't take much more time. I see no issue with that.
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>>111572754
>>111574771
Fuck you. No TL is a useless TL.
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>>111574989
pretty sure I was in favor of TLing?
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>>111574989
>translate a sign that has already been translated
9mm therapy. Apply directly to forehead.
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Is it hard to learn to typeset and whatnot well?
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>>111570725
Do you think any typesetters paid for a Mocha Pro license? Only $1500 per computer!
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>>111576104
http://unanimated.xtreemhost.com/ts/index.htm
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>>111570901
How good is this typesetting?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KysL-S0i_M
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>>111571247
>CR is supposedly a professional company, so they should be replacing text with text and not floating signs.
Professionals don't do that.
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>>111571247
>CR is supposedly a professional company, so they should be replacing text with text and not floating signs.
Advanced typesetting like what fansubs do is the unprofessional one here.

If you watch a subtitled foreign film they'll do very little "typesetting" and sign translations are just floating text.
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>>111576206
That is impressive typesetting
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>>111571247
>CR is supposedly a professional company, so they should be replacing text with text and not floating signs.
I take it you never watch any actual professional subtitles.
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Typesetting is useful, sure. Typesetting Hanayamata probably isn't since there's already a pretty fast group doing it though.
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>>111576104
Not really. It's hella tedious

>>111576162
I've never heard of anyone paying for it.

>>111576567
I'm only doing it as a favor.
It's not me making it slow so I don't mind.
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>>111576279
Why are professionals so unprofessional?
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>>111576891
Profits. Get film, toss some text on it, push it out as fast as you can! Why hire one or two additional people to make it look nice? They'll just eat into the revenue.
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>>111576891
It's kind of my point.
Not enough people care to make it worthwhile for anyone to invest in a way to do something as complex on .ass that can be decoded on a DvD player.
I've yet to see anyone do something cool with SUP, though maybe it is possible.
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>>111576891
>>111577004
In reality it's considered unprofessional to alter what's shown on the screen since you are modifying the original work when that's not the purpose of the subtitles.
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>>111577159
But you're modifying the original work when you slap text anywhere onto the screen. Having the text float and be out of place is just plain terrible.
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>>111577240
That's a pretty niche want, actually.
It's as weird as anime people actually using filtering in their encodes. A lot of other 'scenes' consider that horrible practice.
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>>111577341
The average anime source is much shittier than your average live action source, so it makes sense.
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Everytime i see uncentered text, dirt left in bubbles or text typeset over the japanese letters without bothering to clean them i cringe
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>>111577240
What if in cases where you're supposed to read the text off the screen (like when the character is pointing at a computer screen)?
Wouldn't it be much neater to just replace the text on the screen, than to pour a wall of text somewhere else?
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>>111578196
Why is that 176KB?
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I hate typesetting. It's a shitty gimmick and ruins the integrity of the original anime. Karaoke is particlarly obstructive.
I prefer to use my own styles to keep subs as minimalistic as possible
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>>111578494
>>>/g/
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>>111570865
In many anime and other media the producers will actually put effort into making signs in a local language of the scene instead of the language of the production only to provide a floating translation themselves.
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>>111578442

Because mangareader compresses their shit so much you see artifacts all over the pictures
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ITT Autismus Maximus
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>>111578645
I've seen like two examples of that ever.
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I care a lot
I sometimes feel like typesetters are the unsung heroes of fansubbing. I guess that's because the difference between good enough typesetting and great typesetting isn't as obvious as other things.
Masking like this, for example; you'd easily miss it if you blinked, but when you notice it you realize how much work went into the release and it's reassuring to know that the people who worked on it were so passionate.
I don't know if autistic typesetting is very important for airing stuff but in my opinion it is essential when archiving.
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I couldn't give two fucks.

Floating text is fine.
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>>111570725
>typesetting.
Font styling
You're not setting type, you're not publishing a fucking newspaper.
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>>111578423
Huh? That's what I said. Text that's out of place with the original text placement, like the usual "professional" subtitles, distorts the original work.
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>>111579470
That's not masking, that's clipping.
Masking would be if he had masked (covered) the jap letters and separated the english letters onto those signs.

>>111579574
I can use \fsp to adjust kerning, and manually split lines for more direction control over vertical spacing.
I can modify the blur of the text, the color, even over time.
Using layering I can adjust overlap, using clips I can adjust the degree of visibility any line might have.
And that's all just in aegisub. If I move into AI I can do much more and still have you never know I went there.
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>>111570725
I love it, and I'll go with UTW at every chance I get. If the nips get to sing along with the opening so should I
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>>111579901
Oh yeah I always mix the two.
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>>111571522
>MOCHA
>hours
>not seconds

What is this 2002?
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>>111579911
>and I'll go with UTW at every chance I get
So basically never again.
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Typesetters are cancer. Nobody needed a karaoke line in Japanese script yet the added it anyway just to show off their shitty skills.
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>>111570725
Yes, becuase if you use shit font or color on the subs the printer/graphic designer in me goes into a fucking rage and then I can't watch the show, since shit type setting.
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>>111580752
I don't think you understand the purpose of a typesetter.
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>>111581451
To obstruct as much of the screen as possible with bouncing, color changing kanji for an insert song.
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>>111570725
Typesetting is important. I don't know how much is their work, but they are clearly necessary.
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Who doesn't love it when their RSS torrent client downloads the same episode a second time just because somebody forgot to mux one font.
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>>111581544

You act like you don't skip ops/eds after seeing them once
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>>111570725
i don't.
it's just fansubber wanking.
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>>111581786
Insert songs aren't part of the op/ed, that's why they're insert songs. I can't imagine how anybody would want to sing along with a song he hears the first time while important characters are talking. Most of the time the whole lyrics are irrelevant and translating them just distracts from the actual dialog.
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>>111581544
kfx isn't even a typesetter's job.
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>>111577159
That's bullshit. In reality the only reason advanced typesetting like this is virtually nonexistent is because of shitty technical support for them. The masses' toasters (TVs, set top boxes, shitty old computers running VLC, etc) can't deal with complex typesetting, so professionals that market to the masses can't really use them.

Crunchyroll on the other hand couldn't use them even if they wanted to (they don't want to because it's extra effort, though) because they're a streaming site, and streaming players have shitty subtitle support.

Anyway, there's no noble ideology to preserve the original work with commercial subbing. It's just a very cheap alternative for dubbing, which definitely doesn't preserve the original work.
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>>111570865
Stuff like this fucks up my immersion because then I wonder why the hell there would be an English sign in a Japanese school.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJMlRYK-9vE
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>>111582398
I can't change that, the japs do it themselves.

'The' isn't even from me. It's a studio sign.
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>>111576206
They're going way overboard. My eyes are jumping around corner to corner and I can barely even read them
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