Okay /3/ what the fuck.
Gnomon and their Modeling and Texturing course DOES NOT EVEN TOUCH Maya until after a year of 2D.
Should I bother learning Maya if my 2D sucks? Should I wait until my 2D is sufficient before beginning? Im only 3 weeks into learning and want to know if learning out of order.
I know learning 2d is a good thing, not denying that, just wondering if I should learn my 2D fundamentals before starting 3D.
I guess my worry is I don't want to build the second floor of the house before the first is finished you know?
haha, how fucking edgy is their campus? I'm surprised they don't give you a leather trenchcoat as their school uniform
My local school tried to replicate the gnomon course (3 years with the first year being 2D only, including 2D animation)
I made minimal efforts, just enough to get passing grades, and spent the rest of the time in Maya.
I'm in the second year now and far ahead in all 3D classes. The first year is a fucking joke.
you're an idiot.
they have 2 programs.
3-year and 2-year program
the 3-year program is 1 year of basic training of 2D and general art
if you're 2D skills are good you go stright to the 2 year program. and get into the 3D and whatever.
and these "self thought" retards saying education is a waste of money such as these autist here
will spend the next 5-8 years of thair lives "self training" by watching 360p tutorials on youtube and begging employers to give them a job. because lets be honest. who the fuck is gonna trust thair project with someone that learned from tutorials.
Gnomon is probably the best VFX school in the world with the best reputation.
graduating from gnomon is almost a guarantees you a job in and a career in the industry.
i bet this guy doesn't even have a job, just sits in his moms basement with his fedora on making anime characters for his indie RPG game about a american exchange student in japan that falls in love with a Japanese girl as he grips his wifu pillow and sips his monster energy drink and browses /3/
>Should I bother learning Maya if my 2D sucks?
>im only 3 weeks into learning and want to know if learning out of order.
Let me get this straight. your 2D skills suck and you're only 3 weeks into learning 3D so your 3D skills suck and you want to go to gnomon...
wtf makes you think you're gonna get accepted with no skill.
gnomon doesn't start you off from 0. they want you to be intermediate at everything before you start. they take your skills and make it industry ready so you can go straight to working on AAA games and Hollywood movies. not teach you how to draw a line or to resize a box
pic related. one of the people that deals with enrollment. you're gonna be one of thous "questionable" portfolios. do you even know zbrush, cuz they require you to be familiar with zbrush and sculpting
I just hate self pretentious "self thought" scrub lords who make fun of education yet they are unemployed or are working on their "indie game" bu never have anything to show for it.
when i was working at 343 i was given the task to go threw portfolios and every time id see "self thought" or "elf trained" it went straight into the garbage. because im not gonna trust the company money and the quality of the work on some guys ability to teach himself. even if he had some education at some shady school no one ever heard of it went into the garbage.
i worked at 4 studios since 2009 and from experience, gnomon students got the most love.
>I guess my worry is I don't want to build the second floor of the house before the first is finished you know?
Do what's fun faggot.
There's no denying you'll be better at 3D if you do 2D first / have good core 2D skills, but it's not uncommon for 3D artists to be really shit 2D artists and just learn enough of the 2D concepts as they go along (and end up better at 2D along the way).
They're complimentary honestly; it can be pretty hard to conceptualize in 3D when you're trying to 2D, and doing some 3D can really help with that, so just do both or do whatever works, don't worry so much.
#1 pro tip is to save EVERYTHING you do, even if you just made a bunch of shitty rendered garbage to test shaders, or scribbled some crap to try out brushes, save that shit to a folder (and ideally a dropbox or something), otherwise you'll never keep anything and you'll feel like you haven't been making progress
Relax bro, those people are just memeing.
There's been other threads where people have pointed out valid criticism though about Gnomon specifically (I don't actually remember what it was because it was pretty small potatoes).
>trying to get into gnomon by not knowing shit about 2D or 3D and complaining that 1 year is basic classes
thats like trying to trying to get into med school with 1.3 GPA
> you will be a concept artist at best
implying being a concept artist isnt top-tier
who needs the best school in the world when you got 12 year olds on /3/ and youtube to learn from :^)
Career in the VFX industry.
Paid per project means the number of hours you have to put in literally mean you're working for less than minimum wage.
VFX studio that hired you declares bankruptcy as soon as the project is finished and long before they've come close to paying you what you were promised.
Jews who owned the studio just set up another shop and repeat the process on the next bunch of saps.
Lifetime of debt from school to pay off. Shit pay from work. Schools cranking out more grads than there are jobs for.
No thanks. I'd rather just learn on my own, work on my own projects and work as a barista for shit pay. At least I haven't gotten to the point where I hate 3D and everything associated with it and the granola heads that come into our cafe will go down on your dick with no prompting as long as you tell them your sperm is gluten free.
People don't seem to appreciate how nice it is to live debt free and have lots of free time.
That's right, goy, anyone can become a CG artist if they pay enough shekels.
>Jews who owned the studio just set up another shop and repeat the process on the next bunch of saps.
>Lifetime of debt from school to pay off. Shit pay from work. Schools cranking out more grads than there are jobs for.
gnomon has a 94% placement rating.
i have 3 friends on facebook that graduated from gnomon and all of them are working at top tier studios making 75k+ a year.
>No thanks. I'd rather just learn on my own, work on my own projects and work as a barista for shit pay
what have you produce on your own this past, what 2-8 years? literally everyone who says they are self thought working on their own projects are either making shitty models for 2nd life or squid. or working on some garbage anime game on unity.
>People don't seem to appreciate how nice it is to live debt free and have lots of free time.
gnomon is very cheep compared to any other VFX CG schools that offer less. i have friends who went to SVA, and dropped out after a year or two because they were learning nothing and paying 60k a year for it. compared to gnomon which is 24k with financial assistance about 15k (2 year program leaves you with near 30-35k debt)
minimum pay for a 3D artist in the US is 45-65k according to glassdoor and slavery.com, so you'll have no problem paying your debt in 1 year or less if you're not a pleb.
play a little game, pull up some names or portfolios from few years ago from gnomon youtube page/site since they love to promote their students so much. than look them up and see where they are right now. 90%+ are in good places while you're here on /3/ shitposting. im shitposting cuz i make my money from turbsosquid. wtf you doing?
its stable if you make basic stuff that people will always need like furniture, cars and buildings.
tho the market for well made robots, monsters and creatures is slim, no one does it. but ive seen a monster that was sold 5 times for 5000$ and a robot-suit sold 3 times for 15,000$ so if you specialist in that, and if you rig/texture it and put it up for a fair amount you could make some $$$
wtf you talking about. gnomon dvds are top tier.
most of them are advanced/master level though
if i had to rank tutorial survices id say
lynda = garbage
digital tutors = good
eat 3d / gnomon = best
you just get the company name and most are advertisement studios or interior design.
unlike the movie industry of VFX that is on shaky grounds, video game industry's is very steady, to make good looking games you need instudio artists to constany communicate with everyone there, so most studios dont buy assets because they need it costume made to 1. match the art style 2. be costume. since the players will be examine it closely. and it isn't in like 1 frame and done.
btw, you know the woman in that turorial isnt a woman, shes use to be a dude
Ya I shouldn't have said all, but the quality is slipping I think.
Not great. Even the program makers tutorials are better.
Katon Callaway's tut was better and cheaper.
Again seen better.
I found this one equally good and it's free
Yeah Scott Spenser I have all his books. I hope pol doesn't find out heh.
yea. i found the first 2 to be mediocre. but they looked like beginner level tutorials so there wasnt much i was expecting. I found their world machine DVD grate. the guy went threw every single type of environment and how you can create it. i like their creature conception DVDs especially the one with nevil page. and they got some really got good hard surface stuff too.
>VFX studio that hired you declares bankruptcy as soon as the project is finished and long before they've come close to paying you what you were promised.
yes because its so easy to declare bankruptcy, shut down your studio and open it back up at a different location from skratch and "scam" new artists and not pay them.
the artists get paid fine. its the studio that gets fucked by other studios that employ them to do VFX. the main reason why they go bankrupt IS BECAUSE they pay the artists more than they get payed from the studio that higered them causing the company to go bankrupt. they have to pay their artists out of their pocket to finish the project.
i only got in because i was a 18 year old kid from a town of 3000 people that had a better handle on 3d than some people already at the school. i did know a ton about photoshop, c4d, and graphic design. im not sure that they knew i couldnt draw though since i only focused on my strengths in the demo i sent them.
if i could go back i probably would have waited a few months and taken a ton of drawing classes before applying. its been extremely rough for me since i have to play catch-up on anatomy, gesture, sculpting, composition and you know... time management.
i used to play games a lot, since gnomon. i get to play maybe a game of league here and there. like 3 a week. im either in class, or working on homework at minimum 80 hours a week. then when people at gnomon decide to take a break and go out for the night I cant go out with them since they all go to bars and im not old enough to go in
financial aid gives you 7,000 per year for free (no pay backs) and 12,000 as a loan (no interests) nd i believe you don't have to pay that back untill you're making 40k+ or after the age of 30, not sure. leaving you a very small amount of loan from a bank.
>every graduate finds work
the site says 94% of them do. and so far. as i played the little game here >>510475
find student reels from 2-3 years ago and look them up and see what they been doing since graduation. (since they only upload the work of current students)
i haven't found a failure yet, they're all in high places. 1 guy graduated in 2011 and has worked on 7 movies already.
in concision. if you want your foot in to the industry. gnomon is a good place to go. the only problem i have with this thread is people saying its a waste of time and that jews are out to get your money and scam you
I think some people are taking it as a personal insult, as "if you haven't been to gnomon, you're no good" -- when as you say, it's an intensive boot camp for a very specific niche industry.
i didn't say that. other guy did.
but being self thought is a disadvantage in the industry. as specially if you're starting out. its struggle city. ik cuz i was one of them. company's dont want to risk thair money on your ability to teach yourself. you might have a good portfolio and you show and be like "hurr idk how to model tank, i didnt watch a tutorial on it"
since gnomon is a famous school. they know if you made it threw the 2-3 years, you been fucked in the ass hard enough to make anything
Not even a new name. Company my boyfriend's company does business with went bankrupt owing him over 40k. They had over 6 million in debt to their creditors and suppliers. At the end of it my boyfriend ended up getting less than $3000 of the over 40k they owed him. 3 months later the company was back up and running, same owners, same name.
Apparently if you're really rich you can make a lot of money by going bankrupt.
not saying that if you havnt gone to gnomon you arnt any good, its just the fact that gnomon students are hired for non-ground level positions because of their skill, work ethic, time management, and ability to master new software quickly.
if somebody has better skill than a gnomon student, they would most likely get the job no doubt. but most self taught on /3/ expecially, lie in the turbosquid shitty model range.
hard surface 2 class, first day. ( the teacher is halarious )
>get ready to model some serious shit, i dont want to see another ferarri or lamborghini, i swear ill blow my brains out if somebody does another one of those fucking things. model something weird, something that people will remember.
he pushed the best out of us. if we came in, worked 110%, mastered everything he taught us the last class, he would give you a task that would blow your mind. you wouldnt think it was possible to finish ALL THAT in one week. but you would put in the extra time, seek the help from upper classmates to finish your project.
one of the kids in our class was so far ahead he had to model the engine and everthing inside the hood for the last 2 weeks of class.
> mind we have 6 other classes besides just that one
the teachers are like our adopted parents for 2 years, we hang out with them, we are around them all day, they bring us food ( sometimes they will just buy the class pizza ). its so gratifying at the end of the term to see how impressed with everything you have done. they basically watch you "grow up" as an artist infront of their eyes. they feel responsible for you. if you fuck up, they are there to sit down with you 1 on 1 to figure out what you need help with and where they can improve as a teacher to have you understand more the first time they show you.
how close is the school as a community. because when i was in college (not gnomon) no one talked to anyone, the second the bell rings every dipped. you'll be lucky to make 1 friend in that class the entire semester. and no im not autistic. no one talked to anyone. i think its the NYC attitude cuz it was the same in highschool/middel school. id watch movies were the bell would ring and everyone would hang outside but in my school, bell rings "fuck you" everyone is OUT
How much are you being paid to spout all this nonsense?
>they buy us pizza
Well shit, for 30k annual American education, it's the least they can do. Fucking fool.
>sit down with you 1 on 1
You're talking like a commercial now, man. Might as well be like one of those niggers on the Everest commercials. WATCHOO DOIN RITE NOW MANIGGA CALL EVEREST AN SHEEIT DEY KNOW HOW IT IS MANIGGA DEY HOOK YO AZ UP WID DE SKEELZ HOW TO DO THANGS NAWAAMEAN NIGGA?
>but you would put in the extra time, seek the help from upper classmates to finish your project.
I hope you'll enjoy doing unpaid crunch times in the industry, because that's what they're training you for. Good goy.
>Well shit, for 30k annual American education, it's the least they can do. Fucking fool.
its not like that 30k goes to anything, not the 6+ teachers that you have every term that they have to pay an ass load for them to come in after they have already left their job for the day. or the events they set up for studios to come in and show a breakdown of their whole movie with a gallery and sitdown with a ton of leads and supervisors from the movie, or the extreemly expensive sofware they have to put on over a hundred computers, or the fees of the building and upkeep. what about he movie screenings where they rent out a theater that is free for students to come and watch a movie before it is premiered.
its a really nice gesture for a teacher to spend their money. not the schools money. their money, that they dont have to give any of it to you, since they dont owe you anything besides teaching you what was described.
why are you such a terrible person?
>sit down with you 1 on 1
sorry your teachers didnt care about you, maybe its because you are such a piece of shit
>I hope you'll enjoy doing unpaid crunch times in the industry, because that's what they're training you for. Good goy.
why are you on /3/ again?
The fact these guys are turning up at gnomon mean they don't make enough and try to scrape up some extra cash by teaching most likely.
A high-end job in VFX doesn't allow a regular second job, it's non stop overtime when a production starts.
>extremely expensive software
Either they use dedicated school licenses which are cheap as fuck or they are just retards wasting your money.
>rent out a theater to watch movie before premiere
>The fact these guys are turning up at gnomon mean they don't make enough
they dont get to choose to come to gnomon because they arnt making money, the teachers we have are definatly making enough showing up in ferarris and supped up muscle cars. its a big deal to be asked to become a teacher at gnomon. they usually only have 1 or maybe 2 classes at the most a week. and the majority of classes are held on the weekend or late at night. i also want to point out that the teachers they ask to teach are leads at the biggest studios, so there isnt an argument here really.
>Either they use dedicated school licenses which are cheap as fuck or they are just retards wasting your money.
gnomon isnt accredited as a school ( though they are almost at the end of that processes) and dont get school licenses. they have to buy the full version, also. some software that we use dont have academic or student licenses. we need float licenses not ones locked to each computer. since gnomon is well known as a school but isnt accredited, the software makers may let them buy academic, but im going to say thats a long shot
>the teachers we have are definatly making enough showing up in ferarris and supped up muscle cars
In other words, they are doing badly enough to need a second job because they are shallow retards who waste money on stupid shit.
> its a big deal to be asked to become a teacher at gnomon.
Is that what they told you? Well I'm sure they wouldn't just blatantly lie to you... right?
>and the majority of classes are held on the weekend or late at night.
They sure must love eager young minds if they're wasting their weekends to do part time gigs at gnome academy. Either that, or they're desperate for money.
>gnomon isnt accredited as a school
Wikipedia says it's accredited, but if it isn't, you're an absolute retard for pouring money into an unaccredited school.
Everything about this thread and the way you guys post sounds like a commercial. Are you sure you're not a shill?
>the teachers we have are definatly making enough showing up in ferarris and supped up muscle cars
Ah that's what they spend your money on. Thanks for letting me know.
> they have to buy the full version, also. some software that we use dont have academic or student licenses. we need float licenses not ones locked to each computer
Float licences why? You have a classroom with fixed pc's you moron.
I'm literally kek'd imagining you guys constantly de-activating your license so the guy next to you can use it for 10 minutes.
If you don't see how it's not retarded I guess you're a lost case.
share the theater with common folk instead of spending all the budget on retarded bullshit that's of NO benefit to your education in any imaginable way except for feeling like you're in some secret elite cinematography club
>The fact these guys are turning up at gnomon mean they don't make enough and try to scrape up some extra cash by teaching most
Nevi Page and Glenn Hetrick both thought at gnomon for few semesters. and both of them are on the advisory board at gnomon. they make over 6 figures on their regular job. highly doubt they needed extra teaching money.
>Either they use dedicated school licenses which are cheap as fuck or they are just retards wasting your money
Pixologic sponsors gnomon. they actually did a thing on the TV show Face Off and they sent in gnomon students to do the alien designs on zbrush.
Gnomon is #1 on autodesks best schools list.
>Wikipedia says it's accredited, but if it isn't, you're an absolute retard for pouring money into an unaccredited school.
its a .edu website, you can get financial aid from the govermant for gnomon, its a legit school
So yea. they're using free student versions and and the teachers are broke and need money. even tho the current texture painting professor is the art director at riot games who even gathered his crew and brought them to gnomon to talk about importance of 2D in 3D
P.S. ITT: people who never went to gnomon and most likely dont have a job telling you that gnmon is bad.
>they sent in gnomon students to do the alien designs on zbrush.
whats funny faggot
the whole premise of the TV show is creature design
Look I'm going to be sensible with you because I like this board.
I'm convinced Gnomon is actually a pretty good school and a great opportunity to get into the industry. No doubt.
But. It's expensive as fuck. You should have reasonable suspicion towards that, that's actually THE reason why /3/ likes taking the shit out of Gnomon.
Teachers showing up in Ferraris? Buying a whole class pizza? Renting out a theater?
Imagine how that comes across. Any money spend not on improving your education should be regarded as a waste of money.
You defend Gnomon but you come up with all the wrong reasons.
Alien design is not something to be proud off. It's literally what everyone does when touching Zbrush for the first time.
>Randomly sculpt a blobmonster
>Oh well let's call it an alien
Gnomon is good, but they're going haywire on their budget.
I'm 3rd year student and I pay 1900 a year and I still think it's too much.
Be suspicious anon
like i said in another comment. gnomon is really cheap compared to any other art school or any other college that offers less. i know people right now in art schools learning 3D animation and graphic design paying 45k-55k a year (thats 2-3 year tuition of gnomon).
SVA art academy and Lehman (just naming some school that i know people in)
idk about them renting out a theater but ik they have a theater thing on campus that they invite people to go over different topics.
they live stream/record it for free for everyone to watch. here http://livestream.com/gnomon
and for the professors driving Ferrari and shit, idk and idc about it. if my community college 3D animation professor who knew nothing about 3D animation other than baby level basics that he probbly learned from a youtube tutorial was making 110k a year when our tuition was 4000$ a year im not surprised they can afford a Ferrari.
especially seeing as they have 2 jobs. since you cant be a out of touch/ out of work artist to teach at gnomon, you are required to be working at a studio as you teach.
i know its a mute point, but we just got the .edu website within the last few months. and they cant give international students school visas for longer then a year. and many of the teachers dont have degrees, which means when they do become fully accredited thoes teachers will have to leave im pretty sure. they also cant give out degrees yet
they had the .edu site when i first found out about the school 3 years ago.
idk about the international thing but ik its a pain in the ass to be international. they require you to show a recipt from your bank with like 60k in it or you cant go (its a safety net for you and them to be sure you wont end up being homless while in school)
gnomon is technically a trade school not a college. so the best they can give out is a certificate. same way you don't get a degree for learning how to fix a car
the only way they can give out real degrees is when they start offering more classes and required bullshit like English classes, math, and sociology and other useless and pointless garbage colleges make you take. which is why colleges cost so much more than gnomon. they just teach you want you need to know. when i was taking graphic design i had to take biology and cut a pig. wtf. that class cost me 1,500 and for what? i'll never know
i never said i want to go to gnomon you faggots. i wanted to structure my personal learning path similar to an established curriculum, and since gnomon is a reputable institution i figured I would use their 3 Year Program as a base.
He's going to know because in ops post he lists the curriculum in a fair amount of detail. Whether or not he can apply himself to maintain a similar pace or quality is another matter entirely.
All I hear from most of you is that school is a rip, it ain't unless you went to a shitty school. Gnomon is great, I fucking feel intimidated by the students. You should to if not more so if you're self taught, you're being held up to their standards.
Gnomon has teachers come in that are willing because they are teaching a next generation of artist. Basically teaching everyone what they figured out so we don't have to. What happens if they're no teachers to hand down knowledge? You'd have a bunch of fucknuts that learn from tutorials who think they're superior.
"Anon came from gnomon? Cool he meets our standards, no need for art test, give a day to show him the ropes and put him on project"
Yes, it looks good on a resume if you went to a renowned school. You make connections in school. You develop habits in school, there's deadlines. Face it, this is a digital craft. You can learn welding online with your own tools; but nothing beats being formally taught.
I went to Academy of Art, crap shoot in their programs; since they accept anybody you'd have a spectrum of students. Teachers do care, if you put the time and effort, you'll get your moneys worth. I digress that our teachers are basically people who left the industry because the grind is too much, or are just taking a break. They also teach you traditional art as well. As I said earlier, the shitters drop out within the 2nd year, every fall was interesting, you'd have your characters(ever watch the foam video? You know the one), usually at towards the end you'd be classed up with normal people come junior senior year.
If I were to compare schools, my school helps you bake a cake, Gnomon helps you bake a cake and put icing and decorative sparklers on it.
Really am just fucking tired of School vs Self Taught. If you got the dosh and the gut to live in LA, then go to gnomon. You'll end up doing more than I and most people on /3/ will end up accomplishing.
you basically are paying your way into a school to network your ass into a real job - that's your first connection.
You can be self taught, but you won't get the heads up or scoops of who is looking - typically word of mouth if you have someone already inside to recommend you if your "self-taught" is good enough in most places being competent to keep up. The only sucky thing with saying "self-taught" is no related job or actual work experience to show for (and not talking freelancing online - but actually working with people).
The consensus about Gnomon students isnt like that, actually. Gnomonfags are known for getting their hands held to such a degree that their teachers literally have done 50% of the project for them and made all the important decisions.
so critiques and direction are doing 50% of the work. i thought that going to school was to learn from people. not just do everything by yourself. thats called self taught.
teachers will show us what we need to work on, and we will discuss important decisions with them. im unsure what you think a job is going to be like, because somebody will be making almost all of the decisions for you depending on the studio.
just yesterday in class we submitted our photos we were going to be recreating in 3d for a lighting and texturing class. im doing a sushi plate still life. after class i went to my teacher and i asked him to give me some advice on what would be the best way to tackle the rice, vector displacement, regular displacement, particle simulation or whatever. he pulled up some of the work he had done in the past and showed me his process.
i now know what process will be the most efficient with some really great results.
>ITT: people that arnt good enough to have gone to gnomon have an issue with it
not really. because the best part of gnomon is all the students get to make what they want to make as long as it fals under the theme of the lesson. everyone doesnt get 1 concept art and everyone has to make the same thing.
btw. im planning to go to gnomon. i just sent in my sample portfolio and they said im a good fit to start my education but they asked me to include more diversity in my portfolio so im gonna sculpt some black people. JK they want to see other art forms.
going to gnomon is gonna be a big decision for me. gonna have to move from NYC to LA and get a lot to pay for it. I honestly think its a good idea. i wanted to do 3D since i was like 11. and its like the only thing i care about and are good at. the fact i been self teaching myself the past 2 years and haven't gotten board of gave up yet is a miracle if you knew me irl.
i talk to a guy on skype who went to gnomon. his first job was at naughty dog. thats impressive
>teachers will show us what we NEED to work on, and they will MAKE important decisions with them which they will then GRADE us on. im unsure what you think a job is going to be like, because SOMEBODY, FOR THE LUV OF JEEBUS will be making almost ALL of the decisions for you depending on the STUDio.
actually its pretty high.
a lot of people apply per semester and only like 20 people get in.
as shown in this picture >>510299
the person in that picture is one of the people that deals with enrollment.
> so many dream-crush emails and phone calls
i think like good 50% of the students are woman. and what what i see they're all Asian... good if you got yellow fever or whatever.
and from the looks of their class photos they look like tumblr SJW femanists.
1. make connections and friends and deal with their SJW rents about the patriarchy and white privilege
2. keep your head down, do your work, talk to no one. and make no connections
just so everybody knows, the percentage of girls are over 50% and id say theres only like maybe 5 at the most sjw girls ( and its very slight, they can have normal conversations and respect your views on topics without spaghetting everywhere ).